Fridge out January 26, 2020, 08:07:46 pm Kinda of bummed. The ammonia leaked out of our fridge in our 2003 TK. Cooling unit is stained yellow. I've had to futz around with propane fridges for the last 30 years and am considering replacing it with a 12V fridge using the quiet and efficient Danfoss compressor. 90% of our camping has power connections so this option has appeal but I am concerned about extended boondocking if we go this route. I have two solar panels so it might be a viable option. I'm also considering repair. I replaced a cooling unit before but that was with a small manual Dometic unit in a class B we had before the LD. Then of course there is the option of replacing the whole fridge with another propane burner.Has anyone put a Danfoss powered fridge in their rig? My daughter has one in her outfitted Transit van and loves it. She only has two solar panels but they seem to keep up with the power needs. Anyone replace the cooling unit in the Dometic Royale fridge with good results?Thanks!
Re: Fridge out Reply #1 – January 26, 2020, 11:36:46 pm "Then of course there is the option of replacing the whole fridge with another propane burner."Vince and one of his crew replaced my failed '04 fridge in less than four hours. Ingress and egress through one of the large windows without any modification. The box measures 24"X24", easy peasy! 2 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #2 – January 27, 2020, 12:16:42 am Your 2003 LD's refrigerator lasted four years longer than our 2003 LD. Consider yourself lucky to get 17 years out of it.Converting to a 12-volt, compressor refrigerator will require a lot more solar and battery than what you presently have, a lot more.With all the talk about compressor refrigerators over the years, I have not seen an LD with a compressor refrigerator yet, several have talked about doing it but on one has posted the results of a successful conversion in their LD.Considering compressor refrigerators cost considerably more than an absorption refrigerator and the added expense of a serious solar and battery upgrade, replacing what you have with the same is going to be much, much, cheaper and a whole lot less of an hassle. Larry 2 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #3 – January 27, 2020, 12:28:03 am "Anyone replace the cooling unit in the Dometic Royale fridge with good results?"Steve,The fridge in my '03 FL (pretty sure it was the original) quit me about five months ago. I was going to replace it completely, but my local shop told me they replace many more cooling units than new refrigerators, it would be several hundred dollars cheaper than a new fridge, and they've had great luck with them. My fridge was in very good condition inside, so I decided to go that route. They ordered the replacement cooling unit (for mine, a rebuilt Dometic, identified as a Nordic 39-5462). I arrived at their shop at 9:00 AM. By 2:30 they had finished, cleaned up, leak tested and had the unit ON. About 3:20 I walked out with a service person and could feel the outside coils were warm, though still no cooling as expected inside, temperature in fridge and freezer at ambient (84 degrees). Was home by 4:30, and checked it at 10:30 PM, freezer was 18 degrees and fridge was at 36 degrees. It cooled down faster than I expected. Since it's parked in my driveway, I keep it on for extra storage. It's worked great. So far, I'm very satisfied!Bill 3 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #4 – January 27, 2020, 12:47:43 am Points taken gentlemen. Oh, and I didn't realize I have to take a window out! My class B had the bigger entry so no issue there. For that reason alone I think I will order up a cooling unit The leak happened while plugged in at home and using shore power. The leak actually happened around the firebox. This got me somewhat alarmed. If it had been burning propane wold there have been a chance of a fire?
