Battleborn October 08, 2024, 10:20:49 am Those of you that have been thinking about purchasing Battleborn batteries, Amazon Prime members can get a good price for them right now:https://www.amazon.com/Battle-Born-Batteries-Lithium-Ion-LiFePO4/dp/B06XX197GJ/ref=pd_ci_mcx_mh_mcx_views_0?pd_rd_w=ana1t&content-id=amzn1.sym.bb21fc54-1dd8-448e-92bb-2ddce187f4ac%3Aamzn1.symc.40e6a10e-cbc4-4fa5-81e3-4435ff64d03b&pf_rd_p=bb21fc54-1dd8-448e-92bb-2ddce187f4ac&pf_rd_r=75KM496WAZH541KBD4BH&pd_rd_wg=5r387&pd_rd_r=79998e4e-1870-4e6b-9209-ff3e5f6740a7&pd_rd_i=B06XX197GJ As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Battleborn Reply #1 – October 08, 2024, 12:15:46 pm Thanks for the tip, Greg. But in my opinion, $740 for a 100 amp-hour battery with not-too-impressive internal construction, a plastic case, unheated, and without Bluetooth is no bargain. By comparison, $325 will get you a 100 Ah SOK battery in a metal case, with built-in heater, and Bluetooth.Battle Born has been coasting on its reputation for way too long. Their batteries are feature-poor, cheaply built, and priced at twice what they're worth. I can't think of any reason to buy one now. 3 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #2 – October 08, 2024, 12:29:41 pm Quote from: Andy Baird - October 08, 2024, 12:15:46 pmThanks for the tip, Greg. But in my opinion, $740 for a 100 amp-hour battery with not-too-impressive internal construction, a plastic case, unheated, and without Bluetooth is no bargain. By comparison, $325 will get you a 100 Ah SOK battery in a metal case, with built-in heater, and Bluetooth.Battle Born has been coasting on its reputation for way too long. Their batteries are feature-poor, cheaply built, and priced at twice what they're worth. I can't think of any reason to buy one now.Yeah, I've been hearing those rumblings lately. Are the SOK's similar in size to the stock AGM's (direct swap)?
Re: Battleborn Reply #3 – October 08, 2024, 12:45:13 pm Andy is absolutely correct with his observation. For less than double that 100AH price, you can get the 200AH model Amazon.com: SOK Battery 12V 206Ah Heated LiFePO4 Metal Box SK12V206H :... $640, that I have. Two of these fit easily in the standard battery box. (I paid over $1k each without the bluetooth, internal heater or UL approval. 2 years ago.) 400AH without mechanical disruption of my storage areas isn't the issue with your larger MB, but still a consideration. That's about 5 KW hours of power, down to 10% without harming the battery. RonBedited after I saw Greg's question: About the same size each, a little taller, like a Trojan T-145. The size specs are accurate...10.83 X 7.78 X 11.22" but don't count the posts IIRC, which are about 1.3" taller. As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Battleborn Reply #4 – October 08, 2024, 04:36:41 pm One thing I forgot to mention about Battle Born: their "tab" terminals are a pain. With standard battery posts, you can run a cable flat across the top of the battery, minimizing cable length when connecting in parallel. But with BB, the cable must either exit to the side in a big loop, or to the top in a big loop, assuming you have several inches of extra vertical clearance. It's a bad design.
Re: Battleborn Reply #5 – October 08, 2024, 05:00:03 pm If you don't need the heater, but like the idea of Bluetooth, what is the consensus of the best buy these days? The prices seem to vary so much, hard to make a decision but time to replace my old lead acid.
Re: Battleborn Reply #6 – October 08, 2024, 06:28:48 pm My buddy put in Vestwood batteries out of China.It's a big company that started with larger sizes and the added automotive sizes.He got them on Amazon, 200 ah hour for $520. No heaters but Bluetooth and a decent app.So far, after a year they have been very reliable and hold a charge quite well. He has 4 of them.When I need batteries next, it only makes sense to go lithium, and I will probably get the ones sized to fit my battery trayI seem to get about 8 years from my Trojan T 105's, which I'm happy with.
Re: Battleborn Reply #7 – October 08, 2024, 06:49:27 pm Yes, I agree it only makes sense to go lithium. I got eight good years out of my Costco GC-2's, but it's time to change. I just can't believe the price differences between choices. I would like to find ones similar to the size as the GC2's, 100 AH to make it easy to replace the ones I have at a reasonable price. Prices seem to range from $160 to $800....why?
Re: Battleborn Reply #8 – October 09, 2024, 02:28:55 am Hi Rich; The metal case S.O.K. 206 is very close to the GC2 format. W of GC2 7.19", SOK 7.87" about 3/4" wider H of GC2 10.32", SOK 10.7" about .4" taller, sok another 1 inch taller for battery posts, ring terminal and bolt. L of GC2 11.00" SOK 11.02" essentially the same. weight of BB 100AH 32# SOK 206AH 48 # Wet Lead acid 65# The SOK is a 10ga. steel case, not water tight, but can be disassembled with Phillips screws. Voids the warranty, but allows repair or replacement of cells inside. Good quality handles with blind threaded inserts in case, Removal of handles doesn't void warranty or drop nuts inside. (sealed). Does allow it to be mounted on end. The case is more fireproof, but not as insulated or waterproof as plastic cases. A bead of sealant might fix that. I'm sure there is a way for pressure to equalize at altitude. LiF are 12V batteries (12.8-13.4v). You only need one to replace 6 volt wet lead acid. You get more usable power. With a trailer you won't be starting a generator, the big current load. To run a 2kw inverter for microwave use, hair dryer, etc. in the 120Amp range two batteries would be best. (in parallel) No adding water needed. I would hope that higher cost gets you more than just profit margin for the seller. Better warranty? More internal gadgets: internal heater, blue tooth, UL listing? RonB 2 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #9 – October 09, 2024, 11:17:42 am It's funny how things change over time. A few years ago, Battleborn was the gold standard. Now it's the red-headed stepchild (no offense to red-headed stepchildren intended). Looks like China is winning the lithium battery battle . . .
Re: Battleborn Reply #10 – October 09, 2024, 08:11:02 pm Quote from: HiLola - October 09, 2024, 11:17:42 amIt's funny how things change over time. A few years ago, Battleborn was the gold standard. Now it's the red-headed stepchild (no offense to red-headed stepchildren intended). Looks like China is winning the lithium battery battle . . .Battleborn buys the lithium cells from China and assembles them here. I try to buy American, but in this case, the cost is three times the going rate, and you are still getting a mostly Chinese product. Years ago, Battleborn sold state-of-the-art batteries, since then, they have remained stagnant with no changes except for rising prices. Even inexpensive lithium batteries now include Bluetooth.12V 100Ah Bluetooth Lithium Deep Cycle Battery – LiTime-USLarry 2 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #11 – October 10, 2024, 01:43:40 pm My son and I have been talking some about converting to Lithium batteries. I went to the Li Time site and they are saying not to use as a starting battery. If that is really the case how are you guys starting the generator if needed? Is internal heating an absolute must? Thanks,Jon
Re: Battleborn Reply #12 – October 10, 2024, 02:17:16 pm QuoteIf that is really the case how are you guys starting the generator if needed? Is internal heating an absolute must? I have LiTimes. No problem starting the generator. Someone more knowledgeable can address the necessity of heating.jor
Re: Battleborn Reply #13 – October 10, 2024, 05:29:33 pm When the term “starting battery” is used, it is usually referring to starting the large chassis engine, not the small generator engine. Even one (typically 100 A-Hr) Lithium battery is just fine for starting the generator. Heating is worthwhile if the batteries themselves will be below freezing when you try to charge them. If the battery temperatures are warmed by being near or inside the occupied (heated) coach, they may stay well above freezing even if the outside temp is well below freezing. On the other hand, If the coach is not in use, then everything is at the same temp as outside, and a battery maintainer or solar panels would supply charging current, then heated would be appropriate. You wouldn’t want to have heated batteries with heaters enabled without charging, because the heaters draw some modest power from the battery and freezing temps would eventually run them down. 4 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #14 – October 10, 2024, 06:44:47 pm Quote from: JonS - October 10, 2024, 01:43:40 pmMy son and I have been talking some about converting to Lithium batteries. I went to the Li Time site and they are saying not to use as a starting battery. If that is really the case how are you guys starting the generator if needed? Is internal heating an absolute must? Thanks,Two 100-amp/hour lithiums will crank the V10 easily; the generator is a snap.Battery heaters are nice if living in a cold climate but have the discharging issue as mentioned. Since your signature shows you reside in Montana, it could be helpful.The heaters can be adjusted to several heating modes with some Bluetooth-equipped batteries. With shore power, the batteries will stay warm and fully charged.For batteries without heaters, heating mats can be installed later, using RV holding tank heaters. These heaters are available in 120-VAC and 12-Volt versions.Larry 2 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #15 – October 10, 2024, 07:51:56 pm Quote from: jor - October 10, 2024, 02:17:16 pmI have LiTimes. No problem starting the generator. Someone more knowledgeable can address the necessity of heating.jorI also saw the LiTimes statement "Do not use as a starting battery", but they don't explain why. Maybe they just don't want it mounted in the engine compartment with it's high temperatures? Or maybe they are concerned the battery you choose might have BMS that shuts of the battery before the engine starts, as I think is likely with 100A BMS on some of the RV batteriies.Eric G 2 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #16 – October 11, 2024, 09:59:46 am For all practical purposes, Lithium batteries are a commodity. The 'real' difference is the BMS. Most all BMS's are made in China. Unless you construct the battery yourself you are depending on/trusting the manufacturer has pick the best BMS for you. Bottom line the warranty is your only backstop. glen
Re: Battleborn Reply #17 – October 11, 2024, 11:31:19 am Greg,Thanks for starting this thread when you did. My LD is in Texas and I am home in Cali. My son called last night from Texas and said the house lights (LD) seemed dim. I asked him the voltage and he told me 7 volts. I just about fell over. He runs the geni every couple weeks for a couple hours just to exercise everything. Of course the geni wont start on 7. I had him start the engine to get enough power to start the geni and get some juice back in the batteries. And this morning I had him pull it out in the sun and it seems to be bringing in some solar. These are the original batteries from 2019 when I got the rig and they have served me well. My question is are they toast or has anyone ever recovered from that low of a voltage. I am going to Texas tomorrow and will be shopping for batteries likely recommended by all the great minds on this site.Many Many thanks in advance,Randy 1 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #18 – October 11, 2024, 11:42:11 am You're welcome, Randy! I'm getting near end of life on my 2017 batteries so am looking at replacing them soon, as well. I've been vacillating between replacing the AGM's with lithium or like kind. I'm certainly no expert but I'm thinking that your batteries (AGM, I assume) went well below 50% and are toast at this point but let's hear from some of our electrical gurus! 1 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #19 – October 11, 2024, 01:30:14 pm Hi Greg and Randy; Not 'toast' but not good either. Running the generator for a few hours, isn't a good policy really. Lead acid batteries charge very slowly, the power used to start the generator probably isn't replaced during even a few hours, running the generator. The AGM batteries should be charging daily with your built in solar. If not, leaving the rig plugged in maybe just a few hours a day, should keep them topped off. Mike Coachman or WhiteElk had a problem with the built-in converter over charging the AGM batteries, if left on all the time. Batteries depend on chemical conversion real time to make electricity, and cold temperatures slow down those reactions. So cold batteries (Texas?) may have prevented proper charging, or also damage to the batteries. Your new rigs would benefit from LiF conversion, especially if a large outlay to buy new AGM's is in the near future. RonB 1 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #20 – October 11, 2024, 03:01:44 pm "leaving the rig plugged in maybe just a few hours a day, should keep them topped off."(Which is easily accomplished with a $15 plug-in timer :-) 2 Likes
Re: Battleborn Reply #21 – October 11, 2024, 05:32:26 pm Thanks Gents,Great ideas. Thanks Andy for the timer suggestion. I am still trying to find an electrician to run service to my shop. I plan on putting RV receptacles and now timers in the near future. And thanks again Greg and Ron for planting the LiF idea seed. But for my near term needs I may just replace the AGM's. I went looking for my LD manual and realized I must have packed it and its in a box somewhere in Texas. I was hoping the battery specs are in there. There is a camping world in Denton which is fairly close to our house. I am not a fan of CW though. So I may seek out other battery outlets. I like Greg use to thing Battleborn is the standard for this application but now you guys have me wondering. Any good or bad experience is sure appreciated in my probable hunt for batteries.Randy
Re: Battleborn Reply #22 – October 11, 2024, 08:30:04 pm Hi Randy, markings are on the old batteries if you go that route. My choice is Costco, but Sams Club I've heard are good. The AGM's are not vented, so don't involve acid precautions. Take pictures of how they are installed; mark the wires, take photos. (cell phones are great) Don't let the red wires touch anything except the terminals they go to. I use blue painters tape to insulate them while doing the procedure. I use scotchbrite and alcohol to clean the terminals on the new batteries. The ends of the cables also need cleaning. Lifting the 65# for each battery is the hard part. The battery sizes should be 'GC2' (golf cart 2). I don't need those but I'm pretty sure Costco had them on the shelf. Your batteries may be serviceable for now. If you are storing the motorhome until spring, it would make sense to not replace them until you were ready to use the motorhome. Newer batteries, newer stock, don't have to take care of them until it warms up. RonB
Re: Battleborn Reply #23 – October 11, 2024, 08:40:16 pm Quote from: randy62 - October 11, 2024, 05:32:26 pmThere is a camping world in Denton which is fairly close to our house. I am not a fan of CW though. So I may seek out other battery outlets. I wouldn't do Camping World for batteries. Find a retailer who deals in lots of batteries or can get fresh stock from a local distributor. RonB mentions Sam's Club, and of course there's one right there in Rayzor Ranch. With all the golf carts at Robson, I'd think they keep some in stock.Another alternative, if they're still around, might be Danny's RV off McKinney. They'd have to get them from a local warehouse, but they did the batteries in our Foretravel twice at very good prices (we ran Deka Intimidators for house and Optima Blue Top for chassis).
Re: Battleborn Reply #24 – October 11, 2024, 09:27:23 pm Thanks Michelle and Ron,Much appreciated information. I will be able to at least get an idea where to get them from when I buy them.Again,Thanks much and I will try to get over to Lake Ray Roberts and check out the marina and get an update on how the area is rebuilding.Randy
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