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Starlink Install
Hasn’t arrived yet, ship date is 11/12-18. Believe it when I see it.

Rather than fight putting one more wire down the roof port I installed another one. Not nearly as well sealed as LD’s but it will work. The antenna will have to be installed and taken down at each location. I think it can be done through the escape hatch.

Was very surprised to see the roof panel is less than 1/8” plywood under the aluminum. The ceiling seems to be closer to 1/8”. Anyhow, thinner than expected.

LD did a better seal job. I used a sink drain stopper to seal the hole as it will have to be opened and closed. Would like to have reinforced it with some PVC but couldn’t find some to match my hole saws and drain stopper so will live with the way it is for awhile. More later.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #1 –
Harry and All,

I am sure I am not the only one .... LD is working perfectly fine and I will not risk it by making a hole on the roof ...  is there any possibility of putting startlink receiver inside the motorhome perhaps glue it on the windshield somehow or some window? I will also be fine putting it outside while we are parked but I do understand it is a small piece of hardware and keeping it outside may be risky.

Thanks
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #2 –
Adding new holes in the roof is OK as long as it is done right. The Mothership cuts multiple holes in every LD's roof, not to mention poking hundreds of screws through it. Properly sealing the holes is crucial, using a long-lasting, high-performance sealant.
The use of plumbing vents for wire and cable entry is a common way of adding access as long as none of the roof joists are cut or damaged.
The marine world has the same need for thru-hull plumbing and electrical fittings. Marine distributors carry several types of fittings that can be used successfully on LDs.
This fitting, made by Blue Sea, is one of my favorites. Bedded in 3M 5200 FC, it has remained watertight for over 15 years.
Camera mounted on LD | Shown with water proof deck fitting w… | Flickr

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #3 –
Quote from: Muhammad  - 
Harry and All,

I am sure I am not the only one .... LD is working perfectly fine and I will not risk it by making a hole on the roof ...  is there any possibility of putting startlink receiver inside the motorhome perhaps glue it on the windshield somehow or some window? I will also be fine putting it outside while we are parked but I do understand it is a small piece of hardware and keeping it outside may be risky.

Starlink at present is a 23” satellite dish that requires a 100 degree unobstructed view of the sky. One hundred degrees is a bunch. Anything mounting inside is impossible. The new flat panel mobile antenna has yet to be released. No one has even seen a picture of it. The present antenna must be removed for travel. Since there is no connector at the antenna the 100ft antenna lead must be removed and opening closed. The plumbing vent is perfect and won’t turn to powder in the sun. Fortunately I didn’t hit any framing.

I intend to put a connector in the 100ft lead to shorten the wiring and be able to use the remainder when placing the antenna on the ground. Just don’t want to cut anything till it works. It won’t be too difficult to thread 100ft of cable through the plumbing vent and remove it a time or two.

Starlink ship date just moved to November 17-23. At least my gasoline furnace is on it’s way.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #4 –
Larry and Harry,

Obviously we are on different tiers .... I was on bed for rest of the day after winterization in am .... leg muscles do work fine and I can walk for miles (most of the days with pain pump remote control in my pocket) but rest of the body is very weak ....

I saw my wife miserable when she was not able to communicate with kids for days due to cell signals. In 2022 we are planning to be in RV for 9+ months. I want to make it as easier as possible for my wife. I need to find a portable dish or something comparable which I can put outside when we park. I will not mind paying somebody doing the work on motorhome but my yet two encounters to motorhome technician does not give me any comfort or confidence and it was more of anxiety instead of happiness of improvements. We are making Lazy Daze our own by making updates but they are very small and slow. I work on Lazy Daze to have fun and but keep getting reminders of reality on when to stop :-) and please no sympathy at all, I am having time of my life. In less then a year we saw more natural beauty in US then 99% of folks see in their life time ....

Cheers
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #5 –
Starlink in general, and particularly in a RV is still a ways away from being a consumer level service.

Right now it's best for early adopters.  People who enjoy being on the frontiers of technology, with all of the costs and hassles and tinkering that go along with that.

If you're looking for reliable internet that works more often than not, in as many places as possible, cellular is still the best bet. 

I think these folks give solid advice about staying connected while traveling: Internet for RV & Boats - Mobile Internet Resource Center

This is what they use: Our Mobile Internet Setup for RV & Boat - Cellular, WiFi & Satellite |...

Rich

2003 MB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #6 –
Thanks Rich.

My son work for SpaceX and he asked me to wait but then he also told me that service is available for NJ .... I worked for Bell Labs and do understand technology and do not mind taking some chances. I think I do have 7-8 months before I need to move, will see where we stand at that time.

Thanks again for input.
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #7 –
Starlink antenna is now rectangular. Starlink.com listed dimensions as 19” by 12”.

New antenna has a removable cable which will make things easier.

I’m impressed with anyone that worked at Bell Labs. Invented the transistor and the cell phone. Motorola made it work ‘cause the government for monopoly reasons wouldn’t let ATT do it.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #8 –
Great Harry. I was looking at permanent installation pictures on buildings on their website and failed to pay attention the picture of antenna with a base. Encouraging information and need little more research hearing from folks who use the system the with portable dish/antenna instead of permanent installation.  Will be meeting with my son during Christmas and if he does not have more information I am sure there will be more information on internet very soon or perhaps I will call sales team directly. I hear they are expecting lot of demand and manufacturing the antenna is on the critical path (I thought putting the low orbit satellite would be an issue). I have experience with sister company Tesla for home solar panel/battery system and installation was smooth and system is working for over a year without any hiccup.

Thanks again.
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #9 –
Starlink to arrive Wednesday according to FedEx. Will let you know if it is the round one or the new rectangle one.

It is the round one. Shipping weight 30 lbs.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #10 –
will be interested hearing your experience .... thx

system ordering page need a physical address, is there a different antenna/dish for mobile/RV and stationary/home use? They are using low orbiting satellites and and I have no idea if they will have enough number of satellites initially to reliably handoff from one satellite to other satellite as we are driving. We do accept cell signal drop offs but satellite service will have higher expectations (user will not care about high orbit and low orbit satellite they will expect reliable service) ... will be interesting to see how long it take to have reliable service.

and did you say 30 lb!?
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #11 –
Quote from: Muhammad  - 
will be interested hearing your experience .... thx

system ordering page need a physical address, is there a different antenna/dish for mobile/RV and stationary/home use? They are using low orbiting satellites and and I have no idea if they will have enough number of satellites initially to reliably handoff from one satellite to other satellite as we are driving. We do accept cell signal drop offs but satellite service will have higher expectations (user will not care about high orbit and low orbit satellite they will expect reliable service) ... will be interesting to see how long it take to have reliable service.

and did you say 30 lb!?

Mobile antenna is not being sold yet.  Only a moveable antenna and it has drop outs due to not enough satellites.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #13 –
Starlink Dishy arrived. Use in the LD will be over Christmas so will report at that time.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #14 –
We have ours onboard. Still haven't found a zip that works where we are (Florida's Emerald Coast). Also requires line of sight...no trees.

We'll report back as well once we get the hook up.

Good luck!
2008 TK
She's a redhead, alright. Wilmaaa!
 
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #15 –
Greetings through Starlink. Looks like 8 amps of 12 volt DC
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #16 –
so you get data connection everywhere? how about connection speed, can you stream videos? power consumption remind me of cell phones of 90s where batteries were the bottlenecks ... i will wait little longer to get mobile antenna but this is not bad for emergency connection, perhaps a 15-30 minute connection can download 24 hour messages. looking closely progress in this area.

Quote from: hbn7hj  - 
Greetings through Starlink. Looks like 8 amps of 12 volt DC
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #17 –
No. Data connection only at one location. Watched Sunday Night Football with no problems. Youtube no problem. The lack of location flexibility is the problem which should improve over the year. If it does not improve you will likely be paying for no service when you move.

With one lithium battery and one regular battery and a generator all is well. It helps to be able to run the generator when you please be it midnight or noon.

l probably will not be able to use it again till March when I return as it is not available where I am going.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #18 –
Thx

Based on your input, I think I will be better off with multiple phones from different carriers for now.

Quote from: hbn7hj  - 
No. Data connection only at one location. Watched Sunday Night Football with no problems. Youtube no problem. The lack of location flexibility is the problem which should improve over the year. If it does not improve you will likely be paying for no service when you move.

With one lithium battery and one regular battery and a generator all is well. It helps to be able to run the generator when you please be it midnight or noon.

l probably will not be able to use it again till March when I return as it is not available where I am going.
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #20 –
Quote from: hbn7hj  - 
Correct
Or, consider millenicom.com, which offers a router that will switch between Verizon, AT&T, and T-Mobile, using the one with best signal. The data plans looked good enough, I considered replacing my home internet with the unit. Here's an example:

Purple Plan
From $69.99/month
for 25GB upgradable to 800GB
• Works exclusively with our Skyroam router
• Works simultaneously over all three carriers
• Connects automatically to the strongest signal

50GB was $75, 100GB was $100.
2005 Jayco 24SS
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #21 –
"Or, consider millenicom.com,..."

Are they back again? Should I believe in resurrection? I had them years ago and it worked fairly well. At that time they were exclusively a Verizon reseller. But then they went belly up and forced me elsewhere. We now have a Verizon 'Hot Spot' unlimited for $65mo.   ;D
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #22 –
Yeah, I got that email from Millenicom a couple of days ago. I didn't take it seriously. Here's why.

Quite a few years ago, Millenicom popped up with a fancy, professional-looking website offering a very attractive (for the time) mobile data plan. I and many RVers I knew jumped on that bandwagon. All went well for a couple years, until boom! We were suddenly notified that the service was ending immediately.

It turned out that what was passing itself off as a legitimate wireless reseller was actually a couple of guys at a small private school who were buying data "in bulk" at educational discounts--intended only for students and teachers--and reselling it to non-educational individuals like us RVers. When the carrier (Verizon, as I recall) found out, they shut down the scam, leaving users to scramble for another data plan.

A few years later another school-based group tried the same thing, with the same result. And more recently, an outfit called "Island Wi-Fi" tried reselling unlimited AT&T bandwidth... that turned out to be intended for firefighters, EMTs, and law enforcement people. They were shut down as soon as AT&T got wise, and again, users were left holding the bag.

Now, I don't know whether this outfit that's now calling itself Millenicom is the original group, or just somebody who bought the brand name... but in general my experience with too-good-to-be-true wireless deals is that they are just that. If anybody wants to sign up for this Millenicom deal, I won't say no, but just be aware that it may be shut down without warning.

One legitimate alternative is AT&T's new 100 GB per month/$55 per month data plan--55 cents per gigabyte. It's one of the Technomads' top picks, and they usually know their stuff. I just signed up for that one. If your data needs are smaller, they have a 20 GB per month plan for $300 per year (in advance)--$1.25 per gigabyte.

These plans are not "unlimited"--when you use up your data, they simply stop connecting until the next billing period begins--but I prefer that to the more typical plans that claim to be unlimited, but then throttle you down to unusable speeds, or start hitting you with steep overage charges. At least AT&T is honest about what you get. (If you do use up all your data for the month, you can buy 5 GB "Add-Ons" for ten bucks apiece to get you through.)

AT&T's coverage is not as good as Verizon's, but it has improved quite a bit in the past few years... and as it happens, in some places where I often camp, they actually have a better signal. Both these plans are shown on this page of AT&T's website. (The Technomads' Coverage? app for iOS or Android is a good way to check on whether a particular service is available in your destination area.)

I have not looked at Verizon's offerings lately, so they may have similar plans. Check the Technomadia website for the most up-to-date information.
Andy Baird
2021 Ford Ranger towing 2019 Airstream 19CB
Previously: 1985 LD Twin/King "Gertie"; 2003 LD Midbath "Skylark"
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #23 –
Copied from Quora.

Starlink update

Steve Baker
Blogger at LetsRunWithIt.com (2013–present)Dec 1

Does SpaceX really risk bankruptcy with the Raptor crisis or is Elon Musk being over dramatic?
Originally Answered: Does SpaceX really risk bankruptcy with the raptor crisis or is Elon Musk being over dramatic (https://spaceexplored.com/2021/11/29...ptor-crisis/)?
I think it would be a very long/slow death for the company - and it would be somewhat avoidable - but I don’t think Elon is exaggerating much.

SpaceX are spending a TON of money on the StarShip program - and have commitments to NASA and to the #DearMoon project to complete it…and (of course) Elon Musk is determined to start a Mars colony.

The money to pay for that cannot come from SpaceX’s Falcon-9/Heavy launch profits…there simply isn’t enough money to cover the eye-watering costs of this rapid pace of development.

Hence the StarLink (satellite internet) service is an essential part of StarShip development…it’s “a license to print money”…but that money is what pays to get to Mars.

STARLINK - THE CASH COW:

However, StarLink is at a crisis point. They’ve launched enough Mk 1 satellites (aboard Falcon-9’s) to prove that it’ll work and to get enough customers to show that there is interest in it.

However, Mk 1’s can only talk to ground stations - so if you live someplace under the flight path of the Mk 1 satellites - and you want to (say) visit Quora.com then you send a request to the nearest satellite which has to relay that message to a ground station which sends the message off to download Quora’s front page. When the response comes back, it has to go to the ground station which then sends the data up to the satellite - which then relays it back to your dish.

But for this to work, the satellite has to be able to “see” both your StarLink dish AND the ground station. Although the satellite is 350 miles up above the Earth, it can only see ground stations within a couple of hundred miles.

This means that SpaceX have to build a massive number of ground stations - which is expensive - and if you live too far from a ground station, you can’t buy service.

THE MK II STARLINK:

However, all of this messing around with ground stations is NOT the long-term plan.

Enter the Mk II StarLink satellite.

This version is larger and heavier than the MK I and has equipment on board to send and receive data from other MK II’s via a laser link.

So now - no matter where you live - you send a message to the nearest satellite - it figures out which other satellite is closest to Quora headquarters - and sends the message from one satellite to the next until it reaches the right place and THEN sends the message to the ground station.

This means that SpaceX don’t need many ground stations - in fact, just one ground station could (theoretically) service the entire world.

But the snag here is that while you can fit 60 Mk I StarLinks into a Falcon-9, you can’t get anywhere near that number of the larger/heavier Mk II’s.

This means that SpaceX can’t get ahead on StarLink without having StarShip working.

StarShip could probably launch 400 StarLink’s at a time (!!) - so the Mk II network could be launched amazingly quickly - and much money earned.

CHICKEN AND EGG SITUATIONS:

So SpaceX are in a bind.

To get StarLink to full profitability, they need to be able to launch StarShip to orbit - and to get to the 12,000 satellites they need - they’ll need 30 StarShip launches to orbit.
But to get StarShip launching on a regular basis, they need a ton of money…which means that they need StarLink to be earning money.
Elon Musk isn’t stupid - he has a degree in economics - so I’m quite sure he figured this out…get JUST enough money from StarLink to pay for JUST a couple of StarShip launches…which earns more StarLink money…which pays for more StarShips.

However, THREE simultaneous problems are biting him:

The FAA decided to do a major audit of the SpaceX facility in Boca Chica - which has tossed a wrench into the StarShip testing program. They’ve been refusing to grant launch permits for many months now.
The “chip shortage” has limited the number of StarLink dishes that can be made - and for some customers (myself included) the shipping date for the dish has slipped an entire YEAR.
Evidently, something very bad has been happening at the SpaceX Raptor rocket motor factory. We’re not sure what it is - but it resulted in several senior managers being fired - and accusations that they were hiding production problems from Elon. (HINT: DO NOT PISS OFF ELON!).
THE PERFECT STORM:

A shortage of rocket motors when doing sub-orbital testing of StarShip wasn’t too serious.

They could test launch with just three of the six motors on StarShip (because three of them are “vacuum optimised” and not needed at low altitudes).

But now they are ready for orbital testing, they’ll need 28 motors for the SuperHeavy and all 6 motors for the StarShip.

And until they manage to stick a landing with SuperHeavy - they’re going to waste all of those engines with every single test flight.

This wouldn’t have been so bad because even if they couldn’t stick a landing (which is the hard part) - just getting a StarShip up to orbital speed would be enough to allow each test flight to launch hundreds of Mk II StarLinks - more than enough to pay for the destruction of another StarShip+Superheavy.

But to do that, the planned manufacturing rate of Raptor engines was supposed to reach one engine per day…allowing them to do a test launch (with 400 MkII StarLinks) about once a month until they became able to re-use SuperHeavy.

With SuperHeavy sticking it’s landings, StarShip could fly once a week - even if it couldn’t land.

But until they can get the complicated “capture” landing system working, any slowdown in rocket motor production will have a direct impact on StarShip orbital flights.

Add to this the enforced delay from the FAA - and things start to look very bad for SpaceX.

SO WOULD THIS AMOUNT TO “BANKRUPTCY”?

I don’t think it would be THAT bad.

If Raptor engine production failed - and StarShip failed - and StarLink (Mk II) didn’t get completed - the “core business” of SpaceX is still in it’s Falcon-9/Heavy launches.

So they could possibly kill StarShip - not do more than modest ground station growth with Mk I StarLinks - and make enough money to weather the storm.

CONCLUSION:

From Elon Musk’s perspective - this is **DEATH** to the goals of SpaceX (to become a multiplanetary species).

But from the perspective of the rest of the world, the market for Falcon-9 launches will keep the company afloat - and SpaceX is STILL the biggest launch company in all of history.

So we can only hope that he can figure out the problems with the Raptor factory - and that the FAA get their act together and start licensing launches.

But without understanding precisely WHAT is going on with Raptor engine manufacturing and WHY the management at the factory were (allegedly) covering it up…it’s very hard to make predictions.
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Logan Greger
Harry 2006RB
Re: Starlink Install
Reply #24 –
Starlink installation complete except for VHB tape mounting the antenna base. The antenna lead is 100ft. I will cut it to something more manageable next summer. I have the special tools but it is very easy to mess up an ethernet RJ45 connector. Will post a picture of the antenna in action when it happens.

What a contrast to the complex DataStorm dish of years past.
Harry 2006RB