Insurance? July 22, 2020, 10:52:03 pm As many of you know, I posted about the recent break-in to my Laze Daze at my storage facility in Las Cruces, New Mexico.I have to admit, dealing with insurance adjusters have added a significant amount of stress in addition to the violation of being broken into and burglarized. I have to admit I feel "stupid" because I have AARP Hartford Insurance (Auto, RV, Homeowners "bundled") and when purchasing the insurance "deferred" to the AARP agent to properly insure me. I have full coverage on my 2002 Honda CR-V and 1998 Lazy Daze Motorhome. I was more concerned about glass repair (living in New Mexico) and road service but never considered theft to the inside contents. It seems like structural damage to my Lazy Daze is covered by automotive (comprehensive and $500 deductible on my policy), but losses to personal property within the RV are considered to be part of my homeowner's policy ($2,500 deductible). Needless to say, I'm not going to come out well after filing claims...What do people do to insure their personal property if their RV "is" their home? Do they have a separate homeowner's policy? The problem is that the insurance company is saying that even though I have homeowner's insurance, "RV related" items like the "after market" back-up camera monitor, the TPMS monitor, my GPS, etc... are NOT covered. The items are also not covered under any part of my Auto/RV policy. I was basically told "NO" insurance company has coverage for these items. The homeowner's adjuster has been especially "trying."It seems like I'm going to be violated twice - once for the actual theft and then the items stolen inside and non-coverage. Dealing with the insurance company adjusters has been more traumatic than dealing with the actual theft, as I "thought" I was covered and the process was somewhat "cut and dried." Apparently not...I suppose what I'm asking is what do I need to do in terms of coverage to ensure the safety (and reimbursement) of damage to my RV and theft of the items within the RV. In all honesty, I don't think I'm up for "fighting this battle" with my current insurer, but want to make sure that in the future (if this ever happens again) that I've made an appropriate and smart choice. Please share your experiences with insurance.Thanks,Cheryl 1 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #1 – July 22, 2020, 11:59:04 pm Quote from: desertdivanm - July 22, 2020, 10:52:03 pmAs many of you know, I posted about the recent break-in to my Laze Daze at my storage facility in Las Cruces, New Mexico.I have to admit, dealing with insurance adjusters have added a significant amount of stress in addition to the violation of being broken into and burglarized. I have to admit I feel "stupid" because I have AARP Hartford Insurance (Auto, RV, Homeowners "bundled") and when purchasing the insurance "deferred" to the AARP agent to properly insure me. I have full coverage on my 2002 Honda CR-V and 1998 Lazy Daze Motorhome. I was more concerned about glass repair (living in New Mexico) and road service but never considered theft to the inside contents. It seems like structural damage to my Lazy Daze is covered by automotive (comprehensive and $500 deductible on my policy), but losses to personal property within the RV are considered to be part of my homeowner's policy ($2,500 deductible). Needless to say, I'm not going to come out well after filing claims...What do people do to insure their personal property if their RV "is" their home? Do they have a separate homeowner's policy? The problem is that the insurance company is saying that even though I have homeowner's insurance, "RV related" items like the "after market" back-up camera monitor, the TPMS monitor, my GPS, etc... are NOT covered. The items are also not covered under any part of my Auto/RV policy. I was basically told "NO" insurance company has coverage for these items. The homeowner's adjuster has been especially "trying."It seems like I'm going to be violated twice - once for the actual theft and then the items stolen inside and non-coverage. Dealing with the insurance company adjusters has been more traumatic than dealing with the actual theft, as I "thought" I was covered and the process was somewhat "cut and dried." Apparently not...I suppose what I'm asking is what do I need to do in terms of coverage to ensure the safety (and reimbursement) of damage to my RV and theft of the items within the RV. In all honesty, I don't think I'm up for "fighting this battle" with my current insurer, but want to make sure that in the future (if this ever happens again) that' I've made an appropriate and smart choice. Please share your experiences with insurance.Thanks,CherylThanks for this painful information, Cheryl. I'm certain many of us will be checking our ins. policies for coverage. I know I will tomorrow. Also, a good time to remind folks to take cell phone photos of all LD contents including accessories and addons.Chris 1 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #2 – July 23, 2020, 12:56:13 am Does anyone here have a contact who works for AARP Hartford? If so, perhaps contact Cheryl with that info. Right or not, perhaps they could bend an ear to the situation...Sometimes it's who you know that makes a difference.Pete
Re: Insurance? Reply #3 – July 23, 2020, 09:41:34 am Quote from: desertdivanm - July 22, 2020, 10:52:03 pmWhat do people do to insure their personal property if their RV "is" their home? Do they have a separate homeowner's policy? People who live fulltime in their RV have specialized insurance called fulltimers insurance. It's sort of like a combination of RV insurance and homeowner's insurance in that it provides the liability coverage of a homeowner's policy, including contents coverage. Not every insurance company offers fulltimers insurance. 3 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #4 – July 23, 2020, 09:55:35 am +1 to what Linda said!Part-time RVers usually have their personal liability insurance provided by their homeowners policy. Without a traditional home and homeowners policy, you are left a bit uncovered. Most fulltimers have fulltime RV insurance policies as Linda stated, which provide much of the coverage lost by not having a traditional homeowners policy. Even when we had a house, we carried an "umbrella" policy to give us additional liability coverage. We have continued to carry an umbrella policy with our Bus, but there are very full companies that will issue these to fulltime RVers. There are insurance brokers that specialize in RV fulltimer insurance.Art 1 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #5 – July 23, 2020, 10:05:31 am "What do people do to insure their personal property if their RV "is" their home? Do they have a separate homeowner's policy?"As with almost everything in life . . . "it depends".When we were fulltimers, we had insurance as Linda describes. It was VERY expensive!, mostly because of the large motorhome on the policy. Now that we own a home, our RV insurance needs are covered for the Lazy Daze, and our other vehicles, very well by State Farm, and very reasonably priced. They paid when we had rodent damage to the Lazy Daze, and also when we had hail damage to the roof of our house. In each case, there was a one thousand dollar deductible, but there was no question that we had the coverage. In fairness, we've never had a theft claim, so I have no experience with that aspect.If you are a member of the Escapees group, it might be worth your while to look up their insurance representative who can probably explain your choices to consider going forward. We did not use them, for no particular reason, but Miller Insurance has been a presence within Escapees since we joined in 1991. One of their representatives may be able to advise you on your best course going forward.But it may be that an adjustment to your current homeowner's policy would do the trick for you.Virtual hugs,Judie
Re: Insurance? Reply #6 – July 23, 2020, 03:28:10 pm Quote from: Chris Horst - July 22, 2020, 11:59:04 pmThanks for this painful information, Cheryl. I'm certain many of us will be checking our ins. policies for coverage. I know I will tomorrow. Also, a good time to remind folks to take cell phone photos of all LD contents including accessories and add-ons.ChrisI did check my Progressive policy and noted that I have included $10,000 personal effects coverage for $59 this year. There are exclusions, of course, but I couldn't find any for accessories or permanent add-ons. $100 deductible.Chris 2 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #7 – November 12, 2020, 09:14:38 pm I recently did a lot of digging into insurance, specifically fulltimers insurance vs "regular" insurance - where it is insured as a vehicle.We have a good State Farm agent and have been with State Farm for many decades.I talked to a highly recommended independent agent, my agent, and reading posts here and on a fulltimer RV facetime group.All of this is speaking as if you do not own a home, you are driving your RV. I didn't ask questions specifically about towed items (cars, bikes, motorcycles, trailers, boats, etc.) as we don't do that at this time, but if you have these, ask your agent.What I learned:1) Fulltimers insurance is much more expensive. We are rate highly with State Farm (few claims over a handful of decades), so have a low rate with them - full timers insurance from Progressive was over twice as much for just the RV and belongings (not the second vehicle). The only thing extra thing Progressive fulltimer insurance covers (we may/may not have that, the agent is checking), is a limited amount towards hotel/food if your RV was damaged in an accident. 2) There is a lot of information on the internet about RV owners not having liability coverage (someone runs their head into your awning or trips over your camping chair) or comprehension (another vehicle hits your LD/tree falls on your LD), with an exception being if you are actually moving. My agent said there is a big difference between trailers and motorhomes, in fact they have something like 9 different categories for RVs.For Motor Homes like LDs (e.g. they have an engine, not just a trailer), they are covered like a car, with liability and comprehension even if you are parked. Trailers are not covered the same, they are covered as part of the vehicle towing them (and though we didn't discuss this I am guessing as part of your homeowners/renters) so they can lack liability/comprehension coverage (check with your company and others).3) If you are fulltiming and don't have a home, and you are not buying fulltimers insurance, your belongings (in your RV and in any storage units) are not covered they way they would on a homeowners/renters policy. To cover them, get renters insurance. You can get this even though you fulltime in your RV and don't own a home/rent a home elsewhere. It covers our belongings the same way your homeowner policy would and at a low cost.4) Value of your LD - this comes into play if your LD is totaled (with an accident or a fire or floor or ...), hopefully something you never experience.The independent agent I spoke to said you want agreed upon value not stated value written in the policy, if you have a policy that covers a specific value. However, I take this with a small truck load of salt, because they also gave me other information that turned out not to be accurate as well as spent a fair amount of time bad mouthing other companies that insure vehicles and I don't trust companies that have to bad mouth other companies to sell you something (rather than just telling you what a great job they do). And a good chunk of that badmouthing was incorrect information. I asked our State Farm agent this same question (check with your agent, I won't swear it works that way in your town). If it is a total loss, their appraisers will look for a similar vehicle (e.g. LD of the same model/year/etc.). If you have proof that your LD is not the same as it came from the factory (e.g. you put in new appliances like a refrigerator/air conditioner, redid the flooring or upholstery, put in improvements, etc.), they will look for a vehicle that has features closer to yours (e.g. a newer LD that had those items from the factory, or maybe a newer one that someone else added those items). So receipts, pictures, etc. all help support what it looked like before it was totaled (especially if it was burned down so nobody can tell what had been done).It could help if you get the vehicle appraised (they look at any upgrades/improvements you did as well as the condition, etc.)., but it was strongly advised to find an appraiser off their (the insurance companies) list of appraisers, so there was not disagreement of qualifications/level of work (this made sense to me).5) This is a side thing I learned of while going thru this process. There is a company called LexisNexis. They are one of these companies that gather a lot of info about you and one insurance companies use to check when they are going to create a new policy. Information is often wrong here (think credit bureaus back in the mid 1970s/80s), and while you can fix it expect to put a fair amount of effort/time into doing so (nothing on the phone or chat or online, everything by snail mail, and one poor guy who got mixed up with someone else got the issue fixed only to have it put back on his record the next month). State Farm, said they and most other insurance companies are aware of this and do reasonable things (e.g. check things out and move forward with accurate information). We apparently have a ding on that report for us, despite the fact that State Farm has us as in one of their top tiers (a small accident last year knocked us down in to the second from top tier). In talking to the agent, there are some errors of road side assistance claims (Agero is awful and what most companies use), our agent is fixing these up and we think some errors in the road side assistance dispatchers they use (agero, horrible reputation, they filed claims with State Farm that they didn't provide us) so that might have triggered something, but roadside issues should have created the ding we were told was there (by a fulltimer independent agent).Pulls of the NexisLexis report lower your credit score (the same way it does the credit bureaus), so be cautious of this and you might want to get your lexis nexis consumer report.Boy, between the credit bureaus, medical information bureau, and this one for insurance, it can take a lot of effort to make they they are all using correct information.For now, we are sticking with State Farm, but because we have done a lot of improvements/upgrades, we will plan to get a State Farm appraiser report done.Jane 4 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #8 – November 13, 2020, 04:12:59 pm Nice discussion, Jane. I’m even more curious now about “ stated value,” which we’ve had on our policy since it’s inception 13 years ago. I wonder what arguments/hassles we would encounter if we were to have a total loss? Our stated value is the original purchase price. 🤔 — Jon
Re: Insurance? Reply #9 – November 13, 2020, 05:26:06 pm Quote from: Jon & Loni - November 13, 2020, 04:12:59 pmNice discussion, Jane. I’m even more curious now about “ stated value,” which we’ve had on our policy since it’s inception 13 years ago. I wonder what arguments/hassles we would encounter if we were to have a total loss? Our stated value is the original purchase price. 🤔 — JonIn the case of total loss, I believe "stated value" will wind up being a negotiated settlement between you and the insurance writer. It's safe to say you will not get your stated value, Jon. 🙂Chris
Re: Insurance? Reply #10 – November 13, 2020, 06:18:35 pm Jon, call your agent and double check. I was not happy with the quality of information from the independent agent rep who told me that, so I would personally not trust it.We have had things not in the fine print that our agent said was covered (e.g. storage unit items). The agent said I know it is covered. I asked for something writing to make it clear and the agent gladly mailed me a letter.If a representative of the company says something, the company has to honor it (which is why when I went to user meetings we were all told keep your mouth shut about future releases/products, even if they are for sure and will come out in a month).Turns out we did have a loss (theft from a storage unit) and yup, they covered it no problems. Replacement value, which means they pay depreciated value right away, you go buy it and submit the receipt and they will give you the remaining value. Within reason of course, but we were pleased at what they covered even though it was a very time consuming process for us. Jane
