Smog or no smog February 04, 2017, 01:25:40 pm If a seller is unwilling to smog their rig, is that a potential warning sign? That may be an obvious question, but I'm just not sure. I thought the DMV required all vehicles to be smogged within 90 days of selling a vehicle. Is it different for RV's?Thank you.Mimi
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #1 – February 04, 2017, 01:38:40 pm If the Seller is in California, it is a state law that the Seller has to provide a Smog Certificate. I would not buy without the Seller getting it.Sandra
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #2 – February 04, 2017, 01:49:07 pm Thank you Sandra. I asked a seller if he planned to get the rig smogged before sale and he said no. He said something like he'd go with me to do it after the sale. He's making it weird about getting it smogged. I think I'll pass. I keep asking CA sellers (3 so far) if they've smogged their rigs and if not, if they're planning to do so prior to sale. In each case, the answer was no. Should I worry about that when buying out of state?Mimi
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #3 – February 04, 2017, 02:06:42 pm The rig must be smogged prior to the sale and in California, the responsibility is on the seller. If the seller is reluctant to take care of this, I'd be very suspicious and look elsewhere. If the vehicle is going to have smog issues, I would wonder what other hidden problems exist.No smog, no purchase!
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #4 – February 04, 2017, 02:21:28 pm "The rig must be smogged prior to the sale and in California, the responsibility is on the seller. If the seller is reluctant to take care of this, I'd be very suspicious and look elsewhere. If the vehicle is going to have smog issues, I would wonder what other hidden problems exist.No smog, no purchase!"When we bought our 1985 TK in California in 1991, the smog law was not in effect. I wish it would have been. We spent several THOUSAND dollars getting the equipment changed out to be legal, as it was known at the time that soon a smog certificate would be required of units of that age. We didn't want to let it go, mostly because of the environmental damage. I had just decommissioned my 1977 GMC Jimmy for a Toyota Tercel because of the environmental damaged caused by a big truck engine that got (at best) 8 MPG! And I really did decommission it - not trade it in. I wanted it off the road. The trade-in value in 1990 was $1600., so I just kept it at home (legally drivable and plated) for emergencies. Five years later . . . it was stolen off the street in front of our complex and State Farm gave me $5,000. in compensation. The vehicle was recovered over in Hayward, minus the engine, but it was in tip top shape from years of good care. I presume that is the reason for the generous payout.There is always the chance that something unexpected happens (like the engine problem on our Newmar - we had NO idea of any problems), but if there is a safeguard in place (like a smog check), it might be wisest to take full advantage of same. Virtual hugs, Judie
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #5 – February 04, 2017, 03:52:51 pm The California DMV website provides some interesting reading:https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/wcm/connect/a0ec948d-83bc-4a92-bb72-97dae3459751/reg139.pdf?MOD=AJPERES 1 Likes
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #6 – February 05, 2017, 12:17:11 am Quote from: Judie Ashford - February 04, 2017, 02:21:28 pmThere is always the chance that something unexpected happens (like the engine problem on our Newmar - we had NO idea of any problems), but if there is a safeguard in place (like a smog check), it might be wisest to take full advantage of same. Virtual hugs, Judie Wow, 5K. That must have been a beautiful truck! I am bewildered by this smog thing. I've seen folks come up right behind me, falling all over themselves to buy a rig I know wasn't smogged. Then, there are the ads that say "Just smogged" meaning, "Smogged in the last 12 months". It's a little frustrating that these folks know they're supposed to smog the rigs, but try to put it off onto the buyer. Aside from that, what does one do about out of state purchases? How can I protect myself against a possible problem?
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #7 – February 05, 2017, 12:39:26 am Quote from: JCT - February 04, 2017, 03:52:51 pmThe California DMV website provides some interesting reading:https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/wcm/connect/a0ec948d-83bc-4a92-bb72-97dae3459751/reg139.pdf?MOD=AJPERESYou know, when I read things like this, I can feel my brain glazing over in a state of situational sedation.:-) Correct me if I'm wrong but, doesn't this mean that the seller doesn't have to get the RV smogged and if he doesn't, the buyer is responsible to get it done?
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #8 – February 05, 2017, 08:41:03 am Yes. And as I read it, if it passes smog buyer pays for the smog test. If it doesn't pass, seller must pay for the test and repair.But I would not enter into a sale if I have to chase the seller to fix the vehicle. If it is titled to you it is your problem to make the seller, who has the money in their hands, so the right thing which they should have already done anyway. May Not be easy to deal with this kind of person. I would not buy a vehicle that didn't have a current smog certificate. Some buyers who don't care about the smog check are buying from out of state where smog rules are not the same as CA. 1 Likes
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #10 – February 05, 2017, 11:47:59 am Well thanks for the translation Paul. I'm more than convinced. Good points. No way will a seller who was trying to avoid a current smog cert, willingly pay to repair a rig he doesn't own. I don't want to deal with that. No smog. No sale. Thanks for the clarity.
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #11 – February 05, 2017, 12:32:40 pm Here's another one. Seller is unwilling to smog prior to sale.1991 Lazy Daze 26 26 MID BATH, newport beach CA - - RVtrader.com
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #12 – February 05, 2017, 01:10:42 pm Opuntia,Just an FYI, this LD has been on Craigslist for about a month now listed at $18,500 and now listed on RV trader for less. Seems to me there is a reason the owner does not want to pre-smog it for a new buyer. When I was looking for my LD most seller did not have a problem smogging. If they are not willing, walk away doesn't matter what year the LD is.Hank
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #13 – February 05, 2017, 08:16:12 pm Quote from: Opuntia - February 05, 2017, 12:39:26 amYou know, when I read things like this, I can feel my brain glazing over in a state of situational sedation.:-) Correct me if I'm wrong but, doesn't this mean that the seller doesn't have to get the RV smogged and if he doesn't, the buyer is responsible to get it done? Actually, no. Here's the full wording of the section (the language within the (()) is my commentary):VEHICLE EMISSION SYSTEM STATEMENT (SMOG)(California Vehicle Code Section 5751.5)The seller is required to furnish the purchaser this statement if a transfer application is submitted to the department within 90 days of the submission of a valid smog certification that was not obtained specifically for the transfer.((THIS FORM must be signed by the seller and given to the buyer in the situation where the transaction will take place within 90 days of the seller already having filed his current smog certificate with the State. This form is a warranty by the seller that he/she hasn't made any modifications to the vehicle SINCE the smog certificate was filed such that the vehicle might not pass the test. See the paragraph below.))MAKE LICENSE PLATE NUMBERI have not modified, nor do I have knowledge of anyone else modifying the emission system of this vehicle in any way that would make the emission system fail to pass the tests for smog certification required by Section 44015 of the California Health and Safety Code. I certify (or declare) under penalty of perjury under the laws of the State of California that the foregoing is true and correct.PRINTED NAME AND SIGNATURE OF SELLER (TRANSFEROR ) DATEWARNING TO THE BUYERA valid certificate of compliance was submitted to the Department of Motor Vehicles with an application for the renewal of registration of this vehicle. If an application for transfer is submitted to the department within the 90-day validity period of the smog certification, no new smog certification will be required. However, at present, you may be purchasing a vehicle that may not be in compliance with specified emission standards.((The above paragraph tells the buyer that a valid smog cert was filed for the vehicle, and advises the buyer that if that certificate was within 90 days of the transaction (your purchase), then the buyer need not submit a new smog cert in order to complete the transfer. However, since the seller may have made illegal modifications since the certificate was filed, the buyer is warned that the vehicle might not now be in compliance.))By signing this statement, you acknowledge that the seller is not required to provide you with an additional smog certificate prior to the completion of this transaction.((essentially, the State is saying that by signing this statement you are agreeing that the seller is not required by law to obtain another smog certification in order to close the transaction. If you close the sale to this point, You are, in effect, trusting that the seller hasn't done anything in the interim to mess up the emissions. If you don't trust the seller, then the next paragraph comes into play, but only if the transaction has not yet closed. ))You may have this vehicle tested at a licensed smog check station prior to completion of this transaction to verify compliance. If the vehicle passes the test, you shall be responsible for the costs of the test. If the vehicle fails the test, the seller is obligated to reimburse you the cost of having the vehicle tested and, without expense to you, must have the vehicle repaired to comply with specified emission standards prior to completion of this transaction.((Note that the foregoing paragraph is only effective PRIOR to the completion of the transaction, AND, given the rest of the form, only in a situation where a certificate has been filed within the preceding 90 days, AND only where you, the buyer, for whatever reason don't want to trust that existing certificate and want to have a new test run before closing the transaction. Note: this form does NOT require the seller to go along with your demand. Presumably, he can walk away and tell you to take a hike. BUT, if the seller agrees, you can have the rig tested. If it passes, you pay. If it fails, the seller not only has to pay for the test but also for the necessary repairs BEFORE completing the transaction. What I don't get, and haven't researched, is how the buyer forces the seller to do the repairs if the seller just wants to forget the deal. I guess the buyer could file a suit for specific performance, but the costs and delays of that make it improbable.))PRINTED NAME AND SIGNATURE OF SELLER (TRANSFEROR ) DATE PRINTED NAME AND SIGNATURE OF BUYER (TRANSFEREE ) DATEThis form is for your records. Do not submit it to the Department of Motor Vehicles((I realize this generates as many questions as it answers, but at least the form is explained, I hope! Note above that the DMV washes its hands of the thing. It's for your records, don't bother them with how to use it. 😉 -- Jon--
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #14 – February 06, 2017, 10:30:42 am Smog testing in the '70's was a buyer be ware thing and car dealers did the smog to close the transaction. The laws have attempted to make it Seller be ware. To add to the confusion, it seems that with EPA Emission guarantee requirements, California lets you buy out of the first two smog tests. But for an out of state purchase it is still buyer be ware. Don't buy a new 49 state car( if they exist at this point) and bring to California. It will never get registered until it leaves and comes back used(over 6000 miles). At some point the smog repairs are more than the value of the vehicle and the seller can just scrap it or sell out of state. Or ya'h buy it as is and fix it, because a newer vehicle purchase price is beyond your means.Fortunately, fuel injection has made purchasing a non smog tested used fuel injected vehicle less of a risk.What if the seller is in a non Smog region of California?
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #15 – February 06, 2017, 10:00:03 pm I read it as if the sale is complete and seller didn't follow the law, the buyer is agreeing to be responsible for getting it smoged.e.g a way to make someone responsible.I agree some sellers may not be aware it is a requirement.Another reason to complete the sale at the DMV (e.g. DMV does the transfer for you and assures all is ok). 1 Likes
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #16 – February 07, 2017, 07:48:21 pm Quote from: Jon & Loni - February 05, 2017, 08:16:12 pmActually, no. Here's the full wording of the section (the language within the (()) is my commentary):VEHICLE EMISSION SYSTEM STATEMENT (SMOG)(California Vehicle Code Section 5751.5)((THIS FORM must be signed by the seller and given to the buyer in the situation where the transaction will take place within 90 days of the seller already having filed his current smog certificate with the State. This form is a warranty by the seller that he/she hasn't made any modifications to the vehicle SINCE the smog certificate was filed such that the vehicle might not pass the test. See the paragraph below.))((I realize this generates as many questions as it answers, but at least the form is explained, I hope! Note above that the DMV washes its hands of the thing. It's for your records, don't bother them with how to use it. 😉 -- Jon--Oh my gosh thank you! At last, English!:-) I understand now. I can't imagine anyone modifying the emissions systems after a vehicle has passed smog, so I wouldn't be worried about that. Thank you again for explaining that in terms I don't fall asleep by.:-)
Re: Smog or no smog Reply #17 – February 07, 2017, 07:51:40 pm Quote from: sfhankman - February 05, 2017, 01:10:42 pmOpuntia,Just an FYI, this LD has been on Craigslist for about a month now listed at $18,500 and now listed on RV trader for less. Seems to me there is a reason the owner does not want to pre-smog it for a new buyer. When I was looking for my LD most seller did not have a problem smogging. If they are not willing, walk away doesn't matter what year the LD is.HankThank you Hank. I spoke to him and he is will to smog the rig for a serious buyer. He posted a video too. I just think it has too many miles for me and too expensive, as well.
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