Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #25 – February 01, 2013, 09:28:17 am Yahoo Message Number: 136559Quote Thank you all again for the replies. We have a great rv dealer near us and when they have an open house in the spring, my husband and I always go and look. But, we always find ourselves saying, "The LD has waaaay more space. And, look at the poor construction on this or that." And, so, I don't want our prejudice towards a Lazy Daze to cause us to miss something that might be a better fit. We have a 27' RB right now, which has been great for us up to now. I am thinking that for retirement, a MB might suit us better.Glad we have a few years to decide.Thanks again, Kathy Hi Kathy: You have received a lot of good information from this board. Having looked at many types of RVs before purchasing our MB, please allow me to add one more thought. As you look at potential rigs, pay considerable attention to the Occupant and Cargo Carrying Capacity of the unit. The official sticker should be somewhere in the unit. We toured some Class A RVs that would not even safely carry the four adult members of our family. If you are going to spend a lot of time in your RV, you will likely need to carry a fair amount of "stuff". We found this problem mostly in smaller Class A units with gas chassis & engines.Best wishes on your search.Bob
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #26 – February 01, 2013, 11:19:07 am Yahoo Message Number: 136562"Glad we have a few years to decide."Kathy I would search the net and find the largest RV shows that are reasonably close and start attending everyone you can. This is the only easy easy of seeing the wide variety of options that fit YOUR lifestyle. Our suggestions are biased. RV show, on the whole, are smaller than in the past due to so many manufacturers going out of business so attend as many as possible. Also check ahead to see who is coming and what brands and models that will be shown because many "RV shows" are just attempts from retailers to dump old or slow moving stock.Larry
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #27 – February 01, 2013, 01:01:07 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136564"Larry" wrote: I would search the net and find the largest RV shows that are reasonably close and start attending everyone you can.... Also check ahead to see who is coming and what brands and models that will be shown because many "RV shows" are just attempts from retailers to dump old or slow moving stock. --- Ditto on seeking out the largest shows with the widest variety of RV types and manufacturers. Quite a few smaller, "local" shows are sponsored by *one* dealer, and this dealer may offer very few RV types and models from very few manufacturers. I also suggest doing a lot of "homework" on possible fits for your future RV needs before attending a show, then take photos, keep notes, look behind/under/inside/on top and leave your emotions and your wallet at home. Ask hard questions, and educate yourself to the max on the basics of good design, engineering, build quality, and weight issues (not that an LD is perfect by any means, but they are a lot better put-together than most, so this won't be a stretch!) so that you'll recognize the smoke-blowing and snake oil when you hear it in the stuff that you're bound to get from many of the manufacturer/dealer reps. I'm sure that most of us have heard quite a few "RV salesperson answers" that would be better offered as a stand-up comedy routine.As ever, YMMV.Joan
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #28 – February 01, 2013, 01:19:28 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136565I'll chime in my two cents worth...keeping in mind that free advice is often worth what you pay. We're on our first and only RV, a 2006 mid-bath and we ramble about 7 months a year since we picked it up. We do keep a small condo as home base, which may not at all be your plan. We looked at quite a number of (and still do) Class C's, but the LD quality and reputation for reliability sold us. We have met at least three couples who full time in their LDs, one has a 29' rear queen, one has a mid-bath and one has a rear bath...all have been full-timing for years. I guess it all depends upon what you want to do/see and how you want to do/see. All do tow. My sister and brother-in-law have a 40' Winnebago Vectra triple slide which, as time has gone on, has become increasingly expensive to keep going even though my brother-in-law does do some small repairs himself. It's currently awaiting a part on 60-day delivery at a Freightliner shop in SC...not in their plan for this winter's trip (not even on their route), but if they don't want to have the coach catch on fire while underway, a necessary stop. Current cost estimate: $4,000. Two years ago it was new tires and you really need to check on the price of new tires for these vs a Lazy Daze...eye-opening. So...even if you decide to go with a Class A, please do check deeply into the maintenance