Re: Insurance? Reply #11 – November 13, 2020, 07:44:47 pm Actually, a stated value policy defines the max payout. (Rating is based on how much you state it's worth- so your premium is impacted by over/under stating). It's correct that the actual amount paid in a total loss is a negotiated amount between the stated value and the actual cash value which is the value of a similar rig in similar condition. That's where documentation (pictures help) and receipts come into play. Lexis Nexis gets their information because many insurance companies send them claims data. The insurance companies have to contribute to the LN mega data base in order to retrieve information from it. At one point, Lexis Nexis claimed over 80 percent of insured vehicles in the US, are represented.The errors in the data occur when the insurance company contributes data on claims not yet closed. Therefore the information is not in it's final resolved state. Supposedly, Lexis Nexis corrects the data the next time the insurance company sends updated data, but that really depends on how the insurance company decides what to send.Upon request, consumers can get copies of the information that Lexis Nexis has on them. Correcting any errors requires going back to the insurance company. Nothing happens quickly, so good luck.Wendy 2 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #12 – November 14, 2020, 11:30:25 am Wendy, thanks for the info in stated value.Not all errors are something reported by an insurance company. I read reports of someone who had marks on his LexusNexis that belonged to someone with a similar name (it took a lot of effort for him to get it corrected and it just got put back on shortly after that). So he is struggling with this while paying very high premiums or going without insurance.That happens a lot in background checks - a human has to look at the data to correctly interpret it as wide sweeps pull in anything close.As is said LexusNexus looks like they are doing the wide sweep and not having humans catch the errors. Things happen and not having an easy to use way to know what is in the report and get items permanently corrected is why I say this is line credit bureaus back when.Our insurance company considers us a great customer in their top tiers, and yes we pay the low rates that reflex this - so we should have not have any issues at LexusNexus. State Farm Is doing a double check to make sure they didn’t make a mistake in their reporting of us. Until we get a report we won’t know what errors are on it.Jane
Re: Insurance? Reply #13 – November 14, 2020, 04:55:32 pm Thanks, all, for the “stated value” discussion. A little internet sleuthing revealed that it is, indeed, a sort of ceiling. In the event of a loss, the insurer will pay the lesser of the two amounts. I guess my question now is whether I’m paying more premium than I should. Off to my AAA rep. — Jon
Re: Insurance? Reply #14 – November 14, 2020, 06:10:58 pm On the topic of insurance I would like to give a "shout out" to Progressive. This past July I was making my way down the Eastern side of the Sierras towing a 14 foot aluminum boat behind my 2005 Lazy Daze midbath. I was traveling through the town of Lone Pine when the person in front of me slammed on her brakes. She was towing a 20 foot travel trailer with a large, empty bike rack protruding out the back. Well, my fault, I hit her bike rack. I never touched her bumper, my bumper was fine, but the rack went through my grill, radiator, and all the stuff that hangs off the core support. I limped over to the side of the road and called Progressive. Long story short, I now have my baby back and she looks better than ever. They put in a new radiator, grill, headlights and painted and blended the LD through the the two doors...it looks great! They used all OEM parts, so, all in all, the vehicle has a new paint job in the front and many shiny new parts. Progressive has been great all along with an agent consistently contacting me on the progress of the repair... Of course, I have not seen how much my insurance is going to go up yet,LOL... 6 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #15 – November 28, 2020, 07:34:08 pm I retired from claims adjusting and handled auto, homeowners, and some commercial.To Cheryl, I'm not sure from what you've described if the HO adjuster is giving you correct information on what should and shouldn't be covered. Keep in mind that personal property covered under a HO, Renter's, or Condo policy is limited to a percentage of the total personal property limit when you are away from the residence premises. For example, if your total limit for that coverage is 50,000 the coverage away from the premises might be limited to 10 or 20% of the $50,000 and will be subject to the deductible. If your total loss exceeds the deductible amount exceeds the limit plus ded you shouldn't see it.Items that are permanently mounted to the RV would not be covered under your HO pers prop coverage. However, since you could remove the TPMS and put it on another vehicle and is easily removable that should be covered. Your GPS should be covered as well unless it's built-in.Full-timers coverage gives you HO type liability coverage which does more than just cover obvious personal injury. If you're not a full-timer then see if you can add personal property coverage in a specified amount as an endorsement to your existing RV policy which Chris suggested.Regarding Stated Value policies keep in mind that you will likely end up being paid Actual Cash Value which is going to be less than what you thought you paid for. An Agreed Value would be what you're looking for. Here is one site that discussed the difference. https://www.lelandwest.com/stated-value-vs-agreed-value-classic-car-insurance.cfmJim 3 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #16 – November 29, 2020, 07:36:15 am Good morning everyone Thanks for this insurance thread. Does anyone have a policy with "agreed" value and if so, which company? What did you have to provide for proof of inceased value and did you have an appraiser? 1 Likes
Re: Insurance? Reply #17 – November 30, 2020, 09:33:16 am Quote from: JodiH - November 29, 2020, 07:36:15 amGood morning everyone Thanks for this insurance thread. Does anyone have a policy with "agreed" value and if so, which company? What did you have to provide for proof of inceased value and did you have an appraiser? I think I do. Went to USAA who sends you to Progressive. They asked me an amount. 1 Likes
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