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Topic: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking) (Read 361 times) previous topic - next topic - Topic derived from Timing cover leaking/...
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Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
"I know some folks think I'll kill my resale value by putting in a composting toilet, but I have to do it.  For me personally, I prefer compost and a larger water capacity to having to carry and deal with a black tank."
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Potential resale value would be the least of my concerns about installing a composting toilet system in an RV; I hope that you will thoroughly research all aspects of (selection, purchase, and installation and) actually using, maintaining a compost toilet system.

Frankly, dealing with the black and grey tanks is not a big deal; proper management of black and grey tanks, including dumping, is simple, straightforward, and efficient. You may want to consider getting some experience in traditional RV waste tank use before spending a lot of money on a composting toilet system.

For sure, YMMV!
2003 TK has a new home
Re: Composting toilets (split from Re: Timing cover leaking/Replace rear window gasket)
Reply #1 –
Hi Mimi,

When we first purchased our 27' RB we had been watching all the wonderful videos from the Wynn's on Gone With The Wynn's.

Everything they did was very intriguing. The composting toilet was one of the ideas that we had considered as a future option. Pretty straight forward. Seemed very doable. But in the end, we decided to live with the rig as is for a year or two to see how all the standard RV equipment worked.

You mentioned the aspect of using the added capacity of the black tank for gray water (I would imagine) in the event that you went with the composing system.

The Wynn's addressed this issue and for them in the particular rig they were currently living in (Class A) it was feasible. It was a simple matter of connecting the two tanks at they're internal system.

I'm not so sure the LD you now proudly own is capable of connecting the Black & Gray tanks to increase your Gray Tank capacity and hence your time away from the dump.

Another thing to remember is that you are still obligated to dump your Gray Tank at a Dump Station. So the eventual duty at that end of the RV spectrum is still going to occur.

As I recall, The Wynn's moved to several Class A's over the years of their RVing life. They only added a composting toilet once. I'm not certain of their reasoning behind that move.

Back to my LD. I've decided that dumping really isn't a big deal. I've got my Flush King and my Flo Jet Macerator a spray bottle of bleach, rags and plenty of rubber gloves just waiting for the task.

Believe it or not, it's a great place to meet people. "Where ya from?" I've even had people catch up with me at the CG Dump to check out the LD. "Looks new! Really? They still making LD's?"

Hey, it's no picnic grounds, but it is certainly a local gathering hole.

So for me and my DW, we'll stay with the standard gear. As its been said, YMMV.

Just sayin,

Kent
2015 27' RB "MissB.Haven"
Re: Composting toilets (split from Re: Timing cover leaking/Replace rear window gasket)
Reply #2 –
"...dumping really isn't a big deal." "I've got my Flush King and my Flo Jet Macerator a spray bottle of bleach, rags and plenty of rubber gloves just waiting for the task."

Wheuww, seems like overkill for such a simple procedure! With a single hose I'm in and out again in under 10 minutes... and it would be less if the tanks would drain quicker.   :-*
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Composting toilets (split from Re: Timing cover leaking/Replace rear window gasket)
Reply #3 –
Quote from: Kent Heckethorn  - 
Another thing to remember is that you are still obligated to dump your Gray Tank at a Dump Station. So the eventual duty at that end of the RV spectrum is still going to occur.
Besides dumping the gray water legally (not down a gopher hole) there is liquid produced by the composting toilet that also needs to be dumped.
It too cannot be legally dumped on the ground.
Any way you try to deal with this will still require periodically finding a legal place to dump plus a place to shovel out the compost for legal disposal.
Sounds nice. And this is going to easier and more pleasant than simply dumping?
Dumping isn't that big a deal, once done a few times. You will still have to do it, no matter how you modify your LD.
A composting toilet will just add more unpleasant chores and odors to your routine. Yes, they have to be maintained.