and repair and upkeep costs of these babies. Even if you get a dream unit that has very high customer satisfaction ratings, the "regular" costs that fall to you could become burdensome.TinaP 2006 Mid-Bath of the Silver Persuasion[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #29 – February 01, 2013, 03:48:32 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136572Kathy, I used to follow this forum almost daily when I was searching for the "right" RV choice for me and the Lazy Daze was very high on my list, but I ended up with a Phoenix Cruiser (www.phoenixusarv.com) built in Elkhart, IN, but a small company similar to LD that sells directly from the factory though they do have two or three associate dealerships across the US. They are highly customer oriented and have a great forum of owners that you can learn a lot from on the Internet. The models can be selected with or without slide outs and the company is great about customizing things. One of their most popular models evolved from a special order by a customer. I have no vested interest in this company, but just didn't see it mentioned in any replies to your question so I thought I'd bring it to your attention. Oh, I should mention that they are eager to negotiate prices so don't let the suggested retail prices scare you. I think the quality of their products will impress you most of all.Hope this may give you yet another option in retirement.Glenn
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #30 – February 01, 2013, 04:58:02 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136574Bob, Thanks for the advice. Since we have the RB and travel light, this is not something that, up to now, we have had to worry about.Kathy
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #31 – February 01, 2013, 04:59:51 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136575Larry, A good point. We live fairly close to Hershey, so maybe we will hit that RV show the next time it comes around.Kathy
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #32 – February 01, 2013, 05:02:10 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136576Joan, Since we have only had LD's we've never had to worry about false info. You are right, if we go with another brand, I will have to pay a lot more attention to details.Thanks for the thought, Kathy
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #33 – February 01, 2013, 05:04:35 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136577Tina, This is another reason that we shy away from a Class A-the cost of upkeep. And, I do worry that any other brand will mean a lot more headaches in terms of "issues" due to poor construction.Kathy
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #34 – February 01, 2013, 05:06:57 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136578Glenn,Thank you. I will add Phoenix Cruiser to my "let's look" list.Kathy
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #35 – February 01, 2013, 05:50:40 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136580Going to a DP does have it's pluses and minuses. Increased maintenance cost over an LD is a minus. But you get something for it. Here's an interesting 34ft Foretravel asking $52K. It has a Cummins 8.3L engine - one of Cummin's best and most practical ones. We had the same engine in our 1997 36ft Foretravel and loved it.http://motorhomesoftexas.com/coachrv/foretravel/1998--u270--34--C1602>But one experience of a FT walk-thru bath might be quite a pleasant surprise. As far as mpg goes, we drove El Centro to Quartzsite recently, mostly in California, at my towing legal speed of 55mph. My total weight was 35,000 lbs including our Element, and in rolling hills with no wind I was getting 12-13mpg. Lifetime on this 1999 450hp engine is 8.5mpg and at 115K miles it is not considered broken in ... On the boondocking side, several Foretravel owners have 800 or more watts of solar on the roof and run their 3 cyl 10KW diesel generator only once a month for maintenance purposes. My FT has 194 gal fuel tank, 110 gal fresh water, 100 gal grey water and 65 gal black water. After a week in Q we still had 30 gal of fresh water left. So as the old saying goes, "Ur pays ur money and ur takes ur choice."Good Hunting!best, paul"When you arise in the morning, think of****what a precious privilege it is to be alive...****to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love."********~ Marcus AureliusThis is another reason that we shy away from a Class A-the cost of upkeep. QuoteAnd, I do worry that any other brand will mean a lot more headaches in terms of "issues" due to poor construction. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #36 – February 01, 2013, 06:50:13 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136581Quote Here's an interesting 34ft Foretravel asking $52K. Nicely priced Foretravel. I'd want to budget about $10,000-20,000 for modernizing/upgrading and adding solar.Chris
