How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

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How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

January 20, 2020, 02:30:48 pm

I have a question.

I have seen the posts on ham radios and know just a little about them (what I have seen in movies etc.).

For those that go off grid where there is no cell reception at all, how do you stay informed about any potential poor weather or dangerous goings on (e.g. wildfires, escaped criminals or wild bear on the rampage - whatever you might care to hear about)?

Do ham radios fit that bill? Can you get signals when you can't get cell signals? Are there special channels for this that give you local information?

I know about weather radios, but are they effective when you are out in the middle of nowhere (might not be towers anywhere close by).

Thanks, Jane

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #1 – January 20, 2020, 02:37:29 pm

Although Ham Radio would be a great way to communicate across the country or the world, I am not sure you would get the updates delivered as you might like.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #2 – January 20, 2020, 06:04:10 pm

One way is G.O.A.L
It predates Marconi....

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #3 – January 20, 2020, 08:08:14 pm

I have a $10 emergency radio with NOAA weather band reception that I bought on Amazon. It works in Quartzsite and did also work in other, more remote areas - but not with the best audio quality. As far as I know weather band radios work almost everywhere where AM stations can be received. Unlike cell phone waves AM radio waves can travel hundred miles during daytime and several hundred miles during nighttime.

There are also car radios with NOAA weather band reception which probably have a much better quality than my rather crappy device. However, to what extent anything else but weather related information is being broadcast over NOAA weather band frequencies I don’t know.

Klaus

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #4 – January 20, 2020, 08:26:59 pm

"As far as I know weather band radios work almost everywhere where AM stations can be received. Unlike cell phone waves AM radio waves can travel hundred miles during daytime and several hundred miles during nighttime."

From Wikipedia: "NOAA Weather Radio is an automated 24-hour network of VHF FM weather radio stations." Due to its higher frequencies, VHF FM has much shorter range than broadcast-band AM. But that's not necessarily a bad thing, since you don't want to hear about a tornado warning several hundred miles away--you want local information.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #5 – January 20, 2020, 08:33:10 pm

For news and weather out in the boonies, XM radio provides the news and entertainment.
We have a 2-M and 70-CM amateur radio that includes the NOAA weather radio channels.
Radios-2M/70cm and CB | Flickr
The radio, with a rooftop antenna, is much more sensitive than any of the handheld weather radios I have tried.
Some weather radios have built-in alerts than can be programmed for the area you are in. This assumes there is a local weather radio transmitter.
We were in Death Valley a few weeks ago and there was no NOAