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Topic: Lazy Daze floor construction (Read 1811 times) previous topic - next topic
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Lazy Daze floor construction
I’m going to install a gasoline fueled heater. I would like to understand more of the Lazy Daze floor construction before I start making holes in it. How thick is it to the underside metal plate? Are there structural ribs in it? Any insulation I can deal with.

If I can’t find the info I’ll just start drilling, small holes first but it would be nice to know ahead of time.

Forty two gallons of useable fuel would equal 50 gallons of propane which would equal five full propane tanks. I should be able to survive a Texas freeze!

My extra compartments are full of batteries and such but I have found a location. The propane furnace stays.

Will let you know how it goes. Will take a few months as heaters are back ordered.

Gasoline heaters have maintenance issues and not as reliable as propane (carbon deposits) but I am willing to deal with them. I’m tired of chasing propane in the winter.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #3 –
Having issues making the album public....
The screws at the 12 or 12 inch mark can be seen in the exposed pics.
1997 TK
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #4 –
Thank you. 1.5 inches of solid wood. Compliments on the major reconstruction in progress.

Not any interest here in a gasoline heater but I’ll report when I get it done. Heater back ordered but everything else ready to go. Won’t begin till it arrives.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #5 –
Harry-

Here are two solutions to "chasing propane."

1) Install a Camco Extend-a-Stay adapter between the tank valve and the regulator, then use portable propane cylinders, rather than the built-in propane tank. Other manufacturers make an equivalent adapter.

2) Contact the local propane supplier to place a 100-gallon cylinder and connect it to the built-in propane tank's inlet.

I use the first solution, and have read posts on the second.

Many years ago I had a friend whose car caught fire due to a gasoline heater leak. So, I don't trust them.

Mark H.
Former owner, 31-foot gas Class A
Former owner, 1997-8 mid-bath
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #6 –
Quote from: hbn7hj  - 
Not any interest here in a gasoline heater but I’ll report when I get it done. Heater back ordered but everything else ready to go. Won’t begin till it arrives.

I’m interested in your project BUT I’m also slightly more than terrified to use a gasoline heater.   I’d much prefer a propane heater, a wood burning stove, more clothes, hot water bottles than messing around with gasoline.  But that’s just us.   
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #7 –
Quote from: Ed & Margee  - 
I’m interested in your project BUT I’m also slightly more than terrified to use a gasoline heater.   I’d much prefer a propane heater, a wood burning stove, more clothes, hot water bottles than messing around with gasoline.  But that’s just us.   

I can’t defend it because I don’t have one yet. A lot of class B’s use them and semi truck sleepers use the diesel version as do diesel pushers. I’ll T off the generator fuel line. Propane lines are copper, generator fuel lines are not. Fuel pressure and volume is trivial. There will be no explosions but the possibility of a leak and fire are real, but less than the probability of a propane leak and boom. The downside is it is an added risk, not in place of.

Propane is probably inherently more dangerous. I have no interest in carrying around a portable propane bottle. I do have the Extend-a-Stay type fitting.

Webasto is the brand. Haven’t heard of any Webasto fires yet but the plastic fuel line has got my attention. Even if I use copper the fittings are not threaded. If I smoke it you will be the second to know!
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #8 –
Sorry, that pic is a little misleading,  The floor is NOT solid.  Most of it is 1/2 Oriented Strand Board - OSB with insulation down to the metal.  There are 2x2 (1.5x1.5 actual) cross beams and a frame.  Here is a pic from when I removed the battery compartment due to rot and installed solar and more batteries underneath.
1997 TK
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #9 –
Thanks, I’ll need to probe to miss the ribs. I need a 4” hole. Your project is amazing. Nearly done.

I’ll line the 4” hole with a metal tube and insulate the exhaust pipe to keep things from torching off.
Harry 2006RB
 
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #10 –
We had a local couple using a motorhome in the winter. They passed away peacefully from carbon monoxide poisoning because the generator exhaust pipe was broken off and didn't extend past the edge of the motorhome. Surrounding snow banks prevented good air circulation under the rig.The news article didn't say the age or brand of motorhome. If there are any 'through floor' holes that aren't sealed really well, CO can accumulate underneath,  penetrate and rise up into the rig.
   My wifes old Corvair had a gasoline based heater in the front trunk. (Rear engine). We used it but trust was a concern. Webasto is a good brand, as far as I've heard.
     I'm interested in how this turns out. A good electrical connection, shore power, sounds a lot more practical to me. RonB
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #11 –
Quote from: RonB  - 
     I'm interested in how this turns out. A good electrical connection, shore power, sounds a lot more practical to me. RonB

I signed off of RV parks when the rates passed $50/night. Haven’t been in one in three years. I can pay the higher rates but now prefer the off grid camping. No reservations, no signing in, leave when I want and I have become addicted to free. Each location has it’s issues. Sometimes it is water, sometimes it is propane, sometimes it is trash, sometimes cell service. TV is the KVH A9 phased array antenna.

