engine repairs by age December 11, 2018, 07:48:06 pm I had an interesting conversation with two different neighbors recently. One said my Ford V10 will last forever - 'hard to kill those engines'. Another neighbor asked how old my rig is and when I said 18 years old and he said I'll have trouble getting parts for engine if needed! Now, I'm not mechanically inclined and may have some specs mixed up, but I have a 2000 TK, with an E350, V-10 engine that has always been well-cared for and serviced (oil etc) and want to know if second neighbor is right. I've seen lots of LDs that are older than mine. What should I be concerned about? It has 71000 miles on it, gets used once every few months (not as often as we'd like now that we are older). We opted for the bigger engine the year this was made, not the typical one for the 23 1/2 ft. Unit is garaged. Last mechanic who worked on it said hoses all look good.seesaw60
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #1 – December 11, 2018, 08:09:36 pm Larry Wade will likely chime in about this topic. He was involved with a large fleet of vehicles at LAX. The E-450/V-10 is used in a LOT of commercial and government vehicles that accumulate many miles. It is my belief that with proper maintenance, these engines will easily go over 200,000 miles. Our 2002 MB had 140,000 miles when we sold it and the engine and transmission had been trouble free. The Ford E series chassis and the V-10 engines are so widely used that parts should be available for a long time.Art
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #2 – December 11, 2018, 08:48:11 pm Well, my 2003 TK (E450) has 112k, I have had no issues or problems with the engine over 15 years, and I expect it to go a lot longer than I will! However, the engine (and systems) have been diligently maintained, the oil and filter changed every 3000 miles, all the fluids, hoses, plugs, brakes, suspension, and everything/anything else that the Ford maintenance schedule, Larry, "my" mechanic at the Ford truck center, and I feel need to be done/replaced has been done, usually before indicated by age and/or mileage with OEM or better, parts. (I also don't tow, and run well below the GVWR.) This is the basic Ford maintenance schedule; there are quite a few additional services and service intervals that I (and others) feel are advisable that are not listed in the schedule, and Larry may mention some of these. Maintenance Schedules | fleet.ford.comAny engine, regardless of how well engineered and built, will fail if not serviced properly with high quality parts, by a skilled and knowledgeable mechanic, and in a timely manner. The V-10 is a strong engine, and, as Art said, it's very widely used; I don't have a concern about parts availability, and as long as the professional-grade mechanics (and the small maintenance stuff that I do myself) are able to keep her going, it's good! YMMV, as ever.
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #3 – December 12, 2018, 08:07:40 am I've heard nothing but good about the V-10 except the plug issue which seems to effect a relatively low percentage of the motors.
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #4 – December 12, 2018, 01:05:42 pm Quote from: Older_Fossil - December 11, 2018, 08:09:36 pmLarry Wade will likely chime in about this topic. You mean how his engine ate itself due to the blown spark plug problem?Ford v10 spark plug problemsIMO, the V10 is a dead end evolutionary branch. In comparison, look how Chevy's small block (SBC) essentially morphed into the LS family, which by many accounts is the best engine ever made:This Is Why GM's LS V8s Are so GoodStill, for high load applications, I'd bet on electric (assist) motors at the rear wheels to provide low end torque. This will allow RVs to run slightly smaller engines (like the LS 5.3) but still have plenty of pull from stops.As has been mentioned before, since engine/chassis technology is moving at such a rapid pace, it has a very real chance of obsoleting class C RVs. In comparison, separating the coach from the tow vehicle (like Andy with his F150/Airstream combo) will allow the TV to be swapped out on a regular 3-5 year basis. That is, you could conceivably keep a solid, water tight Airstream forever - just like a B-52 airplane - while constantly upgrading the TV.
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #5 – December 12, 2018, 02:38:48 pm Quote from: snerf - December 12, 2018, 01:05:42 pmYou mean how his engine ate itself due to the blown spark plug problem?Ford v10 spark plug problemsIMO, the V10 is a dead end evolutionary branch. In comparison, look how Chevy's small block (SBC) essentially morphed into the LS family, which by many accounts is the best engine ever made:.My engine failure was my own fault. The plug blew out the day before we were supposed to be 200 miles away the next day, for the March Morro Bay GTG. I tried a temporarily fix that didn't hold up the entire 400 miles round trip. In retrospect, I should have canceled but I did feel responsible for the being at the GTG, after leading it for so many years.There was no one to take my place. Any volunteers?The 'fix' that didn't work.Blown spark plug repair kit | FlickrIf I hadn't been in a rush, I would have used a professional repair, installing an insert that replaces the damage spark plug threads. Actually, I did install one after I returned home only to discover that a cylinder had been badly damaged.Amazon.com: CalVan Tools 38900 Two Valve Ford Triton Tool Kit - Foolproof...If I bought another, pre-2004 E450, I would spend a day and install inserts in all ten of the spark plugs and have a fail proof repair.Our new, Ford certified remanufactured engine does not have this problem, having steel inserts that replace all the aluminum spark plug threads.The V10 has been production for 21 years and usually has a very long life, with the exception of the pre-2003 spark plug issue.In commercial usage, 200,000+ miles is common. We have been in a couple E450 airport shuttle buses that have in excess of 250,000 miles. The V10 was designed as a truck engine and, with overhead cams, is capable of being run at high RPMs, (over 4000 RPM) for extended periods without causing any problems. In return the power output is lower than a normal car engine, such as the venerated LS Chevy engines, which are not designed to run at full throttle for extended periods. Comparing car and truck engines is an apple to oranges comparison. Ford's replacement for the V10 is the 6.2-L V8. Interestingly, the new engine's output isn't a lot more than the old V10, 3-valve edition, used in the Class As. Unfortunately, the E450's engine bay isn't wide enough for the 3-valve head, so we get the lower output, 2-valve 305-HP engine.Ford's Class A V10 is rated at 363 HP and 450 LB/Ft or torque. The new 6.2-L, used in Ford's Super-Duty pickups, is rated at 385 HP an 430 LB/Ft of torque. It doesn't produce huge amount of power either since it is also designed as a truck engine.Other than the spark plug problem, I have never heard of a V10 self destructing .Two other problems show in the V10, first being the spark plug coils, they have been known to go bad and set a CEL (check engine light). While I have never experienced this, many here on the forum have. I do carry two spare coils (COP or 'coil on plug'), just in case.In older LDs, the exhaust manifold studs can rust and shear off. Broken studs can be removed and replaced.Bottom line is that all engines suffer from certain problems if run long enough. Ford's previous beloved 460 engine had its own issues.If buying an older LD, I would immediately change the spark plugs and make sure they are torqued to the new specification of 28-LB/FT. I would also consider installing spark plug inserts preemptively.I would be more concerned about the transmission failing, especially if it had been used for pulling a toad for many miles.Larry 2 Likes As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #6 – December 12, 2018, 03:26:15 pm I notice from our 2017 manual that Ford now recommends changing spark plugs at 60,000 miles and changing automatic transmission fluid and filter at 37,500 miles. I believe the mileage intervals were much greater on our 2006.
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #7 – December 12, 2018, 03:40:38 pm Quote from: Ross and Beverly Taylor - December 12, 2018, 03:26:15 pmI notice from our 2017 manual that Ford now recommends changing spark plugs at 60,000 miles and changing automatic transmission fluid and filter at 37,500 miles. I believe the mileage intervals were much greater on our 2006.Older E450s had 100,000 mile spark plug change intervals and transmission fluid replacement at 30,000 miles.Larry
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #8 – December 12, 2018, 04:04:14 pm "I have a 2000 TK, with an E350, V-10 engine that has always been well-cared for and serviced (oil etc)..."----Without knowing which components have been regularly serviced/repaired/replaced, and/or if you tow a vehicle, and/or if the E-350 is overloaded (the gvwr on the E-350 is 11500 pounds), it's difficult to say definitively what should be checked and serviced at 70k. But (you knew there was one, right? ), in addition to Larry's advice on changing out/ torquing to spec the plugs, you might want to consider having a skilled, experienced mechanic check the following basics. Many, if not all, of these services should have been done between about 30k-60k, per the maintenance schedule or simply because one believes in preventive maintenance. And, realistically, some mechanics may give only a very limited "eyeballing" of a service point and just "check the box".Engine: (Beyond oil and filter changes per the manual's recommendations.)Changes and flushes of coolant, transmission fluid, power steering system. Replace fuel filter. Replace air filter.Check belts and hoses. (A worn hose is not necessarily obvious from the exterior of the hose. I'd replace all of the hoses and the belt, but....)Systems:Flush and replace the brake fluid.Lube the disc brake caliper slides.Re-pack wheel bearings.Check the U-joints, carrier bearing, and the rubber "collar".Check the differential fluid.Chassis:Lube ball joints at every oil change. (Install zerks.)Inspect the shocks for worn/squished/missing bushings and leaks. (Replace the shocks if you're experiencing "bounce, sway, brake dive, and/or acceleration squat.")Check front and rear anti-sway bars for tightness and worn/missing bushings.Inspect all the steering assembly components.Inspect and tighten frame mounting bolts; tighten all the tank and step mounting hardware and bolts at the same time.Check undercarriage for rust, broken springs, leaks, rat entries, and check the propane tank for rust. This is particularly important if one lives in an area where roads are "salted" in winter.Carefully check the tires for (age, obviously, and) correct inflation, uneven wear, and sidewall damage/deterioration. Don't ignore the inside dual.And, of course, check the roof, windows, vents, and end caps for potential leak areas and seal them.Of course, doing all, some, or none of the above is a matter of choice; the YMMV thing again. Have fun!
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #9 – December 12, 2018, 04:54:29 pm It may not be 'engine', but looking at Joan's list reminded me. As part of the 30K maintenance, I had the transmission and differential fluids replaced. The dealer shop person remarked that the transmission fluid looked fine but the differential fluid was somewhat 'burned'. The 31IB starts heavy, I am usually at or over 14,000 according to CatScales and the towd is usually 38-3900. There is a line somewhere between conservative and paranoid, but I'm not trying too hard to find it. The differential fluid is getting changed at 45K - and I may have it analyzed.Joel
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #10 – December 12, 2018, 05:49:47 pm Quote from: joel wiley - December 12, 2018, 04:54:29 pmIt may not be 'engine', but looking at Joan's list reminded me. As part of the 30K maintenance, I had the transmission and differential fluids replaced. The dealer shop person remarked that the transmission fluid looked fine but the differential fluid was somewhat 'burned'. The 31IB starts heavy, I am usually at or over 14,000 according to CatScales and the towd is usually 38-3900. There is a line somewhere between conservative and paranoid, but I'm not trying too hard to find it. The differential fluid is getting changed at 45K - and I may have it analyzed.JoelIf you are not already, use a 75W-140 synthetic gear lube. Our 2003 Owner's Manual calls for a 50,000 mile change interval but I'm switching to a 30,000 mile interval after spinning a pinion bearing a couple of years ago. Oil is cheap, rebuilds are not.Differential fluid should never look or smell burned, that would indicate a possible serious problem. An oil analysis should provide valuable information and peace of mind. Larry
Re: engine repairs by age Reply #11 – December 12, 2018, 06:32:47 pm The above "list" is part of a "What to Do, and When to Do It" maintenance doc that I've done a few times for the Ladeze; much credit for the recommended services and intervals goes to my friend, Larry, for his long experience, knowledge of all things greasy, his expertise, and his patience in teaching me even a very small fraction of what he has stored in his head and hands!
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