Small inverter September 06, 2009, 09:55:53 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105611I need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping. Our Lazy Daze is a 1997 RB. The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly.What is the rating of the 12V plug for the TV?Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet?Hopeful for a plug in operation.Jim & Donna 1997 Teal RB
Re: Small inverter Reply #1 – September 06, 2009, 11:03:31 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105613...need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping..machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly. ....QuoteJim & Donna 1997 Teal RB Dear Jim and Donna - Look at this little inverter I got it at Wal-mart & it plugs into 12v outlet: Powerline: DC to AC Inverter with Dual AC Outlets and USB power port 200 watts continuous/400 watts peak input 10 VDC - 16 VDC Output 120 VAC60Hz USB output 5 VDC500mA max model 0900-73 I think it cost about $34 and has worked very well for us - I'm sure you might fine one at a reasonable price with little more continuous watts -Virginia, Jim and Cricket Starr and Midnight Roadie
Re: Small inverter Reply #2 – September 06, 2009, 11:15:12 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105614QuoteI need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping. Our Lazy Daze is a 1997 RB. The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly.What is the rating of the 12V plug for the TV?Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet? 275 watts at 12VDC is almost 23 amps. That's more than the TV outlet is fused for, and probably too much for a plug-in inverter.--Al in Bremerton --2002 26.5 MB
Re: Small inverter Reply #3 – September 06, 2009, 11:27:28 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105615QuoteI need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping. Our Lazy Daze is a 1997 RB. The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly.What is the rating of the 12V plug for the TV?Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet? 275 watts at 12VDC is almost 23 amps. That's more than the TV outlet is fused for, and probably too much for a plug-in inverter.--Al in Bremerton --2002 26.5 MB More info: CPAP in made in Australia. Input range for S8 Series II with HumidAire 3i: 100รข€"240V, 50/60Hz; 110V, 400Hz; 2.5A
Re: Small inverter Reply #4 – September 06, 2009, 11:38:26 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105616"The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly. Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet?" Your math is correct, but in this case there's no need to convert to watts. To get from amps at 120V to amps at 12V, just multiply by ten. That gives you 25 amps, and the answer to your question becomes clear: no, you can't get 25A from a 12V cigarette-lighter-style outlet. You'll have to hardwire that inverter. And then you'll have to think about your batteries. You have 225 Ah of capacity when fully charged, which means 112 Ah of *usable* capacity if you don't go below the 50% discharge level (more than that would damage your batteries). That's four hours of operation at 25A. This doesn't sound like a workable setup, I'm sorry to say. Possibilities: add two more batteries, or find a low-powered CPAP machine. I'm no expert on CPAP (I get by with a $30 SnorBan mouthpiece), but here's an article about battery-powered/12V CPAP machines:http://www.cpap-supply.com/Articles.asp?ID=146> According to the article, "the power consumption of a typical CPAP machine is about 20 watts." That's less than a tenth of what you said Donna's machine requires. Might be worth looking into...Andy Baird http://www.andybaird.com/travels/
Re: Small inverter Reply #5 – September 06, 2009, 11:48:10 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105619Quote "The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly. Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet?" Your humidifier is drawing the big power. If you have to have a humidifier get one that doesn't use power. The pressurized air just blows over the surface and evaporation happens making the air more moist. I've been using my BiPap for over 15 years now and have not had to use my humidifier even in dry Arizona. I have a 150w inverter from Harbor Freight that was about $29.00 and it works just fine as my BiPap machine draws 70 watts while running.Jerry 2000 30 IB
Re: Small inverter Reply #6 – September 07, 2009, 02:31:00 am Yahoo Message Number: 105623Quote from: andybaird2000"snip Possibilities: add two more batteries, or find a low-powered CPAP machine. I'm no expert on CPAP (I get by with a $30 SnorBan mouthpiece), but here's an article about battery-powered/12V CPAP machines:According to the article, "the power consumption of a typical CPAP machine is about 20 watts." That's less than a tenth of what you said Donna's machine requires. Might be worth looking into...Andy Baird http://www.andybaird.com/travels/This link was a big help. Found the 12V inverter made for Donna's CPAP. Depending on which chart (from the manufacturer) you look at it draws between 1.27 or .98 amps at 12V DC without the humidifier. They call it a "converter" but it plugs into the 12 socket. cpap-supply sells it for $83.00 so this looks like the way to go for us.Thanks Jim & Donna 1997 Teal RB
Re: Small inverter Reply #7 – September 07, 2009, 08:10:46 am Yahoo Message Number: 105625Hello -We are in the very preliminary stages of planning on purchasing a Lazy Daze, but the running a CPAP was one of our first questions. I don't know all of the specs on my husband's unit, but I do remember his instructions when he got the machine included not using on an Inverter or portable power. Plus our initial research is indicating that trying to run a machine with a heated humidifier (which his is) is not the best solution and that there are machines now being made that are meant for traveling - lower power usage, cool humidifier (if needed) and lighter weight.We just decided we would discuss other machine options with his medical supplier when the time comes.Kimwww.purely-digital-scrapbooking.com www.kettlekorner.com[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Small inverter Reply #8 – September 07, 2009, 11:07:06 am Yahoo Message Number: 105631QuoteWe are in the very preliminary stages of planning on purchasing a Lazy Daze, but the running a CPAP was one of our first questions. We have friends who, when they ordered their Lazy Daze, had the factory install two 12V outlets in the back where they sleep just for using their CPAP machines.. I have no idea what type or brand of CPAP machines they use, but it seemed to be working just fine for them. Unfortunately, they no longer post to the group, so can't contribute information about their setup.Linda Hylton http://map.datastormusers.com/user1.cfm?user=1167 http://earl-linda.blogspot.com/
Re: Small inverter Reply #9 – September 07, 2009, 04:22:38 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105640Quote I need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping. Our Lazy Daze is a 1997 RB. The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly. That must be the rating on the power supply and/or it includes the heater running. I cut the cord on my CPAP, and run it on 12V direct. It generally draws less than 1 amp. I do not heat the water when boondocked though. Double check though and make sure it runs on 12V. Nearly all the modern units do. No need for a converter.-Dave '06 MB, Indianapolis.
Re: Small inverter Reply #10 – September 07, 2009, 06:39:49 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105642My husband Blair uses a CPAP while dry camping off 12V, with no problem. Dawn__ From: k9dc Dave@...> To: lifewithalazydazerv@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 4:21:55 PM Subject: [LD] Re: Small inverter
Re: Small inverter Reply #11 – September 08, 2009, 12:14:15 am Yahoo Message Number: 105645...run CPAP machine while dry camping This has become an interesting topic - Seems it merits a File for future reference to those who use the CPAP machine or will at some point - Would save a lot to have all the info needed for a very special need - Surely someone on the group with knowledge of CPAP machines can put together a file -Virginia Starr and Midnight Roadie
Re: Small inverter Reply #12 – September 08, 2009, 11:27:42 am Yahoo Message Number: 105647Quote I need/want to run Donna's CPAP machine while dry camping. Our Lazy Daze is a 1997 RB. The CPAP machine is rated for 2.5 amps at 110 volts AC, which is 275 watts if I am doing the math correctly.What is the rating of the 12V plug for the TV?Can I use a portable inverter plugged into the 12V outlet?Hopeful for a plug in operation.Jim & Donna 1997 Teal RB Jim, I have a Remstar Plus that you can buy with a 12 Volt cord that plugs into the TV lighter socket. It does bypass the humidifier when on 12 volts but has worked perfect for 4 years now. Joe Hamm-San Jose
Re: Small inverter Reply #13 – September 08, 2009, 11:41:02 am Yahoo Message Number: 105648Quote ...run CPAP machine while dry camping This has become an interesting topic - Seems it merits a File for future reference to those who use the CPAP machine or will at some point - Would save a lot to have all the info needed for a very special need -Surely someone on the group with knowledge of CPAP machines can put together a file - Problem is, most of us only have knowledge of a single CPAP machine... the one they personally use. I simply used the same philosophy I used on any other piece of accessory gear I use in the vehicle. Make sure it runs on 12 volts, cut off the cord and install the appropriate connector to plug it in to house power. I have installed a couple of multi-outlet connector strips on the 12V circuit, just for that purpose. I have modified various devices for direct connections, including Linksys and Cradlepoint routers, Linux computers, CPAP machine, Winegard HDTV receiver, and lots of various Ham radio equipment. If it is something I carry on-board, I try to make sure it runs on 12V before purchase, avoiding use of an inverter. I still occasionally use a 220W inverter for things not compatible, such as the charger for my Canon camera, and laptop computers. WARNING: If you are not comfortable cutting power cords and soldering or crimping on new connectors on cables, DON'T try it. It requires a couple of steps with a meter to confirm polarity and the ability to solder wires, and/or crimp them with a special tool. Nothing too difficult, but could be expensive if not done correctly.-Dave '06 MB, Indianapolis
Re: Small inverter Reply #14 – September 08, 2009, 12:27:36 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105649I feel really stupid asking this, but, what is a CPAP machine. I must have missed something? Dale from Downey__ From: k9dc Dave@...> To: lifewithalazydazerv@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2009 8:40:48 AM Subject: [LD] Re: Small inverter
Re: Small inverter Reply #15 – September 08, 2009, 12:36:04 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105650Quote I feel really stupid asking this, but, what is a CPAP machine. I must have missed something? Dale from Downey Dale, all the info plus here. http://www.cpapplus.com/CPAP_Supplies/CPAPEducation.htmlJoe Hamm
Re: Small inverter Reply #16 – September 08, 2009, 12:44:24 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105652A quick Google search will net you all the info you'll want and probably more. It's for sleep apnea. What I find worrisome about CPAP is its close proximity to another word formed by adding a leg to that first "P".bumper
Re: Small inverter Reply #17 – September 08, 2009, 01:18:45 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105653Quote I feel really stupid asking this, but, what is a CPAP machine. I must have missed something? Dale from Downey CPAP = Continuous Positive Airway Pressure. You can get one by going to a sleep doctor who conducts a sleep study on you. He will prescribe one for you (if needed). If nothing else, you get to spend a $4,000.00 night in a pseudo hotel room! Seriously, if you need one, you will think it is the greatest invention since sliced bread. HUGE difference in the quality of sleep. (no drugs either!). THe study found my breathing was interrupted some 30 times per hour. The patient him/herself is rarely aware of the problem, unless nagged by a sleep partner for snoring. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_airway_pressure-Dave '06 MB, Indianapolis
TV Converter-Boondocking Reply #18 – September 08, 2009, 09:39:27 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105665Linley, Dave and Steve – thank you for replies and input. Only have one 12V outlet in coach. Checked link to dual 12V outlet w/10amp fuse - problem is, need to have metal above the retractable tip and long enough to make contact within the LD receptacle. Sunday afternoon bought Y adaptors from Camping World and Radio Shack and RS's #270-1594 12V plug with 2A fuse for the Converter. Neither Y went in far enough to make contact. A neighbor rummaged through his shop and gave (thank you) me a couple Y's, one with a 10A fuse and tip similar to what came with TV. Pretty sure I had polarity correct, Artec showed positive center, and + on M adaptor over tip. It worked, but when I pulled out the Radio Shack 12V/2A fused plug for the converter, tip so hot it burned my finger, and the TV 12V tip was very hard to remove. The plastic above the tip on 12V Y looked melted, so opened up and it had melted around the fuse so you couldn't budge it. No clue why that happened. Previous owner had installed a 700W inverter with two outlets, so guess I'll be using that for a while. Curious why Steve recommended leaving TV and Artec set for 12V ops even if hooked up. Haven't tried it, but LD Manual says it will create distortions.Love the list and learning a lot. Barb & Gypsy
Re: TV Converter-Boondocking Reply #19 – September 09, 2009, 06:47:46 pm Yahoo Message Number: 105721QuoteIt worked, but when I pulled out the Radio Shack 12V/2A fused plug for the converter, tip so hot it burned my finger, and the TV 12V tip was very hard to remove. The plastic above the tip on 12V Y looked melted, so opened up and it had melted around the fuse so you couldn't budge it. No clue why that happened. Generally, this is a sign of poor fuseholder design. Many cheap fuseholders simply use end-contact with the fuse with pressure supplied by a spring. Better contact is found with those using spring clamps that encircle the fuse ends.QuotePrevious owner had installed a 700W inverter with two outlets, so guess I'll be using that for a while. Curious why Steve recommended leaving TV and Artec set for 12V ops even if hooked up. Haven't tried it, but LD Manual says it will create distortions. This has never been a problem for us, even when we used the original LD converter. The main advantage is convenience - not having to fiddle with changing multiple power connections each time.Steve
Re: Small inverter Reply #20 – September 10, 2009, 12:05:56 am Yahoo Message Number: 105737I don't have an extensive knowledge of the CPAP; but if anyone wants to send me the information; I will compile the file for reference use by others who encounter the issue. Please send your information to .Donna with Lazy Daizy RB, WA state
Re: Small inverter Reply #21 – September 10, 2009, 12:06:08 am Yahoo Message Number: 105738Dale,A CPAP machine is a continuous pressure airway programmable machine that helps people with sleep apnea and other breathing disorders sleep at night without the worry that they might not wake
Re: CPAP Reply #22 – September 10, 2009, 09:24:11 am Yahoo Message Number: 105745"Not sure about the meaning of that last 'P' in CPAP:" CPAP stands for Continuous Positive Airway Pressure. As with most things, there's a good description at Wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CPAP_machine> That may be worth referring to for background as you compile information. And the article I referred to in a post a few days ago is a good source of information on battery-operated and 12V CPAP machines, which are of special interest to RVers.Andy Baird http://www.andybaird.com/travels/
Re: Small inverter Reply #23 – September 10, 2009, 09:42:49 am Yahoo Message Number: 105746CPAP is an acronym for Continuous Positive Airway Pressurization. I use one every night. My machine draws about 200 watts, or roughly 2 amps at 120VAC. When dry camping I use a 400 watt inverter I bought at Sam's for $30. I made up an extension cord from #10AWG type SO cable - #10 is probably over-kill, better safe than sorry. I put alligator clips, and a 30 amp positive terminal fuse on one end, and ring lugs on the other end to attach to inverter. Attach the lugs to the inverter first, then clip the alligator clips to the house batteries. I open the house battery compartment, run the extension cord down the side of my rig, open the rear storage compartment, place the inverter in the storage - this is done so I don't have to listen to the cooling fan all night, run the CPAP power cord out through my bedroom drawer to the storage. The drain on the house batteries is small, so my solar panels will recharge during the next day.Not very "elegant", but it works for me.Mike - 2002 30' IB
Re: TV Converter-Boondocking Reply #24 – September 11, 2009, 02:48:38 am Yahoo Message Number: 105775QuoteThe plastic above the tip on 12V Y looked melted, so opened up and it had melted around the fuse so you couldn't budge it. No clue why that happened.Generally, this is a sign of poor fuseholder design. Many cheap fuseholders simply use end-contact with the fuse with pressure supplied by a spring. Better contact is found with those using spring clamps that encircle the fuse ends.distortions. Thanks again for your comments, Steve - do/did have a fuseholder as you describe - see http://www.flickr.com/photos/beachgypsy/ Pulled the TVs 12V fuse and see it's 13A not 10A, while "Y" only had 10A fuse - maybe that made a difference?Barb & Gypsy
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