You have a long list of repairs and upgrades, I suggest you proceed with them and leave the decision about radically changing the holding tanks for the future when your actual experiences provide a more realistic view on how things operate in the RVing world. 
The idea of composting toilet is not new to the RV world or LDs.  We have had several forum members, over the years, that wanted to do the same.
One or two have proceeded but never reported back, as would have been expected if the project had been a success.
As Joan has warned, this extensive a modification could/will severely lower the value and the ability to sell it, in the future.

One last thing. Your 1992 TK E350 only has an 11,000-lbs GVW, much lower than the E450'S 14,050-lbs GVW.
This is the reason why I recommend 2003 and later 23.5' TK , FL and FDs.
I have known two owners who have full timed in the same model and both rigs suffered from being at or over the GVW, all the time.
The 1992 TK does not have much extra CCC. Going lightweight and minimal is the name of the game here.
The low CCC extremely limits the addition of extra gear. A composting toilet is going to add weight plus the weight of the stored sewage, which takes quite a bit of time to process. An E450 would have been a better choice for this project.
After fully loading you 'new' LD,  weight it and see how much extra CCC you have left.
It probably isn't going to be much.

Larry


Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Composting toilets (split from Re: Timing cover leaking/Replace rear window gasket)
Reply #4 –
Steve,

That is just what's available in my bay for dumping. The Flo Jet I reserve for Home Base.

Mimi, don't think dumping is all that much work. My typical dump involves the Flush King (I don't really like dragging a nasty black hose over the dinette) and the dump hose.

5 minutes or so and I'm on to the Potable station for the drinking water.

The bleach is for the Flush King. Spritz it off and a rinse. Easy-Peesy. Total time at the dump really shouldn't take more than 10-15 minutes. Unless of course a conversation at the ol' stomping ground ensues. "No way! Really?"

Kent
2015 27' RB "MissB.Haven"
Re: Composting toilets (split from Re: Timing cover leaking/Replace rear window gasket)
Reply #5 –
Split this discussion of composting toilets and general dumping practices out from an unrelated thread.
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #6 –
Ha!   I'm with Kent......I've met some nice people at the dump station. 😳 Even if I've only been there for a few minutes.  
Rebecca in WA
2016 mid-bath
"Ramirez"
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #7 –
A retired couple next to us at here Escapade in Tucson have been using a composting toilet in their Sprinter based Sportsmobile for about 18 months.  I cannot validate their claim of three to four weeks between dumps, but my mini-tour of their rig verified that 'aroma' is not an issue. 

I'd consider experimenting with that option if we were full-timing without a home base since black tank capacity is our main limitation.

Steve
2015 TK
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #8 –
Well. I think it's prudent of me to wait to do anything drastic.  I did want to swap out for a composting toilet to increase my gray water capacity and of course I would dump that legally.  Never thought to do otherwise.  My goal was to extend my ability to boondock.  I know it's a light rig. I know the GVWR is low.  I bought it with that in mind.  It fits well with my agenda and my life right now.  I intend to travel light and I realize now (thank you Paul) that means I really can't have a second gray tank. I guess experience dumping is much needed here.  Points, very well taken.  Getting my rig in top shape is most important to me now. I have one main expectation; that I want to be comfortable.  If I discover that maintaining a black tank and dumping isn't for me, I'll decide what to do at that time.
Save a life.
Adopting a pet is the closest a human
will ever come to choosing a relative.
hsus.org  aspca.org
1992 Lazy Daze T/K  23.5' Ford 460 c.i.d./7.6 liter V8 engine, electronic fuel injection, E4OD 4-speed auto transmission
Full time 6/2017
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #9 –
Quote from: Steve TK  - 
A retired couple next to us at here Escapade in Tucson have been using a composting toilet in their Sprinter based Sportsmobile for about 18 months.  I cannot validate their claim of three to four weeks between dumps, but my mini-tour of their rig verified that 'aroma' is not an issue. 

I'd consider experimenting with that option if we were full-timing without a home base since black tank capacity is our main limitation.

