Interior LED lights December 22, 2019, 11:58:28 am Our 2015 TK has the LED interior lights, and some are getting a bit flaky -- individual LEDs blinking out on one, a row of them doing the same on another one, and the overhead light in the kitchen being finicky about whether it wants to turn on at all.I have not yet attempted to disassemble them to see if the arrays are replaceable or what type they need, and am hoping someone who has already dealt with this can offer some advice.
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #1 – December 23, 2019, 10:10:53 am Enclosed is a image of the 'double' led lights. I'm guessing the 'singles' have the same led light board. I believe the 906/921 is the connection type number. 906/921 SMD LED Bulb - Wedge Base - 120 Degree - 175 Lumens - Warm White...I have not used this vendor. It was just a web search.glen
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #2 – December 23, 2019, 02:05:36 pm If you're looking for a supplier of LED lights, strips, bulbs, etc. you probably cannot find a better one than:M4 LED ProductsI bought all of my LEDs from them and was well pleased. 3 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #3 – December 23, 2019, 06:00:45 pm I am surprised that leds are not lasting that long and that after 4-5 years you are having some go out.I thought leds lasted 10+ years, especially when not used that often (I am thinking you do not have your led lights on 24 hours a day or even likely 8 hours a day).Taking a quick look online, regular led lightbulbs say they designed to last over 20 years.Is there something different with these ones that are only 5 or so years old?Jane
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #4 – December 23, 2019, 06:46:10 pm Hi Jane, "Is there something different with these ones that are only 5 or so years old?" in a word Yes. Sometimes the design pushes way more current through the chips than they are designed for. Other times the manufacturers buy not the best quality chips, knowing that some will fail, but you have lots of spare chips in an array of 48 or so' In my experience the failures are often the solder joints that connect each chip (di, singular of dice) into the circuit. The arrays often get exposed to high storage temperatures in the ceiling of RV's. When powered up they also heat up. Not as bad as incandescent, but still enough to expand and contract on a daily or use cycle. This stresses the ceramic substrates commonly used, and the soldered connections. Early adopters, or new manufacturers of such lights often don't have the time to actually test their products for years. A stable company and a good warranty is often the best stopgap. As Steve said, I've had excellent experiences with M4 and SuperbrightLeds. Camping world sold some Nighthawk strip lights to me and refunded money on one strip that only lasted about 2 weeks without any quibbling. 3 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #5 – December 23, 2019, 11:29:00 pm I'll give a thumbs up for M4 LED products too. Swapped out all of my incandescent bulbs in my LD. Solid products and good service.Bob 2 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #6 – December 25, 2019, 05:02:16 am Are the lights factory installed? If so did they have a bad batch? I think some of the early ones were prone to the symptoms you describe. The other thing to think about, hows the voltage? Are your bulbs replaceable or do you have to change the whole fixture? Just about all of today's LED bulbs are better than even 3 year old bulbs.Jon
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #7 – December 25, 2019, 09:27:32 am Factory installed, voltage is fine.I don't know if the arrays are replaceable, as I haven't yet tried to disassemble them.
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #8 – December 25, 2019, 09:29:54 am Quote from: RonB - December 23, 2019, 06:46:10 pmHi Jane, "Is there something different with these ones that are only 5 or so years old?" in a word Yes. Sometimes the design pushes way more current through the chips than they are designed for. Other times the manufacturers buy not the best quality chips, knowing that some will fail, but you have lots of spare chips in an array of 48 or so' In my experience the failures are often the solder joints that connect each chip (di, singular of dice) into the circuit. A lot of it is the "value engineering" to bring the cost down. Not enough heat dissipation, not enough current control in the supporting circuitry.The latter is especially of concern in an RV or boat, where voltage swings from 12-14+ VDC on the house mean varying current feeding the LED. This is why it's important to source LED bulbs spec'd to work across a range of voltages (usually 8-30 VDC) rather than ones just advertised as "12V".Great reading here on Marine Beam's site (white papers are at the bottom) Information Page - Frequently Asked QuestionsConstant-Current?Read our Idiots Guide 1 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #9 – December 25, 2019, 10:28:57 am Quote from: thefuofus - December 25, 2019, 09:27:32 amFactory installed, voltage is fine.I don't know if the arrays are replaceable, as I haven't yet tried to disassemble them.Yes they can be disassembled. Yes the arrays are replaceable. The image I posted is what they look like inside. The plastic cover comes off. <smile> like are things LD its on tight.I went down this road to find a 'warmer' led -- still looking.glen 1 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #10 – December 25, 2019, 12:16:36 pm "Great reading here on Marine Beam's site"Here's another vote for Marinebeam. Their products are not the cheapest, but they are top-quality. For example, most of their lighting fixtures use constant-current circuitry, rather than inexpensive current-limiting resistors. What's the difference? Cheap LED lights flicker when the water pump runs. The Marinebeam lights that I installed don't. Also, the current-limiting circuitry generates less waste heat than resistors do. That should translate to longer LED life. 6 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #11 – December 25, 2019, 04:32:03 pm Quote from: Andy Baird - December 25, 2019, 12:16:36 pmTheir products are not the cheapest, but they are top-quality. For example, most of their lighting fixtures use constant-current circuitry, rather than inexpensive current-limiting resistors.Better modern LEDs use electronic current limiters, rather than resistors, to control lumen output. While LED are supposed to last for 50-100,00, most of the failures today are in the electronics.Years ago, early LEDs were miserable things with low lumen output and frequent failure, usually from overdriving the LEDs with more current than they were engineered for, in an attempt for greater light output. .LEDs on a 15' roll are still popular but many will suffer from flickering individual LEDs due to poor solder joints.Buying from a reputable manufacturer is the best way to ensure your nee LEDs will last a long time.I use M4 for most of my LED needs, their shop and show room is a 15 minute drive away from home.Larry 2 Likes
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #12 – December 25, 2019, 07:31:07 pm I changed out all of my fluorescent lamps with led units from m4 products. The company has very good products and the owner, Steve, is quick to answer emails if you have issues.
Re: Interior LED lights Reply #13 – December 25, 2019, 09:29:43 pm Quote from: Andy Baird - December 25, 2019, 12:16:36 pmFor example, most of their lighting fixtures use constant-current circuitry, rather than inexpensive current-limiting resistors. What's the difference? Cheap LED lights flicker when the water pump runs. Cheap LEDs are also a fire hazard. Have some friends from another RV forum who used inexpensive ones in a table lamp fixture - there was evidence of serious overheating after just a short while.
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