SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

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SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

October 02, 2023, 05:21:44 pm

Hi,

A few days ago I replaced my old pair of LifeLine 6v batteries with a new SOK 12v LiFePO4. This is the first of three that I intend eventually to have as a battery bank for my solar upgrade.

It seems to be working well, although today I'm wondering why the controller is staying in float mode at 13.6v, even though the battery has discharged down to 90.1%, due to a load I put on it this morning (according to my Victron BMV-700). The BMV-700 also shows a battery voltage of 13.1%. For the last two days, things seemed normal, with the controller going into absorption mode off and on. Of course the past two days have been mostly cloudy here, with several breaks of intense sun. Today we've had intense sun all day, without a cloud in the sky.

I modified the SB3000i settings according to recommendations that I found online, along with information that I had from SOK. Here is are the settings:

AbS 14.4   Absorption charge   Voltage
Abt 10.0 Absorption charge   Time
FLt 14.4 Float charge voltage
EqU 15.2 Equalization does not apply to LIF
Eqt 2.0 Equalization N/A for Lithium
Eqd 30 Eq day interval N/A
EqE oFF    Definitely OFF for Lithium
uPr 15.5 upper voltage absolute limit
btc 0.0 No temperature changes for Lithium
out Lod No output from secondary (to chassis battery)
Lon 12.6   N/A
LoF 11.5   N/A
PSt oFF    N/A
PrE oFF    N/A
PEr 40    N/A

Do any of you see anything obviously wrong in the settings above? I'm hoping that I'm not having an issue here, as we are about to head off to the Eastern Sierra again for several weeks.
Thanks,   Tim.
edited by RonB to show what I would (did) choose for my LiF system.

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #1 – October 02, 2023, 06:10:40 pm

Hi,

Oops: I actually have Abt (Absorption time) set to 0.5 (30 minutes) per a recommendation I saw, not 2.0 (2 hours).

I just noticed that it's now in absorption mode, but the amps in are still very low even though the battery is at just above 90%.

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #2 – October 02, 2023, 09:19:17 pm

Hello again,

I found a web page recommending settings for the Victron BMV-712 (I have a BMV-700) and it recommends setting the state of charge to 30% for a new, untouched SOK battery. Apparently these batteries ship at 30%.

I did not do this. How can I determine the actual state of charge of my battery, in order to properly synchronize the BMV-700?

Thanks,

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #3 – October 02, 2023, 10:11:40 pm

The rule of thumb answer is to charge your batteries until they won't take any more, and the charger goes to float mode. Then manually set the BMV-700 to 100%. From then on it's supposed to synchronize automatically.

Anybody know of a better procedure?

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #4 – October 03, 2023, 06:36:58 am

When I set up my lithium battery bank I called the solar controller company and they walked me through the setup process. I did the same with Victron company. Both representatives I spoke with were very helpful completing the setup. I’ve had no problems since.

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #5 – October 03, 2023, 12:22:49 pm

Thanks for the replies, Andy and Mike.

The controller started this morning in bulk mode, then went to absorption a bit before locking into float at 13.8v (this is the setting recommended by SOK). I then went ahead and synchronized the BMV-700 to 100% (held the + and - buttons on the head unit simultaneously for 3 seconds). We'll see how it goes from here.

Good suggestion to call Blue Sky Energy - they also have a lot of detailed videos on YouTube.

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #6 – October 04, 2023, 10:15:13 am

Since all LiFePO4 have a BMS (Battery Management System) by default the only setting I've been concerned with is the battery equalizer setting. Since I've never used that setting I've not changed any setting from my AGM days.
I know I'm depending on the quality of the BMS that the manufacturers of my LiFePO4 batteries have installed. After about a year they are still working as expected.

What is a Battery Management System (BMS)? – How it Works | Synopsys

glen

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #7 – October 04, 2023, 11:22:21 am

"Since all LiFePO4 have a BMS (Battery Management System) by default..."

Most of the ones that are currently popular with RVers do. But there are many lithium batteries, especially larger ones, that lack an internal BMS. For example, in my previous Airstream I used a pair of Victron LiFePO4 batteries that were just batteries, with an external BMS controlling them. It was a more complex setup to build, since it required external components, but it had the advantage of having independent charging and load buses--not possible with a built-in BMS. That gave me flexibility to manage charging and loads separately, as well as the ability to replace the BMS if it ever became necessary.

That said, in my current Airstream I opted for simplicity, and switched to the built-in BMS type, with two 130 amp-hour Lithionics batteries. But it's not safe to assume that a given LiFePO4 battery has its own BMS built in. It may or may not.

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #8 – October 06, 2023, 02:56:38 pm

We're currently staying at Horton Creek BLM campground near Bishop, CA, am I'm continuing to play with our new SOK 12v206h LiFePO4 battery.

I seem to be having some trouble reaching a SOC (State Of Charge) of 100%. This battery has a built-in BMS, which I check via BlueTooth. Yesterday it started out at 93% and stayed there most of the day, with the controller mainly in float mode all day long. In the evening we ran the TV for about an hour, and it ended up at 87%, where it still is. This morning, the controller spent very little time in bulk mode (just after sunrise), then moved to absorption for a bit, and then moved to float mode at 13.6v. I tried increasing the controller's Abs setting from 14.4v to 14.6v and the Flt setting from 13.6v to 13.8v, but this then the controller just sits in float mode at 13.8v. I periodically check the battery's BMS, and it seems to like to sit at 13.33 or 13.34 volts, with the four cells evenly balanced at 3.333 volts each.

i'm thinking of calling Blue Sky Energy tech support to see if they can tell me how to get their sb3000i to shove more current into the SOK. I don't like seeing the SOC decline each day, but perhaps I'm worrying about nothing - maybe it just needs to decline enough for the controller to be willing to drive more charge into it.

Please let me know what you think.

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #9 – October 06, 2023, 05:36:06 pm

Various tech support people over the years have told me that LiFePO4 batteries don't like to be floated, or at least prefer minimal float voltages, so I'd be reluctant to push the float voltage to 13.8 V unless the battery's manufacturer specifically recommends it.

"I periodically check the battery's BMS, and it seems to like to sit at 13.33 or 13.34 volts, with the four cells evenly balanced at 3.333 volts each."

From my experience, that is a full charge. For example, right now in late afternoon my two Lithionics batteries are sitting at 13.32 V with all cells at 3.33 V, and their internal BMSs are indicating 99% and 100% respectively, while my Victron solar charge controller is in float mode.

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #10 – October 06, 2023, 09:09:35 pm

Thanks, Andy. I’ll stop worrying about it for now.

I did go back and set the Abs to 14.4 and the Flt to 13.6.
These numbers were recommended for lithium batteries by Blue Sky Energy.

14.6 and 13.8 were suggested by SOK, as a “more aggressive” setting.

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #11 – October 11, 2023, 04:36:53 pm

Hi Tim; You were looking for a circuit breaker to replace the 15A fuse that you have for the solar input to your batteries. This one Amazon.com: STETION Car Audio 30 Amp Resettable Fuse Circuit Breaker Car... is a bit large to mount but has the advantage that you can shut it off manually, and then turn it back on. 30A is a good value for your application. RonB edited to reflect Tim's partially installed system. Not enough for when all of his panels are on line.

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Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #12 – October 11, 2023, 09:22:53 pm

Quote from: RonB - October 11, 2023, 04:36:53 pm

Hi Tim; You were looking for a circuit breaker to replace the 15A fuse that you have for the solar input to your batteries. This one Amazon.com: STETION Car Audio 30 Amp Resettable Fuse Circuit Breaker Car... is a bit large to mount but has the advantage that you can shut it off manually, and then turn it back on. 30A is a good value for your application.

Going back a few months, Tim planned to install 800-1000 watts of solar panels. If so, a 30-amp breaker will be too small.
Our LD's 560 watts of solar can produce up to 27 amps and uses a 30 amp breaker, Tim will need a 50-60 amp circuit breaker.
Inline, switchable 30-amp breaker from the solar controllâ€¦ | Flickr
Amazon.com: Blue Sea Systems 7036 187 Series Thermal Circuit Breaker, Panel...

Larry

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Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #13 – November 15, 2023, 04:04:21 pm

Greetings to All,

Just an update on the situation with the new SOK 12V LiFePO4 battery and the SB 3000i.

After quite a bit of back-channel messaging to RonB (thanks, Ron), I finally tried (on October 12) replacing the 15A miniblade fuse on the controller output wire (in the main panel box) with a 25A miniblade. This seemed to solve the problem of the controller staying in float mode all day despite a battery state of change well below 100% (perhaps the 15A fuse was getting too hot). After this, the controller stayed in bulk mode all day, every day, with the SOK BMS reporting a SOC of 100%.

I thought this seemed odd, expecting the controller to eventually enter float mode.

Finally, one evening at Convict Lake, as we were watching a downloaded video on the TV (via the inverter connected to the SOK), we were interrupted by the inverter alarm. I jumped up, looked at the battery voltage on the amp-hour counter, and was shocked to see it at 10.9v! This was not long after the SOK BMS reported SOC 94%.

I immediately fired up the generator, and checked the BMS display: it was now reporting SOC 0%. This was completely unexpected, and I was worried.

We let the generator run for a while, shutting it down at the end to the video, with the SOC at 15%.

As it turned out, the BMS had been lying to me about the state of charge, and running the battery down to zero seem to sort of calibrate it. From then on, I decided to trust only the Victron BMV-700 for a SOC reading. Sure enough, after a couple of days of blazing Eastern Sierra sun at 7600', the controller finally went into float, and I re-synced the BMV-700 to 100%. From then on, no problems, and I was able to trust the BMV-700 for state of charge. The SOK BMS is starting to align a little better now with the actual state of charge, as well.

Now that we've returned home, I'm getting down to the task of completing the solar upgrade. I've decided that the SOK is a good battery, and will order two more to make a 12 volt/618ah battery bank.

I'll soon start a new thread detailing this effort.

Thanks,

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #14 – November 15, 2023, 05:11:56 pm

Quote from: T&F - November 15, 2023, 04:04:21 pm

Finally, one evening at Convict Lake, as we were watching a downloaded video on the TV (via the inverter connected to the SOK), we were interrupted by the inverter alarm. I jumped up, looked at the battery voltage on the amp-hour counter, and was shocked to see it at 10.9v! This was not long after the SOK BMS reported SOC 94%.

As it turned out, the BMS had been lying to me about the state of charge, and running the battery down to zero seem to sort of calibrate it. From then on, I decided to trust only the Victron BMV-700 for a SOC reading.

Now that we've returned home, I'm getting down to the task of completing the solar upgrade. I've decided that the SOK is a good battery, and will order two more to make a 12 volt/618ah battery bank.

The battery's BMS is falsely reporting? I would not call that a good sign of a"good" battery.
The BMS is the most important part of a lithium battery and should be absolutely foolproof.
Reporting a false SOC could mean the BMS is not calibrated correctly or it has some type of defect and could damage the battery. I would contact the manufacturer to straighten this out.

One reason why I did not consider SOK lithiums was the light-duty BMS compared to the Battleborn battery, with charge and discharge rates at half of what the Battleborn provided. This may be different now, it has been two years since we installed lithiums.

Larry

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #15 – November 15, 2023, 06:22:31 pm

Larry,

You're right, I should get hold of them and see what they have to say about the issue.

Thanks,

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #16 – November 15, 2023, 07:03:13 pm

Larry,

The spec sheet on my SOK battery shows a maximum charge rate of 50A, with 40A recommended; a maximum continuous discharge rate of 130A; and a peak discharge rate of 200A (3 seconds).

How does this compare with your Battleborns? Which Battleborn model do you have?

Thanks,

Tim

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #17 – November 15, 2023, 08:22:27 pm

To be fair, my SOK's can handle 50A charging and 100A steady discharge rate. In parallel that is 100A charging. More than my solar at full bore (30A) and my converter also at full output (55A) 85A combined. The discharge rate added is 200A. I won't be running the roof air anyway. And 200A is more that the microwave (inverter) would need, or a hair drier as long as they aren't used simultaneously. The generator starter (two cylinder Emerald Plus) only takes about 46 Amps, so just one battery could start it. I believe Will Prowse's comments about the SOK 206's BMS board construction being robust.
   I don't have a bluetooth connection into the SOK's. My BalMar is my only indication of SOC. When first connected the BalMar was working with my Lead acid batteries. I had to re-initialize the BalMar and specify that I had 400AH of Lithium batteries at full charge, and I've only had one 'glitch about 10 minutes duration after the solar turned off and the batteries internal BMS was balancing cells. Since that time I've not seen any period of time when the batteries were under 13v. The higher energy density is because of the 1/16" steel wall construction. Better fireproofing, and the tops can be opened (screws undone) and cells (or BMS) replaced if needed.
The SB3000i after adjusting charge parameters does well. I haven't seen a SOC below 71% yet.
A supposed 'Black Friday' sale: SOK Battery 12V [206Ah-H] 12V LiFePO4 Battery Bluetooth & Built-in hea – The...
And the Will Prowse review video of the batteries I have. The bluetooth version/internal heater was after I bought mine. Mine are in service now for about one year, 8 months. Prices are down from the $1029.00 I paid.
edit: Amazon is out of stock and doesn't specify a price. The comments contain: Please note: SOC is initially incorrect, it takes 2 full charge / discharge cycles to reach proper calibration. I believe this refers to the built in BMS. RonB

Re: SolarBoost 3000i Settings for LiFePO4 battery

Reply #18 – November 16, 2023, 11:21:55 am

Quote from: T&F - November 15, 2023, 07:03:13 pm

The spec sheet on my SOK battery shows a maximum charge rate of 50A, with 40A recommended; a maximum continuous discharge rate of 130A; and a peak discharge rate of 200A (3 seconds).

How does this compare with your Battleborns? Which Battleborn model do you have?

The 100-amp/hr Battleborn (#10012) can handle 100-amp continuous discharge and 50-amp charge rate. With two batteries, the amounts are doubled.
Since I wanted to keep the original battery compartment, there was only room for a 200-amp/hr battery. The inverter required a battery that could deliver 200 amps to run the microwave.
I have seen our LD's battery charging system charge at over 75 amps under test conditions.
I was interested in SOK's 206-amp/hr battery, due to its cost, but it could not deliver the wanted continuous amps. A pair of SOK's 100-amp/hour batteries were too large to fit in the limited available space. 24’ models have little free space for extra batteries.

There should be no problems charging or discharging at high levels when running more than one SOK.

Larry

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