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Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
62 and retired, no one to help me with mechanics or fixing things up, ack! I am nervous about committing to the purchase of a local 23' Lazy Daze in pretty darn nice condition. I know nothing about mechanics.

I drove it, like it a lot and can see great trips ahead, although maybe pricey with about 8 miles to the gallon on the road!
Do you just jump in and worry later? I know I can't deliberate forever, and research will only get you so far. Sometime you've just got to try it out.

Making decisions alone is tough sometimes!

Advice please?
Suzanne Elizabeth
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #1 –
Read as much as you can stand on this and other forums. IRV2.com and goodsam are the 2 that I participate in ( in addition to this one). RV's are maintenance intensive by definition. Make sure you are on solid financial footing. Money stress won't be good when you hit the road. The "CPN" (cost per night) is around $150/ night for the typical RVer. Congratulations on your retirement.
Todd (and Steve)
'17 Winnebago Minnie Winnie and '13 Honda CRV
(Former '99 RB owners from 2012-2016)
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #2 –
Hello Suzanna and welcome to the Lazy Daze Owners Forum.  Your questions are important and sometimes time is of the essence when looking at a well maintained Lazy Daze.  If you could post the model year of this LD, then a good many people will have some model specific advice for you to consider.  You might also post the mileage.

If you are able to have this LD inspected or surveyed by an RV Inspector, then you will have some of the information that may be causing you some worry.  A good survey will include an inspection of the roof to the basement and front to back.  You should know if there were any leaks, repairs, or missing parts and equipment.  A good survey will include checking all the coach appliances, air conditioner, heater, water heater, propane tank, and so forth.  A good survey should include someone crawling on the roof and underneath the RV.  This kind of survey should cost somewhere around $300 but may not include a complete engine, transmission, brake, etc inspection.  However, a test drive and close examination of the maintenance records should give you some information about the truck's mechanical health.  Ask the owner to show you the maintenance and service records and determine the date of the tires and dates of all the batteries.

If the LD has been stored under a cover or inside, then that's a big advantage.  If it's been stored outside and is older than 7-8 years, the roof may need to be resealed, which is a big expense.  At the end of the day, if this LD has been properly serviced and not abused, then the Coach part of the LD should be rock solid since it's one of the strongest in the industry.  And if the truck part was properly serviced and doesn't have high mileage, then less to worry about.

This Forum has a good number of women whose story is somewhat like your story.  And I must confess, I wish I knew half of what they have forgotten about the "care and feeding" of their LD.  I hope my rambling comments are helpful.  Please keep us informed on your progress.  Best of luck.

P.S.  Our cost per day is much less than amount quoted by Todd.  On a recent 6 week trip, our fuel, camping fees, etc. cost was $1800.  I didn't count the cost of storage, insurance, and so forth, just the traveling costs.  And some of the boondocker's costs are considerably less than our costs.  Just some additional information for your consideration.
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #3 –
The "CPN" (cost per night) is around $150/ night for the typical RVer.
----
 ???  What are the criteria you used to calculate this figure? 
2003 TK has a new home
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #4 –
Hi and Welcome.  I don't think you need to be mechanically inclined to own an RV.  You DO need to know how & when to operate the various components, like the generator, and to know when routine service on the rig is necessary.  The owners' manual will help with that.  There may be 2 manuals, the truck manual, and hopefully the coach manual.

Other things to learn include how to hook-up, how to dump, how to level your RV, how to winterize, and how to back up.  All are skills that are quite learnable (I even did it).  Many of these can be practiced at a campground nearby.

In my opinion, there are two key things to check besides all of the appliances.  Check around all windows, the coach door, and every seem in the cab-over for leaks.  Water intrusion kills RVs, because of mildew and wood rot.  Make sure the areas around those places are not "squishy" as you gently push on them.  Smell for mildew.  The second key thing to check is the tire date codes.  These codes are molded into each tire side wall and indicate the Week & Year of manufacture.  So, a code 0615 would indicate a manufacture during the 6th week of 2015.  RV tires need to be replaced at 6 years of age no matter how good the tire tread looks.  Also, check for cracking along the side walls of the tires.  The reason is UV radiation takes a major toll on the tires over time.

Best wishes for finding the RV you want.
2011 MB
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #5 –
There's an excellent resource here for women like you. Read as many thread posts as you can. The wisdom is really inspirational.

Start here Travels with Gertie
Also read the couple of pinned links at the beginning of this forum. There is a reason there are only a couple-  they are essential reading.

My view on your question about jumping in- it depends. If this is a big outlay of money, never act precipitously. A motor home is always declining in value. And the cost to keep one running goes up as they age. If this is a casual purchase for you, by all means jump in and consider any later costs tuition !

YMMV, some of us spend more than we need to make our old LDs as updated, well preserved, unique, perfect as possible. Others are happy if it runs most of the time, and the bed is dry.

As for MPG costs, read Andy's excellent post

Tell us more about your expectations !

I am not home, or I would volunteer to look at the one you are considering.
Paul
'92 Mid Bath
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #6 –
"The 'CPN' (cost per night) is around $150/ night for the typical RVer."

I don't know how you arrived at that figure, but it sounds extremely high to me... unless perhaps you're making monthly payments on an RV loan, staying in the most expensive ($50-$100/night) full-hookup commercial RV parks, and eating your meals in restaurants.

Setting aside for the moment initial purchase cost, camping costs can range anywhere from zero, if you camp on public lands as I normally do, to $5-$20 if you stay in state parks, to as much as you want to spend if you stay at deluxe RV "resorts" with swimming pools, miniature golf and other amenities. Food costs need not be any different from what they would be for a home or apartment dweller, so I'm not counting those. Utility costs can be minimal if you have solar power. Of course maintenance costs can't be ignored... but it's hard to see how one arrives at $150 a night. If that were really typical, most RVers would sell their rigs and stay in hotels instead!

Citing a single (high) number for cost per night without explaining in detail what it's based on is misleading at best. If we're going to talk about costs, let's talk about what goes into that total.
Andy Baird
2021 Ford Ranger towing 2019 Airstream 19CB
Previously: 1985 LD Twin/King "Gertie"; 2003 LD Midbath "Skylark"
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #7 –
How about this?  Consider the worst case scenario.

If you try a Lazy Daze and decide it's not for you, you can probably turn around and resell it for close to what you paid (assuming good condition, fair pricing, etc...).  The vast majority of RV's do not have the strong resale market that you'll find with a Lazy Daze.

The other worst case scenario is wondering about what could have been with a tinge of regret.

I will say though that if you're concerned about the price of fuel, you may want to think twice.  Most of us have experienced other much larger expenses.

edited to add: I see from another thread that you're looking at an older less expensive rig.  Statistically, it's good to be financially prepared for some repairs.  If losing that $7500 (ie. the value goes to $0) would impact your life in a significant way, I'd be careful.  It's easy to get in deep before you know it.  If you would regret the loss of money but move on with your life, I'd be more likely to jump in. 

Rich
'03 MB in NC
2003 MB
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #8 –
Specifics here, if interested in a quick look: Lazy Daze , 23' class "C"

The more I read, the more I feel I should focus on setting aside additional funds for a newer RV.  That, or trade in my Mazda 3 (free and clear title) and get a vehicle to tow my already-owned vintage Belle travel trailer, a mere 15' - but it's just me and my dog.

I am feeling overwhelmed considering both surprise/emergent- and ongoing- maintenance of an older (1988!) RV which has done some 70,000 miles and has towed a bit, too.

Rich, will I have a tinge of regret? Yes, absolutely. Even the feminine interior suited me. New tires? Yes, all of them. Ready to rock 'n roll. But maybe I'm just not there yet, or I wouldn't be so danged hesitant. Who knows, I may decide differently in the morning.

I know a mechanic's check is recommended. I guess I just trust that the current owner who is 72 wasn't out on the highway with his cherished wife in an unsafe rig. I'll leave it at that.

I've always found buying to be easier than selling, doesn't matter if it was a horse, horse trailer, or a ... whatever. 

Thanks, y'all. I'll stay and lurk and learn, if you don't mind. Okay if I pop in and visit when I see a Lazy Daze group out and about? Love the community!
Suzanne Elizabeth
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #9 –
I base CPN on the following assumptions....(Nervous nellie should count costs before buying in my opinion).

90 nights "out" annually. (I don't pretend to know anything about a fulltimer's costs).
4,000 miles annually
Estimated useful life 20 years (Your RV depreciates over time and eventually reaches a value of zero).
            
                                                     NEW          USED

Depreciation                               61              56
Insurance                                    13                 6
Gas                                               13               13
Maintenance/Tires.                    13              13
Storage                                           7                7
Interest                                          17              8
License                                             1.             1
Camping                                         30.             30

Total.                                               156.           135

An RV comes with fixed and variable costs. Obviously one has more control over camping fees and gas. This information is intended to help others look at their own situation and create a financially sustainable plan so camping doesn't create unnecessary financial stress. The figures are based on the cost of operating a Class C MH.  My depreciation estimate is high (conservative). Maintenance can run much higher when you look at the costs of all the goodies that go under the coach (tires, sway bars, TPMS, etc). Add for the toad if you tow (not included).

Todd

Todd (and Steve)
'17 Winnebago Minnie Winnie and '13 Honda CRV
(Former '99 RB owners from 2012-2016)
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #10 –
CPN, how to figure? When we bought our LD, I mentally wrote the value down to zero - fully consumed. The Jeep the same.
So something north of $110,000 divided by the number of nights we have used her, is $58.

What we spend on the road or at home are about the same.

Our costs to park average about $10 night since we love the views we can get on public lands. Staying in an RV park is sometimes necessary, but never enjoyable.

Don & Dorothy
Sold our LD in June of 2023

Our boring always non-PC travel blog
Traveling Dorothy
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #11 –
Todd, thanks for sharing your numbers. Our costs are different. We have an old rig, use it about 6 months a year, and have some different circumstances. To add some comments for the sake of discussion:

Depreciation will vary greatly, and be much lower on an older unit and with more use. The total cost was something I considered when I laid out the money, but not each night I travel (though it is a good incentive to get out more).  As well, we won't have the same 20 year life if the rig, lets expect 10. With our use of 6 months this gets our depreciation to about $9 per day of use.

Storage can be zero for many people.

Fuel varies greatly, depending on the travel. Ours goes up and down as we dart from coast to coast visiting family, then recedes to little as we sit recovering in the desert. But one thing is certain for us. We are gonna get 8 MPG

Our cost per night averages <$12. We mix boondocking with state and federal parks, using only the Golden Age pass and Texas Parks pass to save money.

I'm not sure we could get a loan for our old rig, but we paid cash anyway- no interest cost! And in today's investment climate, I don't know how to calculate the opportunity cost of lost interest on my initial outlay of cash!

Maintenance ? I would agree with your number as a conservative (high) estimate. But it doesn't cover those upgrades I am so fond of making.

Of course license fees have to be considered in the owners home state.

Even so, the RV lifestyle (there, I used that term again) is not as inexpensive as sitting at home.
Paul
'92 Mid Bath
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #12 –
First -- RV's like cars are melting ice cubes. Ownership  costs can be all over the place depending on  personal use and location. On a different thread I posted my 'immediate' cost of use.    If you were a tax  lawyer or the IRS you'd be laughing  at all the number and assumptions I left out.    Sadly we as US citizens rarely  if ever pay the total cost of ownership.   But that's really a political discussion that few of us wish to engage in. 

When I'm asked what 'will' it cost to own an RV I say the same price as owning your home.   Whatever is you budget for living today will be your budget for living tomorrow (with some exceptions).  As my mother always said the price of life raises to the amount of money your have to spent. 

May I say (and I know how it sounds) we are only guaranteed one exhale in life.   Enjoy ever second you are given - money can be replace, time can not. 
personal fine art photo stuff
TF Mack | Flickr
It's all good .......
2014 Twin King
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #13 –
Quote from: Andy Baird  - 
Citing a single (high) number for cost per night without explaining in detail what it's based on is misleading at best. If we're going to talk about costs, let's talk about what goes into that total.

Yes, the devil is always in the details. I'm not sure if "cost per night" is the best way to figure RV ownership, but as Todd and others suggested, I believe ALL the costs need to be counted. That includes cost of the rig, financing costs (if applicable), maintenance, insurance, gas, registration, on and on . . .

Perhaps a better term than CPN is "cost per vacation" or "cost of travel?" If I am planning a trip to Hawaii, I need to consider all the costs: the trip to the airport, hotel room at airport if needed, cost of flight, cost of accommodations in Hawaii, rental car costs, food, sightseeing, etc.

As one considers buying an RV, ALL the costs associated with that possible ownership should be counted, IMHO.  What good is having an RV if you can't afford the gas to travel, or if you can't afford to register, insure, and maintain it?

Greg & Victoria
2017 Mid-Bath  “Nocona” towing a manual 2015 Forester
Previously a 1985 TK
SKP #61264
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #14 –
More observations as the discussion ensues....

Now that we've joined Thousand Trails, the $30 for camping fees looks a bit high. (It was low before ). We'll continue to pay $30-$40 night along the North Shore where boondocking is the only way to get that number lower.

Maintenance on our older rig (1999) has been the budget buster. We just spent $2,000 replacing the fridge.

Figure costs on a monthly basis too which fit into our personal budget.

We're not bemoaning the high costs, just trying to help others plan. We really don't have anything else we enjoy more, so it is a good use of our money.

Judging from the number of buses out there, money is no object for a segment of the community. Then there are people like us who do ok but budget.

Those folks who ask you about how much it costs to 'camp" would probably be shocked at the CPN numbers.

Fulltiming is an entirely different scenario. Most RVs sit idle for the majority of any given year.

Todd
Todd (and Steve)
'17 Winnebago Minnie Winnie and '13 Honda CRV
(Former '99 RB owners from 2012-2016)
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #15 –
Suzanne, going back to your questions, you mention replacing a car you own with a tow vehicle and using a trailer you own. Without getting into all of the numbers, this may be a lower cost option.

You mention horses and own a trailer, I assume you already have experience towing.

We found our trailer experience was very good, but approached travel differently. Make time, get to a camp, drop the trailer and go exploring. Plan stays for longer duration and range out about 200 miles. More careful planning to avoid long dirt tracks that dead end with no turnaround, and to be sure fuel stop ingress/egress was OK (our total length was about 60 feet).

In the motor home we explore along the way to camp, set up, sleep, then leave in the AM. Our camps are very tidy, not a lot of paraphernalia strewn about. So far, this suits us for our cross country drives to visit the diaspora of relatives out there.

We may return to a smaller truck/trailer rig sometime, for certain trips. It's hard to go hunting from a motor home ya know.

Paul
'92 Mid Bath
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #16 –
"The more I read, the more I feel I should focus on setting aside additional funds for a newer RV."

Unless you're buying a brand new Lazy Daze, you should set aside additional funds in any case, because things will need fixing or upgrading. Let's say you bought a 2010 Lazy Daze--only six years old. Even if the owners had taken good care of it, at a minimum it would probably need new tires, because RV tires "age out" after five to seven years, no matter how little mileage and how much tread they have. That's about $1,500 for a set of six tires.

The older the rig, the more things will need maintenance. Yes, Lazy Daze builds good RVs. No, they're not bulletproof--no RV is. Remember, a motorhome is a house built on top of a truck. That means you potentially have all the things that can go wrong with a house plus all the things that can go wrong with a truck.

"I guess I just trust that the current owner who is 72 wasn't out on the highway with his cherished wife in an unsafe rig. I'll leave it at that."

Please don't do that. I'm sure the current owner is a nice guy, but there are many ways to neglect a rig, from not fixing small leaks in the coach to not changing the engine's oil. The results can range from annoying nickel-and-dime expenses to catastrophic and expensive mechanical problems with the engine. No matter how nice the sellers are, do not assume that they did everything right. Have the coach inspected--if at all possible, both by a Ford mechanic and by an RV-savvy person. Failing to do so is inviting expensive problems down the road.

"...or trade in my Mazda 3 (free and clear title) and get a vehicle to tow my already-owned vintage Belle travel trailer, a mere 15' - but it's just me and my dog."

That plan has a number of advantages. First, you already know your trailer--both its good and bad points. Therefore it's less likely to surprise you with major problems that you hadn't budgeted for.

Second, separating your motive power from your home means you can repair or replace one or the other if things go wrong, instead of replacing the whole thing. Small travel trailers are widely available, obviously, and trucks and vans are for sale everywhere.

Look at it this way: if your motorhome breaks down, your home is immobilized. If your truck breaks down, you can get your trailer towed to a campground and live there while the truck is repaired. If you have a van and something catastrophic happens to your trailer—say, a tree branch falls on it—you could live in your van for a week or so if you had to while the trailer was repaired. Yes, motorhomes are convenient, but staying “modular” does have its advantages.

Third, it’s a lot easier to get a truck properly inspected than a motorhome. It’s less complex and more of a standard product.

Fourth, having a separate truck means you can drive your vehicle into town for groceries or mail while leaving the trailer parked. With a small, old RV that lacks the power to safely tow a car, you have to drive the whole RV (and find a place to park it). I've done that, since I owned an '85 LD for six years. It's doable, but very limiting.

"I'll stay and lurk and learn, if you don't mind."

By all means! And whatever kind of rig you end up with, don't overlook the online resources mentioned by others here. There are plenty of people who are happy to help a fellow RVer. If you haven't already, check the various vintage trailer discussion groups. Happy trails!
Andy Baird
2021 Ford Ranger towing 2019 Airstream 19CB
Previously: 1985 LD Twin/King "Gertie"; 2003 LD Midbath "Skylark"
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #17 –
Thank you all for your thoughts, expertise and insights.
I had to make a decision this morning, and I declined to make the purchase.

Andy, what you wrote resonates with me. It makes a lot of sense. My Bell trailer is small and lightweight, but has suffered Montana hail damage. I'll look into getting it insulated and re-skinned- or not. It's lost its beauty, but not function, and I quite adore it for it's cuteness and excellent vintage interior and original cantaloupe-peach colored appliances.

I am thinking to price out a trade for my 2014 Mazda 3 to purchase a 2015-16 Subaru Outback 3.6R for it's higher performance towing. Payments are fine.

Things are making more sense and I'm not so panicky about making a huge financial commitment for maintenance and petrol.

Thanks again for being such an excellent source of knowledge as well as allowing me to vent some thoughts to people who live this lifestyle, love it, and care about fellow travelers adventuring on the highways and byways across America and elsewhere.

Alway have love Mark Twain's quote: "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn’t do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."  It has spurred me to travel far and wide, and I'll continue to do just that. I'll figure out what suits me and be open to change.

Great group. Again, much appreciated!  Happy, safe trails to all!  Suzanne
Suzanne Elizabeth
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #18 –
Suzanne, if you decide to keep your little trailer, you might be interested in the group "Sisters on the Fly"; their website is just that with a .com  and tells all about their (very active) group and all the who/what/where/when/how. (Right now, the site isn't working for me or I'd link it.)

Good luck to you.

Joan

2003 TK has a new home
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #19 –

Not to be too blunt, but I would suggest staying far, far away from RVs. They are maintenance holes, and one must be very mechanically inclined to keep them in both running & operating condition. If you posses those kinds of skills, and/or enjoy that kind of maintenance activity, then RVs can be fun & enjoyable. OTOH, difficult maintenance issues (plus lack of enthusiasm for travel/usage) is the reason a majority of RVs are sitting neglected in backyards/storage lots.

If you are interested in road travel, but don't have the wherewithal to deal with an RV, then the single best solution is to get a mini-van. And by that, I mean a bullet proof vehicle like the Honda Odyssey or Toyota Sienna. Get a good really quality 2-person tent (for extra room) like either of these two: MSR Hubba Hubba NX or the Big Agnes Copper Spur UL 2? - Gear - TrailGroove.... However, with the middle seats lifted/store on either the Toyota (which I have) or the Honda, you can easily sleep fully inclined (I'm 6'1"), so a tent would merely be an option.

Get a good sleeping bag, a great (inflatable) pad like this one (Amazon.com : Big Agnes Air Core Rectangular Wide Long Pad 78in. x 25in. :...), a stove, etc and you're good to go.

We take our LD up to the Sierra a few times of the year; in addition, I go on a few solo backpack trips. When by myself, I take our Sienna and use it exactly the way I described above before/after I hit the trail.  RVs are fun if they fit your personality, skills and pocket-book, but there is no substitute for an extremely reliable, serviceable & cost-effective vehicle if one is properly equipped to camp.

As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #20 –
I like the comfort an RV provides :)
I'm way past camping out of a car or van as you suggest SNERF.
As fas as cost goes: I like my fathers saying......"If your going to play than you'll have to pay" :D

Daughter of the first Lazy Bones
Hitting the road on my own and with a friend 🚐 while reporting back to the Lazy Bones at home 🛋

2 Lazy Bones - Home
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #21 –
Last year we decided to do a quick car camping trip. We still hang onto all our backpacking gear, hoping to wake up younger some day.

First night we found a great Forest Service camp, proudly negotiating the two track in our fancy city 4WD cruiser.  Pitched our high tech tent, which we love as much as LD. Unrolled the nice fancy backpacking self inflating mattresses.

In the morning, bleary eyed, we sought out the first Walmart we could find. New 2" mattress topper to cover the air mattresses. Again, a sleepless night.

In the morning, bleary eyed, we sought out the first Walmart we could find. New mattress. And voila , a decent night's sleep. Perhaps the discomfort of the previous nights were our sleeping potion.

In any case, my aching hips, neck and back informed me that my days of sleeping in the ground are less pleasurable than in days of yore.

So for some, the comfort of an RV appeals. Our own bed. Towed, toted or driven.

I like your plan Suzanne.
Paul
'92 Mid Bath
 
Re: Best idea for being less of a Nervous Nellie in jumping in & buying a Lazy Daze
Reply #22 –
Isn't this all about getting out and about? It really isn't how you do it as much as that you do it.

Every campground I have ever visited is chock full of smiling faces, wandering children and sniffing dogs. Whether they got there by bus, car or mini bike it really didn't matter. They were there...breathing the fresh air taking in the aromatic scent of a campfire or napping under a tree.

Last November while at Serrano Campground at Big Bear Lake, I met a very pleasant lady. Kathy with a "K"...I still remember her name. No LD she had a Pop-Up Pyramid shaped trailer.

She beconed me to warm by her campfire and enjoy her favourite brew-Brothers Thalonius ale. Quite intoxicating just like camping out.

My point? Get up...Get out and smell the wilderness. Doesn't matter how you do it. LD, car, van, tent or cabin. Get! Go! And make new friends.

Just sayin'

Kent
2015 27' RB "MissB.Haven"