I signed up for Starlink even tho their RV antenna is not out yet. Moab will open up for service by the end of the year, they said.

I use a heated mattress pad for nighttime heating and just need something to get from 40F to 70F in the morning. Gasoline ought to do the trick. A gasoline furnace is safer than a propane furnace but in this case it is an additional risk, not instead of.

Will let you know how it goes. Not thrilled about the plastic fuel line but it T’s into the generator rubber fuel line which is no better and it isn’t under pressure like propane. Might replace it with or put it inside copper.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #12 –
"My wifes old Corvair had a gasoline based heater in the front trunk. (Rear engine). We used it but trust was a concern."

This was GM's attempt to remedy a serious problem with early Corvairs (including the van versions): unlike water-cooled cars that run hot engine coolant through an internal heater core, the Corvairs' air-cooled engines used an exhaust-system heat exchanger to heat the cabin... and if it leaked, which was reportedly common, it bled exhaust gases into the cabin.

(VW Beetles, also air-cooled, used a similar system, but apparently it was better engineered, so CO leakage was uncommon. VW offered a gasoline-fired auxiliary heater in some models; I don't know how safe it was, but it was reportedly not a popular choice.)

The Corvair CO leakage issue led to a number of lawsuits after some owners were permanently brain-damaged due to chronic CO inhalation. It was worst for small mobile business owners, some of whom drove the vans more or less all day, five days a week. GM settled in most cases, with a non-disclosure provision that prevented owners from talking about their cases or what they were paid to keep silent. (Does this sound like a conspiracy theory? Unfortunately, it isn't. That kind of nondisclosure-contingent settlement is common in product liability cases.)
Andy Baird
2021 Ford Ranger towing 2019 Airstream 19CB
Previously: 1985 LD Twin/King "Gertie"; 2003 LD Midbath "Skylark"
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #13 –
I had a VW Karman Ghia "sports" car with a gasoline heater mounted in the front trunk. It always made me a little nervous, but living in upstate NY, it was a necessity at times.
George & Jo Ann
2017 MB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #14 –
I use a Mr. Buddy heater with the small bottles.  Then I refill the small bottles with a 25lbs tank.  Filling the bottle up half way gives it just the amount of run time for me to take the edge off and not use the RV tank.  Good luck with the 4 inch hole.  I drilled a 1.5 inch hole and conduit to get the 4/0 cables and water fill through the floor for the added battery capacity as I don't have a generator.
1997 TK
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #15 –
Quote from: Craig P  - 
I use a Mr. Buddy heater with the small bottles.  Then I refill the small bottles with a 25lbs tank.  Filling the bottle up half way gives it just the amount of run time for me to take the edge off and not use the RV tank.  Good luck with the 4 inch hole.  I drilled a 1.5 inch hole and conduit to get the 4/0 cables and water fill through the floor for the added battery capacity as I don't have a generator.
I noticed your water line. I’ve got all parts and tools ready to go. All I need is the unit. $700 from Russia, $1600 from the US or UK. Only the US unit has a warranty. They are all back ordered for some reason. No one has explained the $900 difference in price. $1600 is just too much for such a small furnace. China sells copies for $200 that some have had good results with. I’m just not willing to go there.

We all solve our problems in different ways. I have a Wave 6 catalytic heater. For handy nothing can beat the Mr. Buddy with the small bottles. Move it into place and light it off. I tried the generator and the Pelonis, not enough BTUs and rude to use the generator sometimes. Not sure the Webasto 2000 is big enough (6800 BTU) but I expect it is as I’m only dealing with mild freezing conditions. Not trying to cope with a Texas freeze. They have a 5500 version with the same mounting footprint so I’ll make sure there is room for it.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #16 –
We use a Mr. Buddy and love it.  We loaned it to friends whose RV was colder than ours last week and they bought one the next day.
I use a Webasto diesel furnace in our boat and it is excellent and trouble free.
I used to own a Corvair Spyder, a turbocharged death-trap.  In addition to the inherent stability problems, at high rpm's the turbocharger would blow excessive boost which would leak past the tired rings, positively pressurize the crankcase, causing oil to blow out the dipstick hole.  This oil would then flow down over the cylinders cooling fins and smoke.  When I turned on the heater and the defroster, it would blow burned oil smoke all over the inside of the windshield and into the passenger compartment.  Unsafe at any speed?
Fortunately for me, our local Hell's Angels neighbors at that time stole the car, stripped it, and shot it full of holes. I bought another car and moved to another neighborhood.
I'd treat a gasoline furnace with caution.

Harold
2014 27 MB
Towd: Either the Jeep Wrangler or trailer containing the BMW R1200GS and 2 E-bicycles
Happy wife=Happy life
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #17 –
Quote from: Blueox25  - 
I'd treat a gasoline furnace with caution.

The heaters are safe. Diesel is a safer fuel than gasoline. The only vulnerability is the fuel line so put the pump close to the heater and armor the fuel line and all should be well. Fuel pressure is very low and is delivered in pulses. Most of the fuel line is under negative pressure which is why deteriorating generator fuel lines don’t cause fires.

I find no reports of Webasto fires, diesel or gasoline. Post if you find any. Propane fires and booms, of course, are another matter.

Like I said, if I smoke it you will be the second to know.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #18 –
LD floor construction is 3/8 OSB with some framing and sheet metal on the bottom as the other person said.

I just kissed some framing. It is better to be lucky than smart!
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #19 –
Thanks for the pictures. Good to see a modicum of floor insulation. At least psychologically that will help us stay warmer this winter😄
Steve
2003TK
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #20 –
We have heat! I realize people won’t be interested in this unless propane goes to $12 a gallon so won’t start a new thread. Exterior exhaust system and internal duct work yet to complete but it passed the smoke test.

No problems at startup. Fuel pump primed itself and lit off on the first try.

As you can tell it is placed between the water tank and behind the edge of the couch on a rear bath. One more picture or two when I get it all put back together.

Absolutely no use of otherwise usable space. Gonna beat the functionality of a Wave 6 by far. Don’t even have to store it. It will require more maintenance.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #21 –
This is an interesting project.  It is outside the conventional wisdom and adds a novel idea to the conversations.  Thanks for sharing it and including photos. 

Harold
2014 27 MB
Towd: Either the Jeep Wrangler or trailer containing the BMW R1200GS and 2 E-bicycles
Happy wife=Happy life
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #22 –
The opening is used to attach the insulated ducting to the furnace. I didn’t order the “smart controller” with the furnace. A mistake. I also need more exhaust piping.

The controller will be placed at the head of the overhead bunk viewable from below.

The latest “smart controller”, I’m told, will not work with the Russian version of the furnace. I have since ordered the smart controller from Russia, to be sure it is compatible, and it is coming by snail express. The furnace was shipped DHL air.

The install process was a major PIA. Many trips to the hardware store. I would not recommend it to be professionally installed where you have to pay for them to learn the process. Parts to install came from VMACS, in Virginia, Heatso in the UK and Heat4you in Russia. No one sells an install kit that has everything you need.

They do have complete install kits for the Ford Transit, Mercedes Sprinter, and Chrysler Promaster. The LD requires longer ducting, longer exhaust pipe, protected 4” hole through the wood floor and a T to tap into the generator fuel line. I did add a one way check valve between the fuel T and the generator. Don’t know if it is necessary but think it is.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #23 –
Install complete. Looks like 1.5 amps full bore with 3-6 amps or so at startup and shutdown. Probably quieter than the Suburban inside but outside it just roars. Installed the muffler today.

In the middle of it all the catalytic converter took a walk. Note the painted converter with the CatCage in the background.
Harry 2006RB
Re: Lazy Daze floor construction
Reply #24 –
Hi Hbn7hj;  So by 'took a walk' you mean someone stole your converter?  So the paint is for someone else to identify it faster the next time it gets stolen?  How does the cat cage stack up to other methods of preservation?  I was going to have my welder friend do some extra welding on my catalytic converter assembly, while he is visiting here in a few weeks.
    And I'm very impressed with your installation of a gasoline heater.  I think my fix, if I ever needed more heat, would just be an extra propane tank. Or to replace my eight gallon tank with a 15 gallon, like the 27' LD's have. Also I don't have as large a gasoline tank either, with just the 37 gallon vs. the 55 gallon most of you have.  RonB
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB