Hauling A Scooter November 01, 2008, 06:46:47 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97023I finally got around to posting photos of the rack we had installed to carry our Vespa (250GTE) around on our 23TK. Here's the link to the photos file on this forum, and a tiny url (I hope). As previously reported, this was a custom job, and it has worked perfectly. The cowling of the scoot rests against the curved upright, leaning forward slightly. We strap it down front and rear, and also strap the front tire to the angle end of the carrying track. The inner track is a removable ramp that attaches to the rear end of the carry track. To unload, we just walk it backwards down the ramp (power off), and to load I just walk it up, with the scoot doing the work. With the CVT transmission, this is an easy task. No clutch to keep slipping, and I can keep one hand on the brake in case I goose the power a little too much. We just finished a 45 day trip through AZ and NM, including the balloon fiesta, and the scoot performed flawlessly at all altitudes, including the top of the Sandias at over 8,000 feet. Hooray for fuel injection! We put about 500 miles on it this trip, including a thrilling first-time night ride through the pitch-dark NM desert at 60+, two lanes, semi's blasting by. Is this a mid, er, late-life crisis or what? --Jon http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/lifewithalazydazerv/photos/browse/1600?c=http://tiny.cc/5Ftni
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #1 – November 01, 2008, 09:33:46 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97028Nah, sounds more like making up for lost time.Rock OnTina P 2006 MB "Wild Thing"
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #2 – November 01, 2008, 10:49:13 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97031Nice scooter, pictures, and mount. Thanks for posting them. I'm a Vespa fan also and have had several of them. My best feat with a Vespsa is San Diego to Sacramento via 99 over the grape vine back in 64, the first model they built that was freeway legal. Had a flat rear tire around Fresno, was able to change it by building a pile of rocks to raise it off the ground. Do you carry a spare? The most fun part was going through LA following the beach, probably should have followed the coast all the way, oh well. Glad you had a safe journey, many more, That scooter have a gps?Michelle http://www.flickr.com/photos/safoocat/2916780820/
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #3 – November 02, 2008, 01:35:45 am Yahoo Message Number: 97039I'm sure I missed the previous posting on this topic (dang work ;-). Couple of basic questions: What sort of performance do you get on the Vespa carrying both of you? We're looking for something similar (had been looking at small motorcycles). Curious about your top speed, range, and comfort with two, and overall weight of the scooter. I like your hitch carrier -- seems very compact. You call it a custom job -- did you make it or did you have it made for you. I will be needing something similar (curious as to the weight of this as well). Finally, did you have to beef up the hitch? I would be putting mine on a 26.5 MB, so it may require additional reinforcement. Welcome additional input or a pointer to that previous posting if that covered this material.Thanks,Steve and Carol Crisp Thistle Dew Too
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #4 – November 02, 2008, 07:30:54 am Yahoo Message Number: 97040"Steve and Carol Crisp" wrote: Welcome additional input or a pointer to that previous posting if that covered this material. --- See message number 95762.Joan
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #5 – November 02, 2008, 01:39:40 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97042Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp" ..."We're looking for something similar..." Steve - Does this mean you've changed your mind about selling Thistle and will be taking it to Europe with you?Anne JohnsonLovely La Verne, CA
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #6 – November 02, 2008, 04:02:51 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97044Hey Jon, Thanks so much for your recent info on your Vespa. The photos really tell it all about the carrier.Steve and Carol asked some great questions that I have been interested in too. My “DD” is also a 26 ½’ (like the Crisps) and I am wondering if the extra length would make the cycle not ride as well, like maybe the front end would ride a bit light? At one time I thought I would tow but not now. If I put a cycle in the back end I could also put my dog’s x-pens on the front end and that could help to equal the weight a tiny bit and also get the pens out of the inside. I also found an aluminum very light weight carrier that might be able to be modified like yours so it won’t be resting on the hitch. Jon, do you think an aluminum carrier could be modified or would it have to be built from scratch?I did a lot of web browsing and decided that I would be better off with a very small motor cycle. With the cycle I could get bigger wheels then the smaller scooter wheels, which are safer on the road. Of course, then I had to find one that was very light weight and I did find a Honda cycle that only weighs 267 lbs. fully loaded with fuel/liquids. Of course the Honda people would probably laugh at me…..a wrinkled old granny wanting a cycle that looks like a dirt bikeOne question Jon: I saw the type of helmets you wear on your website. I also didn’t see any windshield on your scooter. What keeps the bugs from hitting you?Judy Wms.Blue ’07 RB “Dog Daze”And all the fur kids[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #7 – November 03, 2008, 05:21:39 am Yahoo Message Number: 97056Thanks Joan. (Steve suitably chagrinned for not just doing his own archive search ;-)Boy, what a lot of info
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #8 – November 03, 2008, 05:33:32 am Yahoo Message Number: 97057Well let's just say we haven't yet sold Thistle Dew Too, and so we are reconsidering our options. Personally, I think I'd still prefer to sell. Just to ease the logistical arrangements. But you have to go with the flow sometimes.Life is never dull, I can certainly tell you that ;-)Steve and Carol Crisp Thistle Dew Too
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #9 – November 03, 2008, 02:22:44 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97064Quote I'm a Vespa fan also and have had several of them. My best feat with a Vespsa is San Diego to Sacramento via 99 over the grape vine back in 64, the first model they built that was freeway legal. Had a flat rear tire around Fresno, was able to change it by building a pile of rocks to raise it off the ground. Do you carry a spare?NOPE, but I carry a can of compressed goop in case of a flat.QuoteThat scooter have a gps? NOPE again, but maybe coming soon. I think we're about the last of the LDers not to have a GPS. Still relying on AAA maps!-- Jon
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #10 – November 03, 2008, 02:41:58 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97065I've heard that goop ruins the tire but suppose it would save the day don't know though having never used it.GPS units are all about love of gadgets though if you go off road they can be helpful. Also they have taken us to places we would never have gone had we used the map because it's a different thought process. If price is what's been holding you back, you don't need an expensive gps, even a cheap old one from ebay will be an introduction. We got a handful of AAA maps at the end of our membership when we switched to Good Sam road service, they are good maps but hard to read in the wind on the scooter Michelle http://www.flickr.com/photos/safoocat/2916780820/
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #11 – November 03, 2008, 07:20:03 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97067"Jon & Loni" wrote: I think we're about the last of the LDers not to have a GPS. Still relying on AAA maps! --- You're not the last, Jon! My AAA (Michelin, Road Master, Rand McNally, Benchmark, etc.) paper maps have served me well through a couple hundred thousand miles of RV travel! I'm no Luddite, but do I really need a yappy box which tries to persuade or bully me to take a wrong turn on some goat trail to a destination?! Nah... ;-)Joan
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #12 – November 04, 2008, 01:03:45 am Yahoo Message Number: 97068Since the scoot has tubeless tires, how about just carrying a tire plug kit and a CO2 inflator. The plug kit is easy to use, no need to demount the tire, and available at all auto parts places as well as Wal-Mart etc. The CO2 inflator is sold at bicycle stores, REI etc. Problem with the pressurized goop method is they make a mess inside the tire, unbalance the wheel, and sometimes cause corrosion.bumper
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #13 – November 04, 2008, 03:02:11 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97072My "DD" is also a 26 ½' (like the Crisps) and I am wondering if the Quoteextra length would make the cycle not ride as well, like maybe the front end would ride a bit light?Judy, I'm no expert on these things, but I think adding any weight behind the rig will inevitably cause some lifting of the front. On my 23, this has proved to be virtually unnoticable. Since the wheelbase of your 26 is longer, perhaps the effect will be the same.QuoteI put a cycle in the back end I could also put my dog's x-pens on the front end and that could help to equal the weight a tiny bit and also get the pens out of the inside. I have seen a number of vans and rigs that have front receiver hitches mounted. I suspect you could have something installed for the dogs' pens.I also found an aluminum very light weight carrier that Quotemight be able to be modified like yours so it won't be resting on the hitch. > Jon, do you think an aluminum carrier could be modified or would it have to > be built from scratch?Again, I'm a consumer, not an expert. I saw a number of ready-made motorcycle racks (our local Yamaha dealer had a good selection) which ran about $700 for something roughly comparable. However, they all were built to mount via the hitch receiver, which had to be at least a class III (LD's is a class II, and is not adequate). LD strongly discourages motorcycle carriers like this, as the weight and the rocking movement eventually messes up the bumper, which is carrying the weight via the hitch receiver. You could install some anti-sway rods to control the rocking, but the weight on the bumper would still be an issue. If you were going to modify the pre-made aluminum racks to use two receiver tubes, like my setup, which are themselves attached to two frame extensions, then I think you are talking about the same money as I paid, once all the mods were made. My unit, which was custom made in one day and specifically sized and designed for the Vespa, cost me $1,400. That's a lotta dough, but I have the peace of mind that it was done right. Like I said before, this was not an economically-based proposition for me, and certainly is not for everyone.Quote I did a lot of web browsing and decided that I would be better off with a > very small motor cycle. With the cycle I could get bigger wheels then the > smaller scooter wheels, which are safer on the road. Of course, then I had > to find one that was very light weight and I did find a Honda cycle that > only weighs 267 lbs. fully loaded with fuel/liquids. Of course the Honda > people would probably laugh at me…..a wrinkled old granny wanting a cycle > that looks like a dirt bikeI wouldn't worry about laughs. You wouldn't believe how many of we "seniors" are out there having fun on two wheels. I also looked at Hondas, but the only cruiser bike that would work was the 250. It had the right weight, but the ergonomics are for persons 5'6" or less, and I couldn't get comfortable. They also are in very short supply. You're probably talking about the Ruckus, which we thought was rather cool in an industrial style of design, but not in the same league as the classic Vespa. You're right about the wheels. Bigger would be better, but we have had no stability problems at all cruising at 60mph with two up. The only exception is that the scoot wheels don't like grooved pavement, which will be added incentive for me to avoid the freeways here in SoCal.Quote One question Jon: I saw the type of helmets you wear on your website. I > also didn't see any windshield on your scooter. What keeps the bugs from > hitting you?The scooter's front fairing keeps the wind and bugs off the body, but the head is fully exposed. The helmets have a pull-down full-face visor that absorbs the bug hits which, even in NM, were few and far between. More troublesome is the amount of wind going past the helmet, which is noisy. I'm going to look into windscreens.-- JON[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #14 – November 04, 2008, 04:37:53 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97073You might consider a wind screen as it will protect you and offer less wind resistance than your body such as this one: http://www.modernvespa.com/forum/topic6033.htmlMichelle http://www.flickr.com/photos/safoocat/2916780820/The scooter's front fairing keeps the wind and bugs off the body, but the head is fully exposed. The helmets have a pull-down full-face visor that absorbs the bug hits which, even in NM, were few and far between. More troublesome is the amount of wind going past the helmet, which is noisy. I'm going to look into windscreens.-- JON[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #15 – November 04, 2008, 04:46:58 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97074Has anyone used a `swivel wheel trailer such as I found below. I would think that it would reduce the tongue weight by sharing it with the wheel. Another advantage is that you can back up with this type of trailer.Any thoughts?Smart Trailer SL200 $3,190.00 http://www.discount-trailers.com/smart-trailer.htmSwivelwheel-46 $1395.00 http://www.cruiserlift.com/swivelwheel46.htmlSWIVELWHEEL-58 $1995.00 http://www.cruiserlift.com/swivelwheel58.htmlJerry in Simi Valley 2000 30 IB
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #16 – November 04, 2008, 04:58:12 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97075Quote--- In lifewithalazydazerv@yahoogroups.com, "Judy Williams" Love the look and idea of the Vespa, but have one Question: What steps necessary to prevent or discourage theft? Looks very vulnerable.
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #17 – November 04, 2008, 06:54:16 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97076"Has anyone used a 'swivel wheel' trailer such as I found below. I would think that it would reduce the tongue weight by sharing it with the wheel." As I recall (correct me, somebody, if I have this wrong), the rule of thumb is that a properly designed and loaded trailer should put only about 10% of its weight on the hitch. If loaded correctly, the first trailer you mentioned, the "Smart Trailer SL200," would meet this criterion because of its centrally positioned wheels. The "Swivelwheel 46" and "Swivelwheel 58" monowheel trailers, however, put at least 50% of their weight on the bumper, which is undesirable. The "bumper puller" monowheel design has been around a long time (see my article "RVing in 1937" for build-it-yourself plans: http://www.andybaird.com/travels/1937/plans3.htm>). It's easy and cheap to build, but its disadvantages have kept this type from becoming popular.Andy Baird http://www.andybaird.com/travels/
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #18 – November 05, 2008, 09:42:12 am Yahoo Message Number: 97079QuoteAs I recall (correct me, somebody, if I have this wrong), the rule of thumb is that a properly designed and loaded trailer should put only about 10% of its weight on the hitch. If loaded correctly, the first This depends on the trailer design, and does not apply in this case, nor with 5th wheels or other designs which use differing dynamics. A conventional trailer is designed to be balanced for dynamic movement with 10% of its weight on the hitch to minimize loading on the tow vehicle while retaining good handling characteristics. The trailer here doesn't need to make such compromises because of the low weights involved. A prime consideration in handling is distribution of mass around the lateral pivot - with more centrally located axles on a trailer, it has been determined that 55% of the mass ahead of the axles is sufficient for safe handling, considering the added mass of the tow vehicle. Even this would not be safe were the tow vehicle very light or with a very short wheelbase - eg a Jeep CJ as tow vehicle. When the mass of the trailer + load is minute compared to the tow vehicle, high stability is obtained with the rear-wheel trailer setup.Steve
Re: Hauling A Scooter Reply #19 – November 05, 2008, 01:15:54 pm Yahoo Message Number: 97085QuoteLove the look and idea of the Vespa, but have one Question: What steps necessary to prevent or discourage theft? Looks very vulnerable. Anne: When carrying it on the rack, I have a cable lock that threads through the scoot's locking ring (welded to the bottom of the footrest area) and then around the carrier. When off the rack, the scoot has a steering lock and some sort of ignition disabling (there's no kick- starter)with one of those ubiquitous flashing lights on the instrument panel. I also carry the cable lock under the seat for use if there is a handy pole. When we travel on it, I try to park it in a highly visible spot to discourage the casual thief. It's insured, of course. I'm more concerned about some yahoo cutting the straps that anchor the D- rings on the helmets and making off with those. -- Jon
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