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #37 – February 01, 2013, 07:41:56 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136584Foretravels w/o a slide go for less than you think. They're asking $52K. It will go for a lot less.This is a 34ft 1996 U240. My 1997 36 footer was a 1997 U295 (more goodies than a U240). I sold it for $52K 3 years ago. And it had upgrades like a $25K beautiful full body paint job with all new windows ... The 240 has a washer/dryer. When we first saw this in a FT we thot it was conspicuous consumption. Now that we have one in our U320 we would not be without it ;o) Solar will cost $$$. But I'd walk thru it before thinking about upgrading anything.best, paul"When you arise in the morning, think of****what a precious privilege it is to be alive...****to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love."********~ Marcus AureliusQuoteHere's an interesting 34ft Foretravel asking $52K. Nicely priced Foretravel. I'd want to budget about $10,000-20,000 for modernizing/upgrading and adding solar. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #38 – February 01, 2013, 08:49:38 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136587Kathy, Just my 2-cents worth! Like someone else mentioned free advice is probably worth just what it cost. No matter what brand of RV you consider you will find owners of that brand that have had a bad experience with their rig; including LD (although not as frequent). RV shows are a good way to get an "introduction" to the RV brands but remember the people you talk to have a definite sales objective; more so if the show is manned by RV dealers. In my opinion you can only evaluate the quality of an RV by visiting it's manufacturing facility, observing the manufacturing process, and asking a lot of questions about things. I know that not everyone has the technical skills to do this or can spend the time and travel required. I have done quite a bit of this and can only say it is "very eye opening." I read all "RV Reviews" with some skepticism; even the ones that are highly touted in this forum, although major one recommended I feel is reasonably unbiased. The other factor that needs to be considered is "how long to I want to use this rig?" If you want to use it for 20 years, then aim for the a "boutique" builder, like LD. If you only want a 5-year rig go for a less expensive brand. People claim that the less expensive brands "have more problems." However, on most of the less expensive brands you can get warranty service and repairs locally. With LD, you have to take the rig to Montclair, CA. And that is only considering the "coach" part. For all the appliances, etc. LD sends you to the "local appliance warranty service center" same as the less expensive brands. Because most Class C's are built on the Ford chassis, warranty service, repair, etc. are a draw. I appreciate your problem as I own a 2005 MB that has gone 115K miles. I am seriously thinking about replacing it for two reasons:1. I no longer trust the Ford chassis. It has started to have a lot of "little problems." (Must admit that I am a GM fan.) 2. We live in the rig on the road for up to 5 months at a time. We really would like to have a single slideout; specifically the dinette. I will never get that from LD, therefore, we are looking at other brands. I have accepted the fact that a new rig will be on a Ford chassis (can't afford one on a Freightliner chassis) but that is OK as I only want a "5-year" rig. Now the challenge is to figure out which one.Good luck on your search,Doug[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #39 – February 02, 2013, 08:48:10 am Yahoo Message Number: 136592You do not have to take the rig back to the factory in order to get warranty service done. When we had problems with the electrical system on our 2004, we were in Spokane and took it to a local RV service center. They talked with the factory, got approval for the repairs, and the work was done without any cost to us. The same thing happened when we had a New Horizons fifth wheel (another factory-direct RV, although they are a custom builder)...we simply went to an RV service center to have work done (which was rare and usually involved appliances whose warranties were covered by their manufacturer). When we were on our way to Alaska in 2001, we had to have some work done on the king pin in Alberta. While we paid for it out of pocket then, when we got back to the factory in the fall to attend the owner's rally, the factory reimbursed us our cost.Linda Hylton http://earl-linda.blogspot.com
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #40 – February 02, 2013, 10:34:10 am Yahoo Message Number: 136595"Since we have the RB and travel light, [cargo carrying capacity] is not something that, up to now, we have had to worry about." Believe me, you will once you go full-time. My first Lazy Daze was well within the weight limits for the first four years I owned it... but once I was living in it full-time, the weight ballooned until it was 900 pounds overweight. I kept getting rid of stuff, but it was extremely hard to get the weight back down to a safe range. My advice: check your Lazy Daze's cargo capacity and compare it to that of any rig you consider buying. IMPORTANT: the rules for calculating this number changed after 2008, so if you have an older rig, its CCC is going to be much less than the "OCCC" of a newer rig. For example, a 2008 RB had a CCC of 1,714 pounds. A 2013 RB has an OCCC of 3,062 pounds. Same rig--just different calculations. Bottom line: if your RB has a CCC of 1,600-1,700 pounds, it's comparable to a modern rig with an OCCC of 3,000 pounds--about 1,300 pounds more. So if you see a rig with three slides and a posted OCCC of 1,600 pounds, that's equivalent to a CCC of only about 300 pounds. Obviously, you would not be able to travel safely with that kind of skimpy load capacity. And there's more. As Regan noted, most manufacturers other than Lazy Daze cheat on the cargo numbers by making heavy items such as the air conditioner or generator into "dealer options." This allows them to omit those weights when calculating the rig's OCCC. Since an air conditioner weighs about 150 pounds and a generator about 250, that 1,600-pound OCCC/300 pound CCC rig in my example could actually be overweight just sitting on the dealer's lot! The moral is: understand the difference between CCC and OCCC, and watch those numbers like a hawk. Way too many rigs on the market now have negligible cargo capacity as they're delivered, and manufacturers and dealers will use every trick in the book to hide that fact. A survey done some years ago, based on more than 10,000 accurate RV weighings, found that nearly two thirds of the rigs on the road were overweight. Don't be one of them!Andy Baird http://www.andybaird.com/travels/
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #41 – February 02, 2013, 11:11:32 am Yahoo Message Number: 136600Here's a seriously under priced Foretravel at $18K firm: http://www.rvtrader.com/listing/1993-Foretravel-Grand-Villa-Unihome-107768236>THe AC is below - so there's LOTS of room on top for solar.best, paul"When you arise in the morning, think of****what a precious privilege it is to be alive...****to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love."********~ Marcus Aurelius"The one thing that always bugged me about the Lazy Daze or any other class QuoteC motorhome is that big over-hang above you when driving. It's like the difference between being at an Imax theater, and viewing something through a tunnel." [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #42 – February 02, 2013, 11:29:49 am Yahoo Message Number: 136603"Here's a seriously under priced Foretravel at $18K firm: http://www.rvtrader.com/listing/1993-Foretravel-Grand-Villa-Unihome-107768236"Twenty year old DP with "Subfloor(under generator and fuel tanks ) shows severe rust and needs to be repaired. This is the reason for the price reduction" Sounds like a well taken care of MH...or money pit. Do your home work on this type of purchase. It's highly recommended to find a experienced diesel mechanic and pay him several hundred dollars to fully inspect the drive train and chassis. If the floor is rusted away, what about the rest of it? Rust seldom localized itself to just one place. I have been under enough MHs to know I don't want to have anything to do with a RV covered with rustRust never sleeps.Larry
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #43 – February 02, 2013, 08:39:22 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136613Before you jump off into a Foretravel, you really need to go to their forum and poke around a bit. Seems that some of the older ones have a "Mor-Ryde" type of suspension, that was originally a marginal design, and with age the suspension has sagged and can't be lifted to proper height . There are also some models that are experiencing a bulkhead separation that entails a fairly major repair. I KNOW nothing specifically, and if I wer younger I'd have one of them, just saying that you need be aware that some do have expensive problems.Dave W
Re: Could I Just Ask..... Reply #44 – February 03, 2013, 01:36:17 pm Yahoo Message Number: 136627Quote Before you jump off into a Foretravel, you really need to go to their forum and poke around a bit. Seems that some of the older ones have a "Mor-Ryde" type of suspension Going way back to early '90s, smaller coaches built on the Oshkosh chassis.QuoteThere are also some models that are experiencing a bulkhead separation that entails a fairly major repair. I KNOW nothing specifically It's staggering how much the bulkhead question is blown way out of proportion by those not familiar with Foretravels. It is an area that needs inspection, yes, but is less than a day's work and $1K to have professionally repaired (or you can do it yourself if you have the tools) in all but 2 known cases. There are not a lot of incidents, it is not all or even many coaches, it is very easy to inspect for, and relatively easy to repair.Michelle
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