200 Mile Limit December 11, 2004, 11:21:09 am Yahoo Message Number: 47653LD GroupI've been following the Natchez Trace thread (never been on the Trace)and noticed that it is apparently speed limited, scenic and worthwhile, like the Blue Ridge (which I have done, end to end). While I may never get that far east again () I took note that someone drove it in just over 400 miles in two days.Now to me that is a correct speed for folks out to see the country in an RV, especially a Lazy Daze. It has been our practice ever since retirement that we will not drive over 200 miles on any given day unless there is a pressing need to do otherwise.Two hundred miles at an average speed of 50 miles per is on average a four to five hour day. This allows a leisurly awakening, breakfast and travel preparation. Then the day goes much more comfortably without pushing the pedal to the metal. By the time all the other Road Warriors come rolling in you will have had time to warm the lawn chairs, imbibe your favorite beverage, see the local points of interest, scope out a nearby restaurant or begin a home cooked meal.Long gone are the days when, faced with a two week vacation period, you had to get to Aunt Mary's by Tuesday and the Grand Canyon by Friday in order to get home in time to get the kids back in school. Jeeze, how much do I NOT miss that routine.What say the group? ? ? ?Steve S. Lazy Bones
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #1 – December 11, 2004, 12:46:22 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47660300 is comfortable. 400 is a stretch. 200 usually is too few miles if we have an itinerary or plan we are following. We've (rarely) driven 500
Vintage LD for Sale Reply #2 – December 11, 2004, 02:04:08 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47661I don't believe I've ever seen one of this age; but if the original miles figure is correct, it might be a great deal for someone with a bare-bones budget and the inclination to do some fix-up work. This is from Trade Express online.1969 Dodge Lazy Daze $2,900 obo 53,000 original miles Everything works New porta potty,3 burner stove & oven 2 new propane tanks, new tires, new u-joints, new Carb(Holly 4 barrel)new manifold new rear whell seals & bearing. Roof re-sealed No Leaks great engin compression. Ventura, CA ยป 805-644-2336
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #3 – December 11, 2004, 05:20:59 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47664One question that interests me is the relative opearating costs of a 15 year old vehicle versus a 25 year old vehicle. My premise is that a 15 year old coach is likely to need the same types of repairs that a much older model will need, assuming similar miles driven.For example, a 1990 22 ft LD with 90,000 miles might cost $14,000, while a 1980 with similar miles and appearance costs $4,000.Within a few years, both are likely to need a rebuilt engine and transmission, and both will need suspension and brake work. Both will need furnace, hot water heater, roof A/C and refrigerator service, and possible replacement. And both will need re-sealing of the coach exterior. In this example, 1980 and 1990 coaches are mechanically very similar, so the cost to perform these refurbishments is about the same. Ten years from now, the 1990 coach will be 25 years old, and will have a resale value of around $4,000 (maybe higher due to inflation). The 1980 coach resale value may be $2,500. So it looks to me like it would be more economical to purchase the 25 year old coach, do the needed repairs right away, and have 10 years of RV enjoyment for less than the purchase price of the 15 year old coach.--oryoki
Re: [Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #4 – December 11, 2004, 07:58:36 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47672At 11:20 PM 12/11/2004 +0000, you wrote:QuoteSo it looks to me like it would be more economical to purchase the 25 year old coach, do the needed repairs right away, and have 10 years of RV enjoyment for less than the purchase price of the 15 year old coach. We have a 25-year-old coach right now, and will soon be in a position to either replace it with a much newer model or completely redo it, inside and out. We are leaning strongly toward getting a newer LD, and here's why. There are so many newer, better systems in place, both in the engine and in the coach portion, that it would be difficult to upgrade a 1980 unit to be truly equivalent to one that is, say, only 5-10 years old. Things like ABS, dual coach batteries, updated engine mechanics, even a generator (ours has the compartment but no modern generator will fit in it). We don't even have shoulder seatbelts! The time, effort, and expense to fully upgrade each and every system would be immense. In our case, neither one of us are serious mechanics nor do we want to learn the ins and outs of keeping an elderly vehicle going through thick and thin. There are so many really talented and energetic people on this list, who live and breathe repairs and improvements and who seem delighted to bring along their entire Snap-On toolbox...just in case...that I am eternally impressed. But we are not like that, and will never be. I want to feel secure and safe about driving all over the country without worrying about finding parts for an outdated engine or coach, or breakdowns in out-of-the-way places, or babying the LD all the time to avoid problems. I'm committed to doing regular maintenance and driving sensibly, but I don't want to have to worry about old-car problems every time I turn the key. Like so many other decisions (30' versus 23', boondocking versus hookups, etc.), this is one that we can enjoy discussing without having to agree on. Vive la difference, and all that. :-) BTW, I thought that 1969 model might be a lot of fun for a "project person" who just loves fixing things, especially since the engine sounded like it was in decent shape. It's not for me, but I bet it's going to be a dream for somebody else, especially at that price (and I bet you bargain the owner down even further).Sonsie
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #5 – December 11, 2004, 08:17:21 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47674oryoki, I agree with your idea that given the same condition and mileage, it makes sense to buy the older and cheaper LD. I just can't accept that the condition of an LD is mainly a function of mileage. I would expect a 10 year older vehicle to have problems associated with age
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #6 – December 11, 2004, 09:32:27 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47678Quote from: lejest2003 LD Group I've been following the Natchez Trace thread (never been on the Trace)and noticed that it is apparently speed limited, scenic and worthwhile, like the Blue Ridge (which I have done, end to end). While I may never get that far east again () I took note that someone drove it in just over 400 miles in two days.Now to me that is a correct speed for folks out to see the country in an RV, especially a Lazy Daze. It has been our practice ever since retirement that we will not drive over 200 miles on any given day unless there is a pressing need to do otherwise.Steve S. Lazy BonesI, too, agree with you, Steve. This subject has been discussed extensively on RV.net and the only ones who disagree are not yet retired. They, sadly, have to press to cram as much as possible into a limited period of time. I was able, in my three-week trip home from the factory, to motor along at 50-65 without disrupting traffic and it was a PLEASURE. Also, my radar detector is history too. I'm looking forward to navigating the Trace at 40-50 mph!!!NH Paul
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #7 – December 11, 2004, 11:54:12 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47684Count us in the 200 mi. a day, or less, category. It took some time to convince my husband that this is the way to travel, but, in the end it wasn't me who convinced him...it was his knees. My back had been telling me the same thing for years!Sharon N.
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #8 – December 12, 2004, 08:41:03 am Yahoo Message Number: 47695QuoteI don't believe I've ever seen one of this age; but if the original milesQuotefigure is correct, This was a subject I hoped to talk about more when I originally wrote a subject new versus old a while ago and only got 2 answers. With Oroyki's view on the subject it sounds like it would be the better bet to buy the older one, but, would I buy a 25 year old car as my mode of transportation? Never. So why would I buy a 20 or 25 year old rv to have to depend on travelling by myself. I do like fixing things up and was hoping some of the owners of older ld's would chime in. I only got one answer from someone that had an older one. Older ld's still interest me and I'm still sitting on the fence with this one. It would be nice to hear from folks that bought vintage 80's ld's and see how they feel the reliability is versus buying a newer one with better technology.
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #9 – December 12, 2004, 10:00:31 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47751ALL RIGHT, Steve !!!My kinda traveler. You hit it right on the head. Now, we can sit back and wait for Nukamper to come out from behind his yellow tape and tell us what wimps we are for our slow pace of life.We left home three weeks and have traveled a total of 1388 miles. We went over 200 miles (217) only one day; two days were less than 50 miles each.To make this LD-related, I'll say that only
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #10 – December 13, 2004, 06:10:47 am Yahoo Message Number: 47765"So it looks to me like it would be more economical to purchase the 25 year old coach, do the needed repairs right away, and have 10 years of RV enjoyment for less than the purchase price of the 15 year old coach."oryokiThrough the years, I have owned several old trucks and vans that were restored and used as daily drivers. At about the twenty-year-old point, many parts start becoming difficult to obtain especially dealer only ones. The few dollars one saves buying a 20+ year old LD will offset by the frustration of obtaining replacement parts. Unless you really enjoy tracking down hard to obtain parts, buy something a little newer.Larry
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #11 – December 13, 2004, 08:59:37 am Yahoo Message Number: 47770Quote My kinda traveler. You hit it right on the head. Now, we can sit back and wait for Nukamper to come out from behind his yellow tape and tell us what wimps we are for our slow pace of life. Ted, why are you trying to get me stirred up again. But OK, I'm stepping out from behind the barricades to give you some daily mile figures.Our favorite place is Grand Teton/Yellowstone Ntl. Pks. We are near Cleveland, Ohio. When we hear the western mountains calling us, we drive about 500 miles per day so we can get there in 3.5 days! I must have "attention deficit disorder" because I find the drive through Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, and Nebraska kind of boring . The most exciting part of this drive is the nerve racking drive around the Chicago area, and that kind of excitement I can do without! I don't mean to offend any residents of those states, we've met nice people in all of them. But given the choice of driving 200 mpd and taking 11 days to get there, I'll take my extra days along the banks of the Snake River. Yea, I'm retired, but I'm still in a hurry. Guess its my continuing immaturity. The bad news is our LD now has over 30,000 miles in less than 18 months of use. Yikes!To be a little more serious about this, we have found that historicaly we average 50 mph while in transit, this includes all of our stops for food, fuel and ahem, other pit stops. We did the same pace while towing a trailer and now do the same with the LD. Driving at this pace is so much more relaxing in the LD. Fewer fuel stops and far less stress in campgrounds. And we average 10.012 mpg too, no toad. I finally feel like I'm above average at something!. My teachers should see me now!Steve K. (heading back behind the yellow tape)
Re: 200 Mile Limit Reply #12 – December 13, 2004, 09:40:43 am Yahoo Message Number: 47774nukamper2000 wrote:But given the choice of driving 200 mpd and taking 11 days to get there, I'll take my extra days along the banks of the Snake River.I agree. I've done several cross-country (and up and down country) marathons in driving days that are just short of blood-clot- producing duration; it takes a long time (and a lot of "scenically neutral" territory) to get just about anywhere else from California! When I *do* get to an area destination, daily travel lengths shorten considerably, and is limited to leisurely exploration. It's not a matter of not having time, but rather getting through places I don't want to be to places I do!Joan
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #13 – December 13, 2004, 09:46:58 am Yahoo Message Number: 47775It would be nice to hear from folks that bought vintage 80's ld's and see how they feel the reliability is versus buying a newer one with better technology. Well, here's my 2 cents worth. I guess Big Red, being a 1989 Chevy, would be considered "vintage". He doesn't seem that way to me, though the engine and tranny have 103,000+ miles on both. Since buying him 1 1/2 years ago, I've put the usual $3-4,000 into him mostly engine, transmission, suspension and some "gee, I'd like that" items. I'm not mechanically inclined, so I have the local GMC dealer look him over every spring to make sure any needed safety items that need attention are taken care of. To me, it's worth the cost for peace of mind...and we've never broken down on a trip. And right now, I'm confident I could pull him out of storage and drive across country.I traveled 1800 miles to buy him but I wasn't in him more than 5 minutes and knew "he was da one." Wasn't the floor plan I was looking for, but the coach was in such fine shape, my thinking was the coach was worth it, even if the underneath stuff, engine, suspension, tires, etc, weren't [though in the big picture, the underneath stuff was pretty good too]. I wanted a fuel injected engine, not a carbed Chevy like the mid-80's and earlier models, so 1989 was about as far back as I wanted to go. No solar, no generator, no shoulder harnesses, no TV, but that's fine. I've always wondered if I'd ever trade Big Red away...and I have to be honest, probably not, but I know someday he too will go. I paid $12,000 and put another $3-$4,000 into him. 10 years from now, he'll probably still be worth a couple of thousand to someone, even if all they want to do is park him in the woods for a deer hunting "shack". The depreciation over that period of time is peanuts compared to a new one. Do I have the conveniences of a new one? Heck no. But I don't have the costs. Go with a 25 year old rig? I don't think I would, that's beyond where I'd personally feel comfortable, but others might be OK with it. Out to 15 years or so, I wouldn't have a problem. 350 underpowered, heck yes, but what's the rush? I don't tow a toad and watch the rest of the weight.John & Cheryl 1989 22' RL Big Red
Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #14 – December 13, 2004, 01:50:36 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47791It would be nice to hear from folks that bought vintage 80's ld's and see how they feel the reliability is versus buying a newer one with better technology.Two more cents worth!Our LD is vintage early 90's but we still updated an older LD. My wife and I decided to buy a used LD. We wanted one from the early 90's, a 26' model for sure. We wanted a RB and were lucky to find a very nice 1994. I wanted as much newer technology as possible and the E350 with the 460 V8, a motor I was familiar with. The 94 26' RB floor plan is almost the same as a 2005 26' RB, which we really liked. This LD came with a generator and the rest was the basic factory stuff. Over the last 6 months we have added everything that we really wanted in an LD. Solar panel, new tires, steel valve extenders, new house and engine batteries. A quality hard wired inverter, Satellite dish, 20" LCD TV, VCR/DVD, new curtains, Fantastic fans, and quality shocks. So far the extras have been about $4,800. Not cheap by any means, but overall we have a very nice 26' RB with 31,000 miles. At 11 years old we have a very solid motorhome. A testiment to the quality of a Lazy Daze. Our total cost to date has been about 35% of a new 2005 26' RB. It gives us a great RV to use now and in 4 or 5 years when we retire we will sell the 94 and buy a new LD for our retirement years. I think the best part so far has been the fun of upgrading things the way we want them. It has been exciting to do and the additions have made our LD very safe and comfortable.Scott 94 26' RB
Re: [Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #15 – December 13, 2004, 02:25:49 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47792At 07:48 PM 12/13/2004 +0000, you wrote:QuoteNot cheap by any means, but overall we have a very nice 26' RB with 31,000 miles. At 11 years old we have a very solid motorhome. A testiment to the quality of a Lazy Daze. Our total cost to date has been about 35% of a new 2005 26' RB. It gives us a great RV to use now and in 4 or 5 years when we retire we will sell the 94 and buy a new LD for our retirement years. This is what we plan to do, also. We currently own a 1980 model, which we feel we need to sell and get a newer model. We've more or less decided on something 10 years old or less, if possible, but with fairly low miles (under 50,000). To us, a 1994 with such low mileage would be positively new!As others have commented, up to about 15 years of age, I'd have no particular fear of driving anywhere, assuming the LD was well-maintained. But once you get close to (or pass over) the 20-year mark, you are just waiting for various systems to fail. To say nothing of the vast improvements in vehicle safety, operations, and interior improvements in the house part that have occurred in the past 20 years. The serious mechanics and fixer-uppers in the group would no doubt be willing to assume more risk because they are more knowledgeable and skilled at repairs and engine issues. What's that great Clint Eastwood line..."You've got to know your limitations"? Well, we know ours, so we'll be in the market for a newer LD soon.Sonsie
[Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #16 – December 13, 2004, 08:57:24 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47807Well, since we have heard (2) two cents worths, I guess I'm adding another two which brings us to six cents! My coach is 21 years old and is approaching the 25 year mark. I think the one thing that you have to consider is how well the previous owner(s) maintained their rig. I use that as a gage
The paint job Reply #17 – December 13, 2004, 09:17:22 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47810Dave! Wow, your LD looks incredible! Great paint job and great color!Patty
Re: The paint job Reply #18 – December 13, 2004, 10:14:16 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47813Thank you. :-)
[Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #19 – December 14, 2004, 06:54:10 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47870Hi, everyone,Dave's comment about a "desert cooler misting system" has piqued my interest.We have a low tech, not entirely satisfactory solution to excessive engine heat. When the needle threatens to hit the red zone, we turn on the heater/defroster full blast. Works okay for the engine, but not very comfortable for the passengers. Are we nuts? Are your heads shaking in disbelief all over cyberspace? Is there a better way?What do you who own vintage Lazy Daze' do to bleed off excessive engine heat, say, going up a long grade during a 100 degree heat wave? Happens every trip!A quick Google came up with this article. http://www.flxible.net/misting.htmlAnybody here tried something like this?Kathy '86 TK 22 ft. Chevy 350 "Clampmobile"
Re: [Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #20 – December 14, 2004, 06:59:21 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47871When I was in college, I had a "vintage" Toyota Celica, and until I could have afford to have the overheating problem repaired, the heat-on-full-blast method worked like a charm. I'm not shaking my head at all!!Pattykelautz wrote:
Re: [Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #21 – December 14, 2004, 07:19:35 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47874At 12:54 AM 12/15/2004 +0000, you wrote:QuoteWhen the needle threatens to hit the red zone, we turn on the heater/defroster full blast. Works okay for the engine, but not very comfortable for the passengers. Are we nuts? Are your heads shaking in disbelief all over cyberspace? Is there a better way? We've never actually had to do this in our LD, but have done it, many times, in our older cars. It works, but you're right...it's really hard on the passengers inside.Sonsie
[Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #22 – December 14, 2004, 08:28:55 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47877"When the needle threatens to hit the red zone, we turn on the heater/defroster full blast. Works okay for the engine, but not very comfortable for the passengers. Are we nuts?" Not at all. This is good practice in that situation, and I've seen it recommended by a number of experts. It simply gives the engine another way to shed heat--literally turns on a second radiator. The radiator mister (http://www.flxible.net/misting.html>) sounds eminently workable, if you run into these conditions often. It couldn't do any harm and it's pretty easy to make, so why not give it a try?Andy Baird
[Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #23 – December 14, 2004, 08:55:51 pm Yahoo Message Number: 47879Some high performance aircraft (the WWII P-51 Mustang comes to mind) used a spray bar ahead of the radiator. When needed a spray of water goes onto the radiator and makes a major difference
[Life With A Lazy Daze RV] Re: Vintage LD for Sale Reply #24 – December 15, 2004, 07:15:17 am Yahoo Message Number: 47887"Dave's comment about a "desert cooler misting system" has piqued my interest." Our 1983 22' FL ran hot during our semi-annual trips up Interstate 5 to the PNW and BC. We added a "desert super-cooler', sold by Bidena. It used a small water pump and two drip-irrigation spray nozzles to spray and cool the engine. It was operated by an under dash controller, which contained a timer to regulate the on-off cycling of the pump. The sprayer worked like a champ and made a noticeable difference, especially on 100+ degree-days. It was plumbed into the LD's water supply and seemed to use very little water. Ideally, no water should drip from the radiator; all the water should evaporate. Excess water does not add to the cooling process. It would be a good project for an older LD with marginal cooling. It can be built with parts accumulated from the auto parts store, home center and Radio Shack. This is not a cure for a motorhome with a bad radiator or other mechanical problems.The good news is that our 2003 LD has a powerful cooling system and does not need supplemental cooling.Larry
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