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Topic: slides - still too heavy and unreliable? (Read 4 times) previous topic - next topic
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slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Yahoo Message Number: 126640
In the past, I have the impression that slides have been considered (by LD)to be heavy, unreliable, and prone to leak. Is that generally still considered to be true? I see that most people have them, and I have to admit that being in an opposed-slide living room was very impressive, over 13 feet wide.

Regards, TS
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126644
"In the past, I have the impression that slides have been considered (by LD)to be heavy, unreliable, and prone to leak. Is that generally still considered to be true?"

TS

Yup, that's how LD view slides.
Look at this way, many 26-27' LDs are at or near their GVWs.  Most 30's LDs, that I have worked on, appear to be overloaded.
There isn't extra the cargo capacity to dedicate to the several hundred pounds of extra material needed for a slide, except on the 24' models.
Chopping a big hole in the side of an RV requires a lots of added heavy structural material, in an attempt to regain some of the lost structural strength, using more of the cargo capacity.
Many RV manufacturers build E450 RVs, with slides, that have little or no cargo capacity.
I have seen coach manufacturers re-designates an RV's GVW up a thousand pounds, by adding rear air bags so their RV appears to still have cargo capacity, even though the frame, brakes and axles are still the same. Fleetwood is famous for this.
 Slides add space, empty space that isn't always very useful except psychologically. Slides are huge energy leaks and do nothing to improve the all-weather capability.
Then there is the problem of sides themselves. They have seals that wear and eventually leak. They need an awning to cover the top of the slide. The awnings can leak in wind-driven rain. They need to be operated level and properly maintained or they will break or jam. Slides are similar to hydraulic levelers: wonderful when they work, a genuine PIA when they break in the wrong place or wrong time.
 Most LD owners accept the smaller interior space in return for a  dependable, robust coach with better all-weather capability. Being able to bring along adequate amounts of gear, without exceeding the GVW, is a good thing.
LD owners, for the most part, are different breed than many other RV owners. We are experienced campers who are looking for an comfortable, efficient way of traveling or living out in the world. Flash is much less important than functionality. Smaller is better is many ways.

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126645
My wife and I agree that slides usually add only floor space, and we don't need floor space. It's not like we're line dancing or anything. It usually means the couch, wardrobe, kitchen counter is narrower. A few, very few that we've looked at, use the extra space to make the dinette, couch, etc bigger, which they could with extra floor space. The shorter Class Cs we favor lose storage space (mechanism and extra structure gotta go somewhere), reduce the payload capacity, and add cost and complexity.
 In bigger units that have an excess of everything, that loss of space and payload isn't a problem, but bigger brings us problems (remember the 34' trailer?).

Eric
2005 Jayco 24SS
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126647
Larry,
 I would agree with almost everything you've written except for the sentence about LD owners being experienced campers...there are some of us, ourselves included, who are RV weenies...never, ever camped or RV'd, the LD being the very first experience at it...and really not wanting to be aggravated or driven to insolvency by trying to own a sub-par SOB.  Quality trumps any slide.

TinaP 2006 MB   "Wild Thing"....wildest thing we ever did financially...and loving it!
2006 MB
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126648
So agreed on all you've commented on.  I'd rather take reliability any day over floor space.  I know I've got time-tested design on my side in a LD going down the road.  True, some days, when it is rainy outside and we're "house-bound," I wish for more interior room.  But then I look out those wondrous windows in our RB and I'm truly content.

Happy trails,

Jules
'04RB
'O6 IB Anniversary Model
Sue, My Copilot
Carlie, our canine princess
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126650
Yes, slide seals wear and eventually leak...IF they are not properly maintained (just like a roof that isn't properly maintained will eventually leak).
 Slides don't *need* awning covers...we've had slides in every RV we've had except our Lazy Daze and a couple of early truck campers we owned and have never had awning covers over any of them.  Nor will we ever get them...we know too many people with slide awning covers that have to bring their slides in when the wind blows hard enough because the covers flap and can destroy themselves, not to mention the noise they make.

If your RV is level enough to be comfortable for you to walk around inside...and for your refrigerator...it's level enough to work the slides.
I don't really understand the statement that they need to be "properly maintained or they will break or jam."  Don't all RV systems have to be properly maintained, or you'll have trouble with them?
 As you can tell, I'm a big fan of slides; however, I don't really think they're a good thing on an E-450 chassis (or something like the Sprinter chassis) since they would take away too much payload, particularly in the longer models.  I think Lazy Daze is doing the right thing by not adding slides to their rigs.

Linda Hylton http://earl-linda.blogspot.com
Linda Hylton
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126653
Don't forget the other part of the equation with slides being in an RV.. Structural integrity of the RV.  Whenever you cut a HUGE hole in the side, you're going to REALLY have to beef up the remaining structure to account for that hole.  Some mfg's do this better than others I suspect.

I was reading a thread a few months ago about a Fleetwood owner that had a full-wall slide -- I'll let you all read it directly.  I feel sorry for the owner!

http://tinyurl.com/cty6gxx

This is one of those reasons that I'd never buy a slide on any RV -- as I do not know whether each of these RV's (pick a brand) has the proper structural integrity to deal with the physics involved.  Anyway, I'm sure there are tons of stories like this out there that you all have read before -- just my $0.02 worth..

-- Rick
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126656
Linda
 Most people are biased based upon their experiences. You have had positive experiences with slides so you like them.
I'm biased since I'm one of those people who help other campers with their mechanical problems. I have personally been involve in the retraction of several slides, during the years, and have retracted many bad hydraulic leveling rams (many on LDs, at the end of a Caravan).
Many of the problems are caused from poor design and/or lack of maintenance. Two incidents were caused by the RV not being level, with the frame slightly twisted. One slide had no way to manually retract the slide...such joy! We had to use a forklift to lift and retract the slide. Most newer slides do come with a hand crank to over-ride the motor. I cringe at the huge size of some of the newer slides, wondering how difficult a manual retraction would be.
Point is most folks are not like you in that they do not care or know how to use and maintain their slides (or levelers) properly.
 A slide is a heavy, complex piece of equipment which, by its very nature, is going to be more trouble prone than a wall, no matter how well maintained.

Nothing against slides as long as they are in someone else's RV.
I have enough problems.

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126657
Believe it or not, there is at least one LD out there with a slide. It is pictured in the photos section as 23.5 slide. Dated Oct 30,2006. The photo was taken at the Balloon Fiesta. I met the two women who own it at another group's rally, and have toured it. One of the TK sofas on the driver's side was removed and a dinette built in the space. I was told it was to allow grandchildren to play games. Think it also converted to a bed. If you're interested take a look at the pics.
Beverly 07TK Brownian Motion
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126659
Quote
Nothing against slides as long as they are in someone else's RV.
I have enough problems.
Larry
Tossing in my $0.02 - when a massive storm dumped over a foot of snow in Mammoth this fall in 36 hrs, the BUS with 3 extended slides parked nearby in the Twin Lakes cg decided to try to leave. None of the slides could be fully retracted, but he finally managed to slew and slide his way out. Don't know if he had mechanical problems to address later, but thankful we weren't faced with that dilemma. It's hard to plan for every situation...

Steve
2004 FL
2013 Honda Fit
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126665
"Believe it or not, there is at least one LD out there with a slide. It is pictured in the photos section as 23.5 slide."

Beverly

I remember seeing this LD and wondering why.
A T/K already has a wonderful dinette area and it makes into a king-size bed. Very little was gain for the large pile of cash it cost to do this. The new dinette looks to small to sleep anyone other than a small child.  I fail to see the benefit.
 The side of the LD would have to be removed to install steel framing around the cutout. Adding this extra material, plus all the other added parts would throw the rear weight balance way off.
It would be difficult to add enough extra weight, on the passenger side, to balance the rear axle. This is why slides should to be part of the original design.
 For those of you who still want a slide, there are RV shops that specialize in conversions.
http://www.buscustomer.com/slide_out_units.htm>

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126668
The trailer length makes "short" a virtue for the motorhome pulling it, which is half the reason we are reluctant to go larger than our current 24 footer. Almost everything involving moving gets harder with "longer": gas stations, campgrounds, city streets, backing up, turning around on streets and unexpected dead ends. Even pulling off the road can be a challenge in some places.

It is nicer when parked, of course.

Eric
2005 Jayco 24SS
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126671
Quote
"The trailer length makes "short" a virtue for the motorhome pulling it,..."

Eric
Eric
 Let me see if I can understand this... what you are saying is that you tow a Travel Trailer(?) behind your 24' Lazy Daze? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??
 If that be the case (and pardon me if I've misunderstood) what is your overall length?
 The reason I ask is that prior to down sizing to an '04 30IB LD I towed a 30' Holiday Rambler TT with the full sized 1994 Ford E350 Club Wagon. The overall length of the two units was 50'. I drove that combination for ten years and many thousands of miles, two trips to the east coast, two to Texas and one to Alaska and back. In all that time I never had any of the concerns you describe. Why is that?

Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Jiggs
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #16 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126674
Quote
Hi Steve,
 "Just in case you missed the image link in my recent email, here it is:
 https://sites.google.com/site/ash26eforum/motorhome

As you can see, it's not a travel trailer..."

Eric
Eric

Aha, now I get your drift.
 Okay, two things jumped out at me. First, you should benefit greatly from a back-up camera. At least then you could see what's going on behind you.
 Secondly, have you considered a receiver (offset slightly to the right so you can see better down the left side of the trailer)for the front of the LD??? I had one on each of my Ford Club Wagons ('84 & '94) and found them especially useful at spotting my trailer/s into tight spaces. A long shank and the proper sized ball should do the trick.

Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Jiggs
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #17 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126676
FWIW: I owned a single-slide '98 coach from 2006-2009 and our current 4-slide coach for two years now, all with toppers, w/hundreds of slide out/in cycles in temps from 12F up to 110F and sustained winds of 30 gusts to 40. Mechanical problems to date: nada, zero. Slide toppers replaced to date: 3, total expense maybe $500, done at my discretion based on prophylactic replacements. Leaks to date: zero.
I'm not saying I won't have a problem; I understand that. (I don't expect any leaks, BTW, and sure, I pull them in for short periods in extreme winds/rain, as I do my awning.) I am saying that in a well-designed and built coach (mine have been Tiffins), one can enjoy incredible roominess and comfort (we have about 1050 square feet all-out) in exchange for a mechanical risk that I willingly accept.
By the way, I can say the same thing about my jacks; I replaced one on my '98 because its retraction got slow but I've yet to be stranded by these systems. Might be someday.
Although I think LD could engineer and build a fine slideout system, I agree weight is a bigger issue in class C's. And hey, is this a great country or what?? We can RV with or without slides and jacks.
In sum: slides may be heavy, but they're not unreliable in my experience as an owner/operator. And I have yet to meet a single class A owner who has fewer than four slides who wouldn't love to have 'em all.
YMMV.

Gary Allen 2007 Phaeton 40QDH/Freightliner/Cat C7 Williamsburg VA "Life in the Bus Lane"
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #18 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126679
Quote
Backing up takes care and patience, because the narrow, low trailer can't be seen when it's behind the motorhome, except poorly in the fisheye lens on the rear window, or when it's turning.
Eric, sounds like the same problem I had when I first tried to back my 12' boat into the water for the first time.  Had no idea where the boat was.  Wish I had ordered the backup camera.  I have 2 6' pieces of pvs pipe I put together with a sleeve and lay across the transit of the boat. I put a flag in the end of the pipe.  This may or may not work for you but is a must for me.
Joe Hamm-San Jose
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #20 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126695
Eric Greenwell wrote:
 'The trailer length makes "short" a virtue for the motorhome pulling it, which is half the reason we are reluctant to go larger than our current 24 footer. '
 For long trailer handling, a factor that is almost as important as overall length, is the length of overhang behind the RV's rear axle ' longer being worse.  My MB has a foot less overhang than some slightly longer SOBs, like a Big Foot a friend of mine owns. I tow the same length trailer as Eric, so the 26.5 (now 27 due to a longer front end) was at the max end of the length I would consider. Turns out that, as previously discussed here many times, this length also allows camping in many spots a longer RV would never fit.

bumper

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
bumper
"Yonder" '05 MB
"WLDBLU" glider trailer
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #21 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126722
Hi Steve,

I did have a back-up camera for a couple years, but it didn't help nearly as much as I thought it would. A big reason is I've had a 30 years of practice with long glider trailers, so I've adapted pretty well to the fish-eye and the side mirrors. Plus, with 34 feet, it doesn't get out of position very quickly, so it's easier
2005 Jayco 24SS
 
Re: slides - still too heavy and unreliable?
Reply #22 –
Yahoo Message Number: 126723
Hi Betty,
 It's a lovely picture from a pilot in Europe. It's the same model of glider that I have - 60 foot wing span, with carbon fiber construction.
It's those wings that need such a long trailer!

Eric
2005 Jayco 24SS