Steve

I do know from all the tiny house videos that dumping a composting toilet can stretch up to 2 months, that I've seen. The liquid is separated and can be easily emptied and because they never mix, there is no odor.  I've read a lot about odor issues with black tanks and if the stories are true, it made a composting toilet even more appealing given that there is no need for chemicals.   I will likely install one at some point, but probably not in this rig.  I do want to remove obstacles to boondocking for long periods, but will wait a bit.
Save a life.
Adopting a pet is the closest a human
will ever come to choosing a relative.
hsus.org  aspca.org
1992 Lazy Daze T/K  23.5' Ford 460 c.i.d./7.6 liter V8 engine, electronic fuel injection, E4OD 4-speed auto transmission
Full time 6/2017
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures
Reply #10 –
Here is a couple from The FitRV.com doing a review of  composting toilets: 

Title:  "The Straight Poop on our Composting Toilet"
URL:    The Straight Poop on our Composting Toilet

I also follow the Wynns and was almost won over until I saw this review.  And, also, my Husband said "No way!"   s/Terry
Terry Apple
2013 RB 27 Baby Blue Bentley
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #11 –
The Wynns are no longer full-time RVers. They have moved on to sailing the world on their catamaran,  They installed a compost toilet in their boat, and are still advocates of the system.  I follow other sailing channels on YouTube, and more than just a handful also use composters on their boats.   Lying at anchor in a pristine lagoon in the South Pacific is a sailors way of multi-day boondocking. Many of the most popular (and in some cases, overused) sailing destinations have established very strict waste dumping mandates, and composting is one way around some of those restrictions.
2017 RB
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures
Reply #12 –
Quote from: Terry Apple  - 
URL:    The Straight Poop on our Composting Toilet
I also follow the Wynns and was almost won over until I saw this review.  And, also, my Husband said "No way!"  s/Terry
Well, that video was enough to convince me...not to have one. I see no advantages and a bunch of downsides.
First, theres a bucket of liquid (up to 2-gallons of urine) that needs to be dumped everyday...in a legal dump or toilet. That cannot be legally dumped on the ground.
There is a lot of rules of usage and several maintenance items to perform including adding fiber, cleaning and disposing of the processed compost. It uses battery power for a fan.
And it provides no way to properly  dispose of the gray water, other than a legal dump. You will still need to find fresh water.
So, what are the big advantages for boon docking or for someone who doesn't want to deal with the black tank?

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #13 –
As a (nearly) life-long boater, field marine biologist, commercial diver, and marine science educator,  I've never understood the composting toilet idea on a boat, with one exception:  Those who live on a mooring close to shore and rarely move their boat.  I suppose this may apply to some RVers as well.

When not in harbor, we anchor close to shore for a few days, and then move on, similar to what we do with our RV's. When the black tank gets close to full, we dump about 35 gallons offshore, typically 5 miles offshore or more.  Whales poop more than that.  (I've been nearby underwater when that happens, but that is a different story). San Diego dumps up to 215 million gallons of "advanced primary " treated sewage every day at the same distance offshore and municipal effluent contains far worse things than our black tank.  (The Hyperion plant in Los Angeles dumps 450 - 800 million gallons per day of secondary treated effluent in wet weather).  We call this our 5 mile cruise, sort of like Gilligan's Island.  It makes us take the boat out and run all the pumps and motors and engine, which is good for the boat.   Taking a boat ride is always fun.  Gotta wash it down when we return, which is good exercise for us.  For folks in slips who can't move their boat, a service exists that comes by the boat and pumps out the black tank for a modest fee.  With no disrespect intended toward anyone, a composting toilet just doesn't make any sense if one moves the boat or rig on occasion while boondocking or stays in a harbor or a campground. 

Dumping a black tank in an RV is pretty quick and simple.  Sewage access isn't difficult to find.  In one interesting case, I needed to dump the black and asked a guy in front of his house if he knew where I could dump my tank.  He said "no, but I have a sewer clean-out right here next to the street and you are welcome to dump here".  I accepted his offer, and then made him a cup of coffee when we were all finished and had a nice conversation.

'Just my .02. 

HD
2014 27 MB
Towd: Either the Jeep Wrangler or trailer containing the BMW R1200GS and 2 E-bicycles
Happy wife=Happy life
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #14 –
The appeal of a composting toilet is the possibility of going much longer without having to dump the tank. Most of the cons have been discussed here.

