Automatic Transfer Switch April 24, 2023, 06:56:41 pm I am thinking of adding a 2000 Watt inverter to my solar and lithium upgrade and I read some place that I also need to upgrade my ATS. I currently have a 450 watt inverter that was installed by Lazy Daze for the front entertainment center and I want to replace that with a larger inverter. Most ATS that I see online are made for two sources for electricity, shore and generator. Shouldn't I have a three source to include the inverter? If so, could someone give me links to good ATS that have 3 sources of inputs. I also found out that my converter does not have the Li/WIX switch so I need to get an upgraded 4645 to handle the Li batteries.Thanks and much appreciated. My upgrades start next week.Kevin
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #1 – April 24, 2023, 09:27:39 pm Hi Kevin; Your Progressive Dynamics 4655 converter is new enough, (2017), that I think it can work with LiFePO4 batteries. You don't have the jumper to do it easily. You should e-mail "sales at bestconverters<dot>com, Randy. I think you just have to disable the 4 stage (3 stage, bulk/absorb/float and equalize) charging, and adjust it for 14.4 volts. The Absorb runs at 14.2 volts which should work well. that would save $$$ and time. RonB 2 Likes
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #2 – April 24, 2023, 10:08:16 pm Quote from: kevin hannah - April 24, 2023, 06:56:41 pmI am thinking of adding a 2000 Watt inverter to my solar and lithium upgrade and I read some place that I also need to upgrade my ATS. I currently have a 450 watt inverter that was installed by Lazy Daze for the front entertainment center and I want to replace that with a larger inverter. Most ATS that I see online are made for two sources for electricity, shore and generator. Shouldn't I have a three source to include the inverter? If so, could someone give me links to good ATS that have 3 sources of inputs. I also found out that my converter does not have the Li/WIX switch so I need to get an upgraded 4645 to handle the Li batteries.The 2000-watt whole-house inverters I installed in the past had a transfer switch built into the inverter. Prosine 2.0 Inverter | FlickrCity power enters the inverter before it goes to the transfer switch. When city power is available, it passes through the inverter to the Power Center, When city power is disconnected and the inverter is operational, the built-in transfer switch connects the inverter's output to the Power Center. The inverter should have a separate 30-amp breaker installed to act as a disconnect.An inverter without a built-in transfer switch will require a second inverter for a whole-house installation.Another option is a stand-alone inverter that is used intermittently or just for a few devices. Our LD's inverter is set up this way with power supplied to the microwave and plugs for the few things we used that need 120-VAC power. Almost every electrical device we use daily is available in 12-volt versions, with the exception of the microwave and A/C. The advantage is a much lower cost and simplified installationThe cables between the battery and inverter need to be very large, with 2-gauge or 1-gauge, depending on the maximum amperage draw of the inverter and the length of the battery cables. Mount the inverter as close to the battery as possible to reduce voltage drop. A high-capacity fuse (250-300 amp) needs to be installed close to the battery.I suggest renting or buying a professional-grade crimper for the cables, the hammer-type crimpers, which I used for years, do not produce as good or durable a connection to the lugs.Our LD's PD9270 converter was on Battleborn's approved list and has worked fine, quickly changing the batteries.What allows today's lithium batteries work with many existing converters and solar chargers are the robust BMS battery controllers.Larry 2 Likes
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #3 – April 25, 2023, 06:10:01 pm Hi Ron and Larry,Your advise is always appreciated. I will email Randy at Best Converters as suggested by Ron and I am thinking of only using the inverter for a few items, eg microwave and tv but may include the fridge. Again I appreciate you for your time in answering my questions and freely giving of you knowledge.Kevin
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #4 – April 25, 2023, 08:17:00 pm Quote from: kevin hannah - April 25, 2023, 06:10:01 pmYour advise is always appreciated. I will email Randy at Best Converters as suggested by Ron and I am thinking of only using the inverter for a few items, eg microwave and tv but may include the fridge.The fridge on AC mode uses a considerable amount of power for extended times - I do not recommend using it through the inverter. I have a whole-house manual transfer switch I use with our inverter, and when using it I switch the fridge from auto to gas only mode. Short runs of the microwave, hair dryer, and occasional low-power of our space heater after a shower do not significantly impact the charge of 200Ah of LFP energy storage.Steve 3 Likes
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #5 – April 26, 2023, 07:47:47 pm Like Larry, our LD's inverter is set up to run the microwave or supply power to one half of two duplex outlets (plugs) for the hair dryer or low power counter top appliances (coffee grinder, waterpik, blender....short duration). The above counter half outlet is plugged into the other half of the microwave plug, so is only live when the manual microwave relay (bus transfer) is activated. So the microwave display turns on. I guess a crockpot or such could be plugged in. I would want good solar amperage to keep the batteries up."The cables between the battery and inverter need to be very large, with 2-gauge...." I used fine stranded 2 gauge (make sure it is real copper, not copper clad). 2 Gauge 2 AWG 5 Feet Black + 5 Feet Red (10 Feet Total) Welding Battery Pure... "Mount the inverter as close to the battery as possible to reduce voltage drop..." I placed the inverter about 5 feet away. "A high-capacity fuse (250-300 amp) needs to be installed close to the battery..." I used a 200A ANL fuse. "I suggest renting or buying a professional-grade crimper for the cables....." I used this one iCrimp Battery Cable Lug Crimping Tool for 8, 6, 4, 2, 1, 1/0 AWG Heavy Duty... I already had a cutter of this type. I used #4 terminals, they fit better with the fine strand wire. Hole size depends on what you are hooking to. Amazon.com: 50pcs Copper Wire Lugs,10 Types UL Listed Heavy Duty Wire Lugs... The wire has EPDM insulation and is more heat and abrasion resistant than PVC. Stripping it takes care to avoid nicking the wires. I put rosin flux inside the terminal. Crimped it on the wire, then soldered it (propane torch). Cleaned it up and heat shrink'ed it with a hot air gun. Pretty time intensive and a bit of an 'art'. RonB As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Automatic Transfer Switch Reply #6 – April 26, 2023, 08:01:00 pm Hi Kevin: Using the house battery or in my case the alternator powered DC/DC converter to run the inverter; to power the refrigerator while traveling, can be done to avoid using propane while in motion. But as Steve says, the refrigerator runs best on propane. I've had many people recommend 12vdc Freon compressor refrigerators as a replacement 'fridge. I'm still running the original Dometic supplied by LD. (can't last too much longer?) I've got 400 AH of LiF right now, but I don't want to be dependent on sunlight to keep the 'fridge going, so I may stay with propane. RonB
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