Re: Fridge out Reply #5 – January 27, 2020, 09:20:52 am This advice has been offered in the past, but may be worth another repetition: if/when replacing an older refrigerator (not just the cooling unit), remove the bins if they're in good condition and use these in the new refrigerator; the bins in new refrigerators (keep these as spares) may be flimsier than those in earlier models. 2 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #6 – January 27, 2020, 10:11:28 am Quote from: 73gitane - January 27, 2020, 12:47:43 am. Oh, and I didn't realize I have to take a window out! My class B had the bigger entry so no issue there. For that reason alone I think I will order up a cooling unit The leak happened while plugged in at home and using shore power. The leak actually happened around the firebox. This got me somewhat alarmed. If it had been burning propane wold there have been a chance of a fire?The refrigerator is removed and replaced through one of the large, sliding windows. The window remains intact.Even if a new cooling unit is installed, the refrigerator will need to be removed from your LD.If the old refrigerator's plastic has not started to become brittle, replacing the cooling element is fine. Many refrigerators show signs of deterioration at your rig's age.That choice wasn't available to us, the refrigerator died six hundred miles form home, on the first day of a four week trip so it was replaced, not rebuilt. As Joan mentioned, remove the plastic bins and shelves, the new ones are much thinner and weaker than the ones in your 2003 LDTo prevent fires from coolant leaks, the burner has a sheet metal shield that is supposed to contain any flames.Larry 2 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #7 – January 27, 2020, 10:21:27 am Quote from: 73gitane - January 27, 2020, 12:47:43 amThe leak happened while plugged in at home and using shore power. The leak actually happened around the firebox. This got me somewhat alarmed. If it had been burning propane wold there have been a chance of a fire?Absolutely!There was a fridge fire in a storage facility we kept the big coach in. We had just dropped our coach off and noticed an ammonia smell in the building. We mentioned it to the owner, who assumed it was a coach that had recently had fridge work done, and he was going to call its owner to have them come out. Meanwhile, he left the storage doors open for the day.It was a calm, sunny day, but we later found out for some reason the power apparently was cutting in and out. The facility owner was prepping his own coach for a trip, so he had the fridge on, cooling down. The fridge was obviously switching to LP when the power cut out.The doors were closed for the evening.Long story slightly shorter, late that evening we got a call that there had been a fire in the building. Turns out it was the facility owner's coach. It was totaled. We were lucky that all we had was external soot.Never assume that because you're operating on shore power, you can't have a fridge fire. Close the LP tank when the coach is stored elsewhere or indoors. 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #8 – January 27, 2020, 10:46:43 am I replaced the cooling unit without removing the unit. All work was done inside on the couch in an RB.I have the power to run a compressor fridge but have not done the research to find one that would fit. Next time around I’ll look for a replacement compressor cooling unit, I think.Has anyone done the research to find a compressor replacement for the RM2663? 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #9 – January 27, 2020, 11:01:17 am The ridiculous prices of replacement refrigerator door shelves and bins should be enough incentive to take very good care of the originals. 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #10 – January 27, 2020, 12:04:04 pm Henry,rvcoolingunit has a cooling unit for you and my RM3662. Seems like I used another supplier 8 years ago when I replaced the cooling unit in a class B I had but don't remember the company. https://rvcoolingunit.com/Search.aspx?k=rm2663One at $545 and an Amish built one at $665. I'm tempted to get the Amish built one since it's supposed to use thicker tubing and better built. Anyone attest to this?My fridge is in pretty pristine condition so most likely go this route to avoid the window hassle. I'm thinking I should have enough room in the lounge to do the cooling unit swap. 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #11 – January 27, 2020, 12:13:15 pm The refrigerator doesn’t weigh that much, two reasonably strong people can lift it through the window, it’s done all the time. Do put a heavy blanket on the window sill.It’s much easier to work when on a table with easy access from both sides. Larry 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #12 – January 27, 2020, 12:33:22 pm Larry,I'm not adverse to threading the fridge though a window but I assumed the windows are sealed pretty good and would be a real pain to remove.Then there's the "I live in the NW and it's the peak of rainy season and I have no cover" factor 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #13 – January 27, 2020, 12:36:04 pm I used their Amish unit. Didn’t follow their instructions exactly. If you seal the new unit in with foam as they say you will never be able to take it apart again. The new unit seems to work a bit better than the original, nothing dramatic. I bought the one with boiler insulation already installed.LD has the unit pretty well glued in there with extra screws and such. The base bolts are not lag screws like most coaches. You have to get to the other side to grab the nut. I would suggest removing the door to lighten things but you have to take care not to break the fragile hinge pins if you do that. I broke one.It requires two people and some creative thinking to slide it out and lower it to the floor. I used a floor jack. Others built a wood frame of the proper height. While you are at it you might install an ARP unit. It gave me the warning that things weren’t right before it actually failed. If the fridge is working properly it doesn’t seem to be needed. It never turns the new cooling unit off even when driving in mountains. It did the old one.It is a lot of work but in my mind your best option.
Re: Fridge out Reply #14 – January 27, 2020, 01:19:11 pm Quote from: 73gitane - January 27, 2020, 12:33:22 pmI'm not adverse to threading the fridge though a window but I assumed the windows are sealed pretty good and would be a real pain to remove. As I said before, the refrigerator will pass through the big window, no disassembly of the window is necessary. I have done this several times.Larry
Re: Fridge out Reply #15 – January 27, 2020, 01:29:51 pm "...I assumed the windows are sealed pretty good and would be a real pain to remove."There is NO window 'hassle'!I don't know where that came from. To pass the old and then the new fridge in and out of the coach all that is necessary is to open the window, remove the screen and continue from there. The old unit exits the coach via the open window and the new unit enters the coach via the open window. Replace the fridge, close the window and have a beer! 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #16 – January 27, 2020, 01:50:01 pm Oh, sorry for being dense. I was thinking the window had to be removed to create the necessary clearance. I get it now 2 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #17 – January 27, 2020, 02:10:51 pm Steve, Another thing to consider when the fridge is out is to upgrade the insulation in the compartment. The insulation has been discussed here on the forum many times. I didn't do it when mine was replaced (I didn't want the service facility do it), but only because the way I have been, and most likely will use my rig didn't make it worth while for me to pay to have them do it. If I were going to full time, or boondock a lot, I'd go to the trouble of taking the fridge back out redo the insulation. A search within the forum for 'refrigerator insulation' will bring up plenty of info on what to expect.Bill
Re: Fridge out Reply #18 – January 27, 2020, 05:49:32 pm Quote from: krmugn - January 27, 2020, 02:10:51 pmAnother thing to consider when the fridge is out is to upgrade the insulation in the compartment. The insulation has been discussed here on the forum I fully lined the refrigerator compartment with a high-grade foam a few years ago. Where we had problems keeping the refrigerator cold during heat spells, insulating the compartment made a big difference and most likely decreased propane consumption.Details below,Reinstalling refrigerator | FlickrLarry
Re: Fridge out Reply #19 – January 27, 2020, 06:47:55 pm Yes, I will definitely change out the insulation. Styrofoam was originally used and I told myself I would probably change that out at some point. Well that time has come My daughter used the same R-Tech insulation in her van conversion.Larry I noticed that you added the rear baffle to channel venting closer to the coils. I've seen that done in the past and will do the same.
Re: Fridge out Reply #20 – January 27, 2020, 07:18:17 pm Recently, I became aware of an interesting product called Aerogel. I first thought it could be a good substitute for Reflectix insulation for the LD windows when needed. Amazon sells Aerogel panels. Amazon.com: HiwowSport Aerogel Insulation Hydrophobic Mat of High Temp....Amazon also sells a self sticking version.roVa Flex Aerogel Insulation Tape - - Amazon.comNow I wonder how it would hold up as an insulation for the LD fridge enclosure. This YouTube video demonstrates its use very well. https://youtu.be/qnOoDE9rj6wI’m sure others here have seen this product as well. Any thoughts on possible LD uses?Kent As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Fridge out Reply #21 – January 27, 2020, 08:08:00 pm Quote from: 73gitane date=1580168875 link=msg=[quoteLarry I noticed that you added the rear baffle to channel venting closer to the coils. I've seen that done in the past and will do the same.The baffle or venturi is shown in the Dometic installation guide, it’s purpose is to speed and direct the flow of cooling air through the coils.LD didn’t follow the manufacturer’s installation instructions, possibly reducing the cooling capacity. Since the insulation was installed at same time, the baffle’s effectiveness is unknown. As a whole, the refrigerator works much better.Larry
Re: Fridge out Reply #22 – January 28, 2020, 12:05:48 am Quote from: Kent Heckethorn - January 27, 2020, 07:18:17 pmRecently, I became aware of an interesting product called Aerogel. I first thought it could be a good substitute for Reflectix insulation for the LD windows when needed. Amazon sells Aerogel panels. I’m sure others here have seen this product as well. Any thoughts on possible LD uses? It's another NASA invention, I saw this video several months ago about it.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeJ9q45PfD0Interesting stuff that I would love to play with, ...if someone wants to buy a couple thousand dollars worth of it.It is very expensive now but in a few years, who knows. Being so lightweight and a ultra insulator, many different types of manufacturers will want to use a form of it. For use in our LDs? At $16 a square foot (3/8" thick), the only place I see it being worth the cost is insulating the freezer, it loses heat at a much higher rate than the refrigerator but has the same amount of insulation.The Amazon aerogel has no spec sheets so you really don't know what you are buying Both of the reviews mention dusting issues I have no idea if this aerogel can withstand the physical environment of a RV, with the bouncing and vibrations. it certainly would need to be fastened securely .From the Wiki"Aerogel is not a single material with a set chemical formula; instead, the term is used to group all materials with a certain geometric structure"Not all aerogels are the same so without more information on this material, it's gamble. This a subject to watch as it is commercially developed and becomes more widely available and made of different materials for various applications.I would feel a lot better buying it from a better know company than HiwowSport. Larry 1 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #23 – January 28, 2020, 02:41:06 pm "considering replacing it with a 12V fridge using the quiet and efficient Danfoss compressor... Has anyone put a Danfoss powered fridge in their rig?"I did exactly that in my 2003 midbath, and also in my 2017 Airstream. In both cases I installed a Vitrifrigo DP150. This is a 20% smaller fridge than the original Dometic (5.3 cu. ft. vs 6.6), but as a solo traveler I find it more than big enough.The smaller size of the DP150 allowed me to add extra layers of insulation, and the shorter height made room for a storage compartment below the fridge, where I keep pots and pans (see photo). I'm very happy with the change from the propane-powered Dometics and Norcolds I had in the past. It worked so well in the Lazy Daze that I made the same switch as soon as I bought my Airstream.However, Larry was correct: in a boondocking situation, you don't have enough solar and battery capacity to run an all-electric fridge--even a very efficient one like this (Danfoss BD-35 compressor unit, which draws about 5 amps when running)--for very long . I have 600 watts of solar panels on the roof, and in wintertime I add 200 watts of portable panels on the ground. And I have 320 amp-hours of LiFePO4 batteries. For camping with hookups this type of fridge would be fine, but if camping off-grid for more than a couple days at a time, you'd need to substantially beef up your electrical system.Incidentally, the price of the Vitrifrigo DP150--I paid about $1,300, as I recall--is comparable to that of the Dometics used by Lazy Daze. Of course you get fewer cubic feet for your dollar, so in that sense it is more expensive. But if you're happy with a slightly smaller capacity, installing a compressor fridge needn't be significantly more costly. 5 Likes
Re: Fridge out Reply #24 – January 28, 2020, 10:50:39 pm Nice installation job Andy. My daughter put a Vitrifrigo in her van conversion. Very nice fridge. I made the decision to rebuild the fridge with a cooling unit from RV Cooling Unit Warehouse I got the so called "Amish" model that is supposed to be better built than original. I put the order in so it's on its way.A compressor fridge is in my future but for now I'll stick with propane.
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