However, in our 30' IB the toilet sits above the rear wheel and sits up pretty high already. Every composting toilet I looked at is significantly taller than what we have and would require a step stool to climb on board.

Jim
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #15 –
Ok Harold,

I know you or anyone on LDO or in the RV community would never do anything quite so crass as "Cousin Eddie" but this next clip was begging to be played.

https://youtu.be/BeskbiJjCXI

Holy cow. Maybe a Composting Toilet would serve Cousin Eddie well.

Kent

2015 27' RB "MissB.Haven"
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #16 –
Yuk.  Class act.

Nice hat, though.

HD
2014 27 MB
Towd: Either the Jeep Wrangler or trailer containing the BMW R1200GS and 2 E-bicycles
Happy wife=Happy life
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures
Reply #17 –
Quote from: Terry Apple  - 
Here is a couple from The FitRV.com doing a review of  composting toilets: 

Title:  "The Straight Poop on our Composting Toilet"
URL:    The Straight Poop on our Composting Toilet

I also follow the Wynns and was almost won over until I saw this review.  And, also, my Husband said "No way!"   s/Terry

Thank you for this link. This is both the most informative and hilarious video I have seen on this subject (heck, on any subject for that matter). I was in tears in the segment demonstrating the "run and dump" method of not-so-surreptitious disposal of the liquid waste. What a terrific couple. I have to agree with other comentators. I don't see any advantage whatsoever to a composting toilet. They have to find a place to dispose of the liquid waste EVERY DAY!  And the solids only lasted five days or so. How does that allow for more extended boondocking?  Our '06 T! Which has the smallest tanks of any model, can beat that even with two users. YMMV, but for us, I'll continue to wrestle the blue python. -- Jon
(Former) ‘06 TK “Albatross.” And (former) Vespa 250.   Alas, no more; both are gone.😕 Great memories remain! 😄
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #18 –
I have often traveled for a week at a time with three adults. To extend the black tank usage between dumps, I employ two standing rules:

1) While in a CG, daytime usage of the LD facilities are restricted. CG restrooms are generally close at hand. Use them if you can.

2) Nightime usage. All other rules no longer apply.

This works well and I can avoid the dump for up to a week at a time.

Just sayin'

Kent
2015 27' RB "MissB.Haven"
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #19 –
"To extend the black tank usage between dumps..."
---
Several years ago, my  nephew and his (then) wife rented a class C for 10 days because their three kids wanted to go to Yellowstone. When they came back, I asked for a trip report, hoping I'd hear of wonderful sights and adventures! The kids all rolled their eyes and complained that the whole trip was awful; Dad wouldn't let anybody poop in the RV toilet because he didn't want to dump it!

The little joys of RVing are not for everyone.  ;)
2003 TK has a new home
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #20 –
The whole reason I have an RV is so I don't have to use public restrooms.    I'll dump as often as I need (onece/week typical) and I usually dump the gray tank twice as often as the black, because I like to shower at 'home'.  😬
Rebecca in WA
2016 mid-bath
"Ramirez"
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #21 –
Quote from: Rebecca Winters  - 
The whole reason I have an RV is so I don't have to use public restrooms.    I'll dump as often as I need (onece/week typical) and I usually dump the gray tank twice as often as the black, because I like to shower at 'home'.  😬
That's why most of us bought an RV in the first place.
I love having a hot shower at night.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
 
Re: Composting toilets and dumping procedures (split from Re: Timing cover leaking)
Reply #22 –
I finally watched the Fit RV video.....funny!   At my cabin in WA I use a composting toilet, so this topic is quite interesting to me.  The type of system that I use (Lovable Loo) is WAY easier to use than what they have going on there. No need to separate anything, just do what you need to do, and cover it with peet moss, no smells etc... plus I'm actually composting.    I'm good with what I have in my LD though. 

Thanks for posting. 
Rebecca in WA
2016 mid-bath
"Ramirez"