Log In | Register
Skip to main content
Topic: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan (Read 7 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Yahoo Message Number: 157457
We've been camping these last few weeks with some temperatures as low as 30 degrees at night.  When we're in the coach, we keep the interior warm while leaving cabinet doors open.  I've placed a drop-light under the kitchen sink to keep the back of the outside shower warm.  I disconnected city water while making sure the fresh water tank is about 2/3 fill.  We haven't emptied the black or gray water tanks at night in these temperatures.  And we've heated the hot water tank late at night and then again early in the morning.

We have several more trips planned in the next few weeks.  We anticipate temperatures remaining near or above 32 degrees at night.  Since we have not winterized and we will not be in the coach at night while it's in storage, I'm thinking about using the following partial winterizing plan just in case the weather service is wrong and temperatures drop below freezing.  I'd like feedback on this partial winterized plan before I use it.

We plan to drain the black tank, gray tank, and fresh water tank.  We also plan to drain the water heater.  Since our storage has 15 amp service, I plan to run an electric heater on a low temperature next to the MB and use a drop light under the kitchen sink.  I also plan to open the hot and cold water faucets.  So the only step we aren't planning to do is use compressed air on the plumbing until we do a complete winterization sometime in January 2016.  So again, is the a workable and safe plan?  Thank you in advance for your feedback.

Ed & Margee Fort Worth
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157460
Are you are just trying to avoid blowing the lines so as to make it easy to use the LD before you totally winterize in Jan.? Unless you keep the interior above 32* you run the risk of whatever water is left in the lines freezing. It's the water pump, toilet and other interior lines that freeze up and are often damaged, not the holding tanks. It's usually a harder freeze than 30-32* that damages things, but there still is the risk. Perhaps others will have different opinions.
 Is the storage area enclosed? Is that why you will have a heater next to the LD, to warm up the outside temp? Otherwise I don't see what the benefit of that would be. If you have electricity, why not leave a heater running on low in the LD? There is risk, of course, of heater failure. I have done this for several days when cold temps arrived before I could winterize and I am close enough to my storage to check things every day if needed.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157461
I run an electric heater on medium. Sometimes I am not there so I use the Wave3 instead. It is always a risk running a heater in an unattended vehicle. I limit it as much as possible.

Bob I wonder...
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157462
I don't think you need to worry if it gets above freezing during the day. We have gone several weeks in the 20's with no problems. We kept the doors open that had plumbing behind them, kept the furnace on low (the heater would work) and a comforter draped between the cab and the cabin. We also put reflexix(sp?) between the window and the shade which really cuts down on heat loss. I don't think you would need to drain the fresh tank. It takes a lot of cold to freeze 55 gallons of water!
2015 27' Mid Bath
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157463
It takes maybe an hour or two to blow the lines after you have emptied the FW and HW tanks.  And it gets much quicker after the first time.  That said I think you will be ok given your plan for temps that reach 29-30 deg for part of the night.  Not sure if the water in the hot water tank helps or hurts the process as it might add some protection through convection currents.
A plan b just in case it decides to get cold before you blow the lines.
a. When dumping the hot water tank I first opened the hot water knobs at each faucet and established the hot water tank gap.  Then drained the hot water tank so all air going into the tank had to come from the water lines to the hot water faucets.  That process cleared a lot of the water out of those lines.  It takes longer than just opening the pressure relief valve but it nearly sucked the lines dry.  Consider draining the hot water tank that way
b. When I winterized this time like you I dumped fresh water, hot water, grey and black tanks.  Unlike the manual and the past few years - I hooked my antifreeze rig (see https://dac.smugmug.com/Cars/Individual-cars/Lazy-Daze-improvements-gadgets/Winterizing-stuff/  from our winterizing thread earlier this year) to the strainer before the pump and just pumped a gal of RV antifreeze through the lines.  This almost most filed the cold water lines to the faucets and hot water tank.  When I later blew the lines all the cold water lines were mostly  pink.  I did this so any small amounts of fluid left over that might collect in the lines would be mostly RV antifreeze.  But the same idea would put RV antifreeze in the low lying areas of the rv water lines.  If you opened the cold water faucets you might be able to clear all the water from those lines.  It would likely take more than a gallon though.  But RV antifreeze is cheep as compared to replacing lines.

I would not want to spend a winter with out blowing the lines with compressed air but it at least puts a healthy amount of RV antifreeze in the lines.  I ordered my antifreeze from amazon.
Currently: 2008 36' Tiffin Open Road
Previously: 2007 Mid Bath
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157468
This information was very helpful.  Just to followup with Chris.

Are you are just trying to avoid blowing the lines so as to make it easy to use the LD before you totally winterize in Jan.?  Reply - Correct

Unless you keep the interior above 32* you run the risk of whatever water is left in the lines freezing.  Reply - We plan to keep the interior above 32 with an electric heater & the lowest setting on the propane heater.
 Is the storage area enclosed? Is that why you will have a heater next to the LD, to warm up the outside temp? Reply - Heater is next to the mid-bath area.

Finally, we want to continue travel in this cooler weather with less crowded State Parks and without the work of winterizing every 10 days (if that makes sense).   We're not ready to put our LD into winter storage yet ... we're having too much fun.  The camp grounds are empty and quiet, the animals and birds are easier to see, and the campfires are wonderful.   On our trip this last weekend, we saw 8 deer, one (1) fox, countless male and female Cardinals, racoon tracks, and once again caught zero fish.  And so it goes.

Ed & Margee Fort Worth
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157469
When dumping the hot water tank I first opened the hot water knobs at each faucet and established the hot water tank gap.  Then drained the hot water tank so all air going into the tank had to come from the water lines to the hot water faucets.  That process cleared a lot of the water out of those lines.  It takes longer than just opening the pressure relief valve but it nearly sucked the lines dry.  Consider draining the hot water tank that way

I haven't see this suggestion before and it makes great sense to me.  So thank you John for this clever suggestion.

Ed & Margee Fort Worth
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157470
If you have a heater on in the LD, you should have no problems. And with a heater you wouldn't have to empty the fresh water tank. Just open the cabinet doors where there is plumbing. And as long as the holding tanks were not plumb full and the temps were lower than mid-20s, I wouldn't worry about them either as long as daytime temps get above freezing.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157471
Ed,

On my '03 RB the shower drain trap is not in the conditioned space, so I pour some anti-freeze into the drain to protect the trap as a precaution even though I don't think there's enough water in it to damage it if it froze.  I don't know if all models are the same, but just thought I'd mention it.

Bill

2003 -- 23' RB
Bill
2003 -- 23' FL
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157475
Ed and Margee, I have no guarantee that my thinking on this is on track, but...you may be increasing the risk of damage.  With a nighttime temp just reaching 32 degrees, the likelihood of anything freezing is low.  The black tank will not freeze.  You might get some ice in the grey tank drain line, so dumping the grey tank is prudent.  No harm in dumping the black tank while you are at it.
 As to the fresh water system, if you are not going to blow out the lines, I see little point in draining the fresh water tank and the water heater.  You say you will have a heater running inside.  If the rig will be stored outside, I would turn the furnace on, at its lowest setting.  Leave the cabinet doors open.  With inside temps of 50 or more I see no risk of anything freezing.  Removing the heat storage contained in the fresh water tank and hot water tank, while not blowing out the lines, would seem to make those lines more subject to freezing.  My suggestion is to either blow out the lines or to not drain the fresh water tank and water heater.  It is your rig - use your judgment, not mine.
 In a few days, I will be leaving my rig for 2 or 3 nights.  I will not be draining anything.  I will leave the furnace on, at its lowest setting.  I expect night temperatures to drop to the 20's.  I will leave the cabinet doors open.  I expect no issues.
 CAVEATS - My rig is an '08, so I have foam block insulation in the walls and I have thermopane windows.  My cab area is completely closed off.  Thus, my interior may be less susceptible to cold than other, older rigs.

Ken F in NM
'08 MB
 
Re: Help with a Partial Winterization Plan
Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 157480
Ken F said  "As to the fresh water system, if you are not going to blow out the lines, I see little point in draining the fresh water tank and the water heater. You say you will have a heater running inside. If the rig will be stored outside, I would turn the furnace on, at its lowest setting. Leave the cabinet doors open. With inside temps of 50 or more I see no risk of anything freezing. Removing the heat storage contained in the fresh water tank and hot water tank, while not blowing out the lines, would seem to make those lines more subject to freezing."

This makes sense along with some of the other advice mentioned above.  So I think our plans are in place to keep the LD ready to go until temperatures really turn nasty.  But for now, we'll use the precautions and guidance suggested herein and we should be good to go.  We've two (2) more trips planned this month and at least one (1) in January 2016.  We're keeping an eye on extended forecasts and ready to winterize when necessary.

Ed & Margee Fort Worth