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Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #25 –
Thx, all, for the responses.  I do carry spare fuses in the Power Center, but appreciate the suggestions for additional spares.

The rig is inside the the machine shed, & though there are a couple of white roof panels to let light in, there is no solar charging when inside; also, no shore power, so the only power would be from the Lifeline house batts (I don't use the gen inside, even with all the big doors open).

The little black box is immediately inside the batt compartment on the right wall, just below the top of the compartment.  I wondered if it might be a circuit breaker because "reset" is printed on the box next to the yellow lever in the vertical/operational position.  So, If I have a separate "disconnect" switch, where would that be, & what might it look like?

It's sometimes been several weeks between visits during snowy weather, and though I've never had difficulty starting with the chassis batt, the house batts have been deeply discharged a few times (I'm assuming the house batts & Trik-L-Start were keeping the chassis batt happy), hence my thought about disconnecting.  So, questions:   A) If I disconnect the house batts, & therefore disable the Trik-L-Start, how might that affect the chassis batt?  B) Would reconnecting the house batts, & enabling the Trik-L-Start, make the chassis batt happy again?  I don't want to get stuck inside the shed & have to juggle equipment around to jumpstart the LD.

Finally, back to that weird step:  I have general understanding of circuits & fuses from a long-ago 5th grade science class.  What is perplexing me is that the 5 amp fuse seemed to have no affect (in or out)--just like the switch.  Only the 20 amp fuse affected the step operation.  ..."curiouser & curiouser"

Off to mask & vote (school board & municipal, since MO is still in the dark ages on no-excuse absentee voting), & then ride the Baby Deere across the yard ahead of the coming storms.  Best to those of y'all facing challenges that haven't come to  the  boonies of north Missouri (though the farmers are dealing with some flooding from last week).

Lynne
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #26 –
Hi Lynne. I just want to repeat that the Trik-L-Start only charges the chassis battery when the house batteries are Being Charged. The house batteries at rest are 12.7 to 12.85 volts. That isn't enough to get up to the threshold of 13.2 volts to start the chassis battery charging.  If that weren't that way, you could end up with all of the batteries dead at once.
    The word 'Reset' is a giveaway that that box is a circuit breaker that can be reset. Pushing that button won't turn it off, it just resets it if it has tripped.
     I included a picture of my shut off breaker.   Red button trips it, red lever pops open and is used to reset it. DC Circuit Breaker Inline Fuse Inverter Waterproof Manual Reset 300 Amp...   RonB
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #27 –
Quote from: Lynne Broyles-Greenwood  - 
Thx, all, for the responses.  I do carry spare fuses in the Power Center, but appreciate the suggestions for additional spares.

The rig is inside the the machine shed, & though there are a couple of white roof panels to let light in, there is no solar charging when inside; also, no shore power, so the only power would be from the Lifeline house batts (I don't use the gen inside, even with all the big doors open).

The little black box is immediately inside the batt compartment on the right wall, just below the top of the compartment.  I wondered if it might be a circuit breaker because "reset" is printed on the box next to the yellow lever in the vertical/operational position.  So, If I have a separate "disconnect" switch, where would that be, & what might it look like? 

It's sometimes been several weeks between visits during snowy weather, and though I've never had difficulty starting with the chassis batt, the house batts have been deeply discharged a few times (I'm assuming the house batts & Trik-L-Start were keeping the chassis batt happy), hence my thought about disconnecting.  So, questions:  A) If I disconnect the house batts, & therefore disable the Trik-L-Start, how might that affect the chassis batt?  B) Would reconnecting the house batts, & enabling the Trik-L-Start, make the chassis batt happy again?  I don't want to get stuck inside the shed & have to juggle equipment around to jumpstart the LD.

Finally, back to that weird step:  I have general understanding of circuits & fuses from a long-ago 5th grade science class.  What is perplexing me is that the 5 amp fuse seemed to have no affect (in or out)--just like the switch.  Only the 20 amp fuse affected the step operation.  ..."curiouser & curiouser"

Off to mask & vote (school board & municipal, since MO is still in the dark ages on no-excuse absentee voting), & then ride the Baby Deere across the yard ahead of the coming storms.  Best to those of y'all facing challenges that haven't come to  the  boonies of north Missouri (though the farmers are dealing with some flooding from last week).

Lynne
Lynne, look in your manual and find Diagram #5 at the very end. Looking at the battery diagrams to the right you will see 2 blurbs referencing CIRCUIT BREAKER MANUAL RESET - a 12v, 100 amp and 12v 50 amp. In my '02 30', only the 100 amp is there and it's on the back wall of the bat. compartment. I suspect the black box on the right in your LD is the 100 amp fuse. I've never found the 50 amp fuse. I have no idea if the yellow lever is a bat. disconnect. My LD is under a canopy and I use the factory disconnect and it has served me well over the last two winters. The batteries never discharged when the disconnect was activated.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #28 –
Thx, Ron, for educating me about the Trik-L-Start.  My kids' father had one 30+ years ago for the little Ford9N tractor he used to feed silage in the winter...I didn't know anything beyond he plugged it in & it made sure the tractor started .  Thx, also, for the photo--was that original fro the Mothership, or added later?

