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Topic: Genset troubleshooting question - answered (Read 48 times) previous topic - next topic
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Genset troubleshooting question - answered
Yahoo Message Number: 136643
Refer to the post below which I posted some months ago. I just had this checked out at the CumminsOnan facility in Denver. The mechanic determined that the short rubber hose (pigtail he called it) that runs from top of the coach gas tank to the genset fuel line was leaking, thus air was getting in the fuel line and causing fuel starvation which caused the noise described below. The noise had gotten progressively worse over time which would indicate the leak was growing larger as the genset was used. This is the hose that LD uses when it installs the genset, and it has caused trouble for some folks and this has been discussed on this forum several times. A link to Larry Wade's photos is below and there is an article at the Techsnoz site about this. http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Techsnoz/?yguid=100194201>
 The mechanic said neither he nor any of his coworkers could get their hands above the gas tank to replace this hose and the coach gas tank would have to be lowered to access the hose. This process was quoted in the $500 range, mostly labor of course. I elected to pay my diagnostic fee and leave. I shall have to try to find someone to fix this without lowering the gas tank. If any of you has done this fix, please let me know. The good news is that it's only this stupid little hose. Now if I could just get my hands in there...........

Chris

https://secure.flickr.com/photos/lwade/1416467646/in/set-72157602104741129/>
 "Recently the Micro Quiet 4000 genset on my '02 30' has started making a lifter tick or tappet noise (clicking, clacking) when it runs. Yesterday I went to storage to give it its monthly exercise and I thought I'd try the prime function (since we just discussed it), and I could hear the pump or something priming. I then started the genset and it ran for a few minutes and quit. I checked the blinking code and it communicated Engine Stop Fault 36 (engine stopped without command by controller). I tried to start the genset 20 minutes later and it fired up fine and I ran it for about 30 minutes with the A/C on and it did not shut off - and the clicking, clacking noise persisted. I think perhaps I could have initially flooded it by using the prime function (which I've never used before). Any thoughts on what could be causing this noise? Oil level is where it should be and the LD has 1/2 tank of gas. No surging happening - it runs steadily."
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Genset troubleshooting question - answered
Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136648
Quote
"This is the hose that LD uses when it installs the genset, and it has caused trouble for some folks and this has been discussed on this forum several times... I shall have to try to find someone to fix this without lowering the gas tank..."

Chris
Good luck with that Chris! I had the same problem but the shop that fixed it did have to lower the tank a small amount. They did it with a wooden pallet supported by jack stands just enough to gain access. They upgraded the 'pig tail' to a high quality hose (not LD level) and while they were at it they also replaced the plastic fuel line all the way to the generator with stainless steel. That should be the end of those problems.

Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Jiggs
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Genset troubleshooting question - answered
Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136650
Quote

 
 "This is the hose that LD uses when it installs the genset, and it has caused trouble for some folks and this has been discussed on this forum several times... I shall have to try to find someone to fix this without lowering the gas tank..."

Chris

Good luck with that Chris! I had the same problem but the shop that fixed it did have to lower the tank a small amount. They did it with a wooden pallet supported by jack stands just enough to gain access. They upgraded the 'pig tail' to a high quality hose (not LD level) and while they were at it they also replaced the plastic fuel line all the way to the generator with stainless steel. That should be the end of those problems.

Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Jiggs
Thanks, Steve. I was hoping I could avoid dropping the tank. $$$$$$$$

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Genset troubleshooting question - answered
Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136652
Quote
Thanks, Steve. I was hoping I could avoid dropping the tank. $$$$$$$$

Chris
It might not be as bad as you think. My local RV service shop charged me $334 for the lowering of the (full) tank, labor and parts. To me it was cheap enough considering I didn't have to do it (which would have been impossible.

Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Jiggs
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Genset troubleshooting question - answered
Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136654
"f any of you has done this fix, please let me know. The good news is that it's only this stupid little hose. Now if I could just get my hands in there..........."

Chris
 On most floor plans, there isn't enough room to access the top of the tank to access the hose. Dropping the tank is necessary to replace the rubber hose on the top outlet on most LDs. This is a very common problem with LDs of our vintage.
Another way of providing a source of fuel is to use a "Rubin Splice", routing a new fuel line through the tank filler hose. Details over at Terry's site.
Generator Fuel Line Replacement http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/YC8QUcCHicyEdf4r7freLKRQYmRq7Hank690F2DG-VjZr1fTZKSaFSbqOMDvAlTMJD9AoB4ZVvKQjYlmSqHRc7_gIHxChp0/GeneratorFuelLine.pdf I have done a couple of these and it works but it is a bit of work and you cannot exactly set where the generator will run out of fuel.
 A couple of potential downsides to not replacing the hose. The old hose will still be leaking and is still connected to the fuel tank, in a rollover, it might leak.
Second is if the leak is big enough, air may may be sucked into the fuel tank, when the fuel level drops below the generator fuel cut-off point, and this can set a CEL (check engine light) due to an evaporative system leak.
When the engine is running, the fuel tank is always under a low vacuum to prevent the escape of fuel vapors. The engines computer monitors the vacuum level and can detect slight leaks in the system.
 While the Rubin Splice will work, the recommended fix is to drop the tank. Change the fuel pump while you have the tank down.

Didn't we just have a thread on how expensive RVs can be?

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Genset
Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136656
Re: Micro quiet generator.
 According to Ken at Cummins in Albq. and Mike Sylvester the generator will make a clicking noise when the fuel pump is about to fail. Replacing it is not that difficult but getting underneath all the wiring and power control is delicate at best. The fuel pump and the small filter on the fuel line are at the very bottom of the lower left side inside the gen. The fuel filter extension is what the smaller 5/16 hose section attaches to before it clamps onto the LD factory line that goes to the tank. I have also replaced two different upper lines (mine and Rogers at Q.) by reaching up above the tank inside the drivers wheel well. If you have never done it it can be challenging but I did not have to drop the tank. Having thinner arms helped. I would advise Chris to change out the fuel pump first along with the filter. Sounds like that might be the problem. When the hose above the tank starts cracking and the gen. loses its prime the gen. usually won't run but a minute or two then quit. Also change out the small line underneath attached to the fuel filter. Hope this helps. I would be happy to talk anyone through the repair. John Leach, Monument, Co.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Genset
Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 136657
Quote
Re: Micro quiet generator.
 According to Ken at Cummins in Albq. and Mike Sylvester the generator will make a clicking noise when the fuel pump is about to fail. Replacing it is not that difficult but getting underneath all the wiring and power control is delicate at best. The fuel pump and the small filter on the fuel line are at the very bottom of the lower left side inside the gen. The fuel filter extension is what the smaller 5/16 hose section attaches to before it clamps onto the LD factory line that goes to the tank. I have also replaced two different upper lines (mine and Rogers at Q.) by reaching up above the tank inside the drivers wheel well. If you have never done it it can be challenging but I did not have to drop the tank. Having thinner arms helped. I would advise Chris to change out the fuel pump first along with the filter. Sounds like that might be the problem. When the hose above the tank starts cracking and the gen. loses its prime the gen. usually won't run but a minute or two then quit. Also change out the small line underneath attached to the fuel filter. Hope this helps. I would be happy to talk anyone through the repair.
John Leach, Monument, Co.
 

 John, good info. Would you email me with your phone #, please. If you don't mind, I like to chat with you about this.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB