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Topic: calipers and spark plugs (Read 11 times) previous topic - next topic
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calipers and spark plugs
Yahoo Message Number: 111224
My 2003 is due for its first brake job. I have 83K on it and even though I haven't had problems with the brakes and it seems I could go longer, I decided to go ahead and install new pads on front and back before leaving Mass. and heading to Utah. I read a past post that I found on Ted's wxtoad site where someone said the rear calipers should be rebuilt or replaced with every brake job. My mechanic hasn't removed the rear wheels yet but said he could get a general idea if the calipers are still in good condition by examining them. The two rear Ford calipers would be about $300.00 and I am inclined to just go ahead and buy them and not have to worry about them for the next 80K. I do have the pins lubed every 20K. Am I being overly cautious or do you think this is a good way to spend $$?
 For those of you who will either change out your spark plugs yourself or have your mechanic(not Ford) do it, Dave from blownoutsparkplugs.com was kind enough to email me a step by step how to. My mechanic is very patient with me and is always willing to read all the print outs from the yahoo group I thrust at him and allows me to hang around supervising. He did have to remove the dog house and passenger seat to get to some of the plugs. I have no idea how those guys from blownoutsparkplugs do it without removing these things.

I'd really appreciate your input on the calipers.

Thanks,

Calicia
Re: calipers and spark plugs
Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 111229
I'd really appreciate your input on the calipers.

Calicia

At 83K, I say change them. It should add about $150 + labor.
Rebuilt rear calipers are not all that expensive, about $65 each from Napa. Add a set of Motorcraft Super Duty pads, about $85+ shipping for the rear set.
Front calipers cost about the same, with the Super Duty pads costing about $50 a set. I get the Motorcraft Super Duty pads from Rock Auto.
The costly items are the rotors and labor.
 Make sure the brake fluid is totally flushed including the ABS pump.

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: Brakes
Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114456
Not Larry, but I will add my $0.015 worth: On such a heavy vehicle (remember, even dry you are over 10,000lbs), the only 'cold stop' that you will do in your drive is the first few seconds of pulling out of your parking spot. Light vehicles with big brakes (think: Sports Cars) are the most effected by the cold stop challenges of Severe Duty friction materials.
The Motorcraft Super Duty pads are a quality pad, not my personal first choice, but an excellent choice none the less. Also, even though they are 'Motorcraft', that does not mean that they were the pads that were originally installed by Ford on the truck. 'Motorcraft' branding does mean it will be a high quality product though. In a prior life I worked for one of the original Ford suppliers, and we had a different product for 'Original Manufacturing' then we packaged for 'Original Equipment Replacement', again not that they were sub-par, I would have no hesitations about their use in a LD. And as long as the rotors are not glazed (I would resurface or replace, as these are hubless rotors, they are east to remove, no bearings to deal with) and the hardware/caliper slides are in good condition, you should not experience any noise.

Ken Sann

Wannabe in SoCal
Re: Brakes
Reply #5 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114462
"Did you end up installing the Motorcraft Super Duty pads on your rig? "

Steve
 Not yet. They are still sitting on the bench. After ordering the pads, I inspected both the front and rear brakes and found lots of lining and all of it was in good shape so I lubed the front calipers and called it good for the time being. Not bad for 54,000 miles, over half of it towing a 4000lb Jeep.
I will do them soon since the front wheel bearings need to be serviced. For several years, the front brakes have had a squeal when braking at low speeds and I hope changing the pads helps.
 It's not a lightweight job. Besides dealing with the tires and wheels, the front hubs and rotors are a one piece design that weight somewhere around 60lbs each. The rear rotors are modular and much lighter but in return, you get to wrestle with the dual wheels. Such joy! The rotors look good so I will have them miked and surfaced.
I usually change calipers every other pad change but always inspect them for leaks and torn seals.
 I will report back when they have been changed and have a couple thousand miles on them.

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: Brakes
Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114465
I personally prefer one of the aftermarket Severe Duty frictions. Wagner, Napa, Centric (my personal favorite, but that is clouded by knowing the company on a personal level, it is their friction that I use on my car, my ex-wife (hey, she caries my daughter, so nothing less than the best), and any of my friends that I end up doing the brakes on. But
Re: Brakes
Reply #7 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114468
Thanks, I stand corrected, I was envisioning the F-450 in my mind, which is Rotor-only front and back. Yup, 50+lbs there, and huge with the stepped hub.
 Larry, your approach on caliper change is very conscientious, I am very impressed. You obviously are well aware of how dangerous improperly working brakes can be on something heavy (who wants to do the calculations about inertia on 12,000lbs travelling at 60mph...?).
And you are also very smart about keeping them sliding well (as you mentioned that you lubed them), when I was in the caliper part of the industry, a huge amount of calipers cores that were returned that were actually bad, had seized slide mechanisms. You are not only extending the life of the pads, rotors, and calipers, but also ensuring that you have the safest performance possible.

Ken Sann

Wannabe in SoCal
Re: Brakes
Reply #8 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114469
"I personally prefer one of the aftermarket Severe Duty frictions. Wagner, Napa, Centric (my personal favorite, but that is clouded by knowing the company on a personal leve"

Ken
 I would be very interesting to sit down and talk with you about brakes and all the myths that surround them.
Centric seems to manufactures good stuff. I used their PosiQuiet pads on my Jeep and their premium rotors on all my vehicles. I appreciate that the pads come with fitment shims, very unusual.
Their pads did not work well on my wife's Acura. Like all my previous Honda experiences, Factory pads just seem to work best and without noise, my biggest complaint about the aftermarket pads.
 I like the feel of the stock pads on our 2003 E450 23.5' LD. They have worked consistently well and I wanted to get as close to the original pads as possible. They are semi-metallic and do require a bit of warm-up time. It has never been a problem since the hydraulically boosted power brakes can exert tremendous pressure on the pads, warming them up almost instantly. The E450 power brakes are the best of any RV I have owned so far. Our LD is a 23.5' model so it's lighter than the longer models so my experience may not be universal.
I went into a Ford truck dealer's part department and ask the part's guy what pads they used for E450s. I got the same from Rock Auto.
Now are they the same...who knows? Stay tune!
 http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php 2003 E450 6.8 liter MOTORCRAFT Part # BRSD655 MOTORCRAFT Part # BRSD411

Larry
2001 MB
* Not to be confused with Larry W (3000 of my posts are actually from expert Larry W due to Yahoo transition mis-step)
Re: Brakes
Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 114471
Any time. are you in the Los Angeles area? I would love to sit down for coffee too (I no longer work in the parts industry, but the commercial coffee industry in Montebello) and get you great prices on Centric parts in the future (I can arrange for you to will-call them at either of Centrics facilities) (really, good connections for most types of parts, not just Centric). In fact, I can arrange those same Motorcraft Severe duty pads locally, without shipping them, if you are ever in the need.
 As to the pads that the Ford dealer were offering, they were probably exactly the same as what you bought from Rockauto. Truly.
 I would be interested to know which formula pads you were unhappy with, they probably carry five different series, and within a series they utilize different formulations based on the application.
 Larry, I will send my phone # off-line if you ever have time, or are in the area. I am sure that I could arrange a tour of Centric, but to be honest, it is just basic manufacturing and distribution now. When I worked for the predecessor company, we manufactured rotors also, that was fun to watch.
They do still re-manufacture calipers in Carson, but not too exciting.

Ken Sann

wannabe in SoCal