Thx, Chris!  I think there was also "30 amp" printed on the little black box on the wall.  I'll write this down/put with the LD keys the next time I go to the farm.  Does your disconnect switch look like the one in Ron's photo?  Since you've done this, 'nother question:  Do you have a Trik-L-Start, or what happens to your chassis batt during storage--what should I be doing differently than just pulling into the shed & shutting the doors.  By the way, I don't do anything to the tractor battery during the months it's unattended...

Like Dory in Finding Nemo, I just keep "swimming...swimming...swimming" in this ocean of information--I do appreciate the life preservers thrown out.  :D

Lynne

Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #29 –
"Does your disconnect switch look like the one in Ron's photo?  Since you've done this, 'nother question:  Do you have a Trik-L-Start, or what happens to your chassis batt during storage--what should I be doing differently than just pulling into the shed & shutting the doors."

No. Photo attached of Steve K's disconnect.The red switch between the bats. I bought the same device from the Mothership 2 years ago.

No Trik-L-Start

The chassis (truck) battery survives just fine without any additional charging. In 18 years it never has failed to start the LD when I start it up in the spring or earlier if I take a winter trip. I'm 6 years into my 3rd truck battery. If your truck/chassis battery is in fine fettle, it should not give you a problem during its winter nap.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #30 –
Hi Lynne;  No, that trippable breaker/switch is an upgrade I haven't got to yet.  To address your other question, the 20 Amp fuse is for the power to the step (motor). The 5 amp fuse is for the power from the engine key to tell the step to retract when you start the engine in case the 'don't operate each time the screen/coach door is opened/shut is active.  A guess on my part since I don't have that step or the schematics.
     You mentioned a yellow handle in reply #25, so maybe you have an added 'trippable' circuit breaker like this:  MRCB 187100F-03-1 100 Amp DC Circuit Breaker | Northern Arizona Wind & Sun
  When someone has the factory option shut off switch, you should get one of these, and a delete of the standard 100A black breaker in the back of the battery box.    RonB
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #31 –
Quote from: RonB  - 
Hi Lynne;  No, that trippable breaker/switch is an upgrade I haven't got to yet.  To address your other question, the 20 Amp fuse is for the power to the step (motor). The 5 amp fuse is for the power from the engine key to tell the step to retract when you start the engine in case the 'don't operate each time the screen/coach door is opened/shut is active.  A guess on my part since I don't have that step or the schematics.
    You mentioned a yellow handle in reply #25, so maybe you have an added 'trippable' circuit breaker like this:  MRCB 187100F-03-1 100 Amp DC Circuit Breaker | Northern Arizona Wind & Sun
  When someone has the factory option shut off switch, you should get one of these, and a delete of the standard 100A black breaker in the back of the battery box.    RonB
Ron, were I to install such a replacement breaker and do it safely, would activating the battery disconnect and pulling the solar panel fuse be all I needed to do to avoid crispy critterness? No shore power, of course. 

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #32 –
Quote from: RonB  - 
Hi Lynne. I just want to repeat that the Trik-L-Start only charges the chassis battery when the house batteries are Being Charged. The house batteries at rest are 12.7 to 12.85 volts. That isn't enough to get up to the threshold of 13.2 volts to start the chassis battery charging.  If that weren't that way, you could end up with all of the batteries dead at once.
    The word 'Reset' is a giveaway that that box is a circuit breaker that can be reset. Pushing that button won't turn it off, it just resets it if it has tripped.
    I included a picture of my shut off breaker.  Red button trips it, red lever pops open and is used to reset it. DC Circuit Breaker Inline Fuse Inverter Waterproof Manual Reset 300 Amp...  RonB
Ron, where will you install this reset device?

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #33 –
Hi Chris;  Yes it would disconnect the house batteries.  You could put a second smaller one to disconnect the solar separately. You actually can just let the solar go (don't need to disconnect the solar controller). A lot of nothing will happen without the batteries.
        I have had the floor of my battery box give way (separate) on the right side. About 1/2" gap. That is right above my generator. I haven't taken it apart yet to see what happened. I'm replacing the slides with full extension slides, and plan to lower the floor about 1/2". A welder friend donated a few feet of #1 very flexible cable. I'm going to install a buss bar for +12v and a ground, I'll lose a bit at the back of my vanity cabinet inside.  Only the flex cables will slide out. I may put that breaker/disconnect switch  at the back of the battery box, where presently I have the factory 100A circuit breaker. The goal is Trojan size 145 batteries, for a little more capacity, or maybe a switch to Battleborn LiFePO4.  I'll take pictures to bore everybody with.  RonB
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #34 –
Quote from: RonB  - 
Hi Chris;  Yes it would disconnect the house batteries.  You could put a second smaller one to disconnect the solar separately. You actually can just let the solar go (don't need to disconnect the solar controller). A lot of nothing will happen without the batteries.
        I have had the floor of my battery box give way (separate) on the right side. About 1/2" gap. That is right above my generator. I haven't taken it apart yet to see what happened. I'm replacing the slides with full extension slides, and plan to lower the floor about 1/2". A welder friend donated a few feet of #1 very flexible cable. I'm going to install a buss bar for +12v and a ground, I'll lose a bit at the back of my vanity cabinet inside.  Only the flex cables will slide out. I may put that breaker/disconnect switch  at the back of the battery box, where presently I have the factory 100A circuit breaker. The goal is Trojan size 145 batteries, for a little more capacity, or maybe a switch to Battleborn LiFePO4.  I'll take pictures to bore everybody with.  RonB
Thanks, Ron, Your photos and comments are never boring. I'm going to replace my batteries soon at which time adding that circuit breaker would be easier.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #35 –
Quote from: Chris Horst  - 
Lynne, look in your manual and find Diagram #5 at the very end. Looking at the battery diagrams to the right you will see 2 blurbs referencing CIRCUIT BREAKER MANUAL RESET - a 12v, 100 amp and 12v 50 amp. In my '02 30', only the 100 amp is there and it's on the back wall of the bat. compartment. I suspect the black box on the right in your LD is the 100 amp fuse. I've never found the 50 amp fuse. I

The 100-amp breaker, on the rear wall of the battery box, disconnects the coach battery from the battery isolator.

Switching it to the 'off' position will not stop the coach battery from discharging, it will prevent the engine's alternator from charging the coach battery, when the engine is running. You can see the 20-amp fuse for the electric step attached tot he right side of the breaker.

The 50-amp circuit breaker is the 'hidden' fuse, located within 2' of the coach battery, it's location is not specified in the Owners Manual, you have to disassemble things inside to find it.
In our 2003 FL, it's hidden in a covered chase, along with other wires going into the battery compartment from the inside of the rig.

Without an actual coach battery switch, the battery cannot be disconnected without unbolting and removing a battery cable.

I suggest getting a lithium battery jumper to use in case the starting battery dies, this will make jumping a much easier task. Beats having to move other equipment to use jumper cables.

Larry

Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
 
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #36 –
This entire thread has reinforced the thought that I won’t be getting an electric step.  Simpler is better!
Greg & Victoria
2017 Mid-Bath  “Nocona” towing a manual 2015 Forester
Previously a 1985 TK
SKP #61264
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #37 –
Quote from: HiLola  - 
This entire thread has reinforced the thought that I won’t be getting an electric step.  Simpler is better!

You can think what you like but when the wife says 'we are getting the electric step!", it may be time to reconsider. YMMV

Larry

Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #38 –
Quote from: Larry W  - 
You can think what you like but when the wife says 'we are getting the electric step!", it may be time to reconsider. YMMV

Larry


I hear you, Larry. I meant to say “if DW allows it” heh, heh, heh!
Greg & Victoria
2017 Mid-Bath  “Nocona” towing a manual 2015 Forester
Previously a 1985 TK
SKP #61264
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #39 –
Good decision Greg.  Get the step.  It will give you something to repair when out on trips.
2014 27 MB
Towd: Either the Jeep Wrangler or trailer containing the BMW R1200GS and 2 E-bicycles
Happy wife=Happy life
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #40 –
Thx to all for such an enlightening discussion & pictures.

Yes, Ron, the black box looks like the one in your link. 

I'll take all this with me the next time I go to the farm.  If I don't see anything identifiable from this thread, it's time to go back to the wizards near Kansas City to get one installed.  This is obviously way above my paygrade--at least I know enough to know that I don't know enough! :D 

Lynne
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #41 –
Hi Larry;  I thought that breaker in the back of the battery box was for the load side of the house batteries. So you're saying that it is for the line coming in from the battery isolator?  The diode is only rated for 70 Amps, so a 100Amp breaker won't save that.
 Pretty sure I don't have any heavy duty cables coming in from the diode isolator.  Maybe a #8 wire.  Does that mean the unknown location 50 A breaker is load protection for the batteries?   I'd look in my LD manual, but I haven't been able to find that for about 20 years.  Haven't actuallu trace the wires from that breaker.  I didn't buy an isolator switch. More problem than they were worth.   RonB
    Still, either of those switch/breakers could be used as a battery disconnect. Placed between the batteries, or my choice, in the ground lead of the pair of house batteries.
RonB (Bostick) living in San Diego
Original owner of "Bluebelle" a '99 TKB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #42 –
Now my step does not work. It's not retracting - not when closing the screen door (independent from the switch position) and not when starting the engine. I noticed just half an hour ago. It might not have been working since a while. All three breakers (behind the switch, behind the batteries, in the breaker panel) are good.

When the step switch has the top side "down" I can hear a click when I close the screen door (also when I come close to the contact on the door frame with a magnet), when the step switch has the bottom side "down" I hear nothing. Besides the click I hear anyway nothing (like an attempt from the motor to move).

Can I use the step as a manual step when I disconnect the arm from the motor? That would be best for me for the time being. Doing that should be fairly easy by taking out the pin from the arm and then moving the parts away from each other.

How risky is it to drive with an extended step in the country side (not in cities)?

Klaus
2001 26.5 Mid-Bath
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #43 –
Quote from: Larry W  - 
I have seen more problems with the main power plug, under the step and make sure it is tightly plugged in. Pull the plug apart and see if the contact appear to be clean.

Do you mean by "main power plug" what is called "four-way connector" in the diagram, or what else is this? Or do you mean the two-way connector that according to the step test procedures in the manual can be used to check whether the motor is working?

Klaus

PS: My manual has #875 and is from 1999, the one to which you posted a link is #888 and is from 2017.
2001 26.5 Mid-Bath
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #44 –
Well, I managed. I followed the procedure from the manual for testing the motor (with the help of a jumper cable and some "extension" cables). For that I had to disconnect the two-way connector under the step and then connect the cables from the engine battery in a certain way with the two-way connector leading to the motor. The motor worked and the step moved in and out as it should.

When I reconnected the two-way connector the step still worked. What a magic! I never ever before touched this two-way connector, and it is connecting both ends super firm. I actually don't think this was a bad connection. Could it be that something got "reset" by disconnecting and reconnecting the power from the motor?

Now I only have to clean up. First the tools and cables, then myself. I look like a mechanic after a hard day's work. It's truly no fun to work under the extended step in the dirt. But - no complaints here. I did it, I'm grateful (also to the information in this thread), and I learned something. I will stay with some satisfaction for the night where I am right now - Koosharam Reservoir - and travel tomorrow to Capitol Reef National Park (where I will be for four days without Internet).

Klaus
2001 26.5 Mid-Bath
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #45 –
Quote from: Klaus  - 
Well, I managed. I followed the procedure from the manual for testing the motor (with the help of a jumper cable and some "extension" cables). For that I had to disconnect the two-way connector under the step and then connect the cables from the engine battery in a certain way with the two-way connector leading to the motor. The motor worked and the step moved in and out as it should.

When I reconnected the two-way connector the step still worked. What a magic! I never ever before touched this two-way connector, and it is connecting both ends super firm. I actually don't think this was a bad connection. Could it be that something got "reset" by disconnecting and reconnecting the power from the motor?

Now I only have to clean up. First the tools and cables, then myself. I look like a mechanic after a hard day's work. It's truly no fun to work under the extended step in the dirt. But - no complaints here. I did it, I'm grateful (also to the information in this thread), and I learned something. I will stay with some satisfaction for the night where I am right now - Koosharam Reservoir - and travel tomorrow to Capitol Reef National Park (where I will be for four days without Internet).

Klaus
By the end of this year, Klaus, you'll be a certified shade tree mechanic.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #46 –
Klaus said, "When I reconnected the two-way connector the step still worked. What a magic! I never ever before touched this two-way connector, and it is connecting both ends super firm. I actually don't think this was a bad connection. Could it be that something got "reset" by disconnecting and reconnecting the power from the motor?"

I am always thankful for the spontaneous regeneration of inanimate objects!  :D   Congratulations on this successful endeavor.  This is still a project in my future.

Lynne
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Electric step not working all the time
Reply #47 –
Quote from: Klaus  - 
Well, I managed. I followed the procedure from the manual for testing the motor (with the help of a jumper cable and some "extension" cables). For that I had to disconnect the two-way connector under the step and then connect the cables from the engine battery in a certain way with the two-way connector leading to the motor. The motor worked and the step moved in and out as it should.

When I reconnected the two-way connector the step still worked. What a magic! I never ever before touched this two-way connector, and it is connecting both ends super firm. I actually don't think this was a bad connection. Could it be that something got "reset" by disconnecting and reconnecting the power from the motor?
.
I look like a mechanic after a hard day's work it's truly no fun to work under the extended step in the dirt.

If all you did was disconnect and reconnect the plug, very good chance the plug pins are dirty. I would fill the plug with dielectric grease and work the plug a few times to establish a good connection. Do the same to the four-pin, main plug too.

For working on the road, to keep out of the dirt, I carry a small tarp and a good size sheet of cardboard, folded and stored under the couch's cushion.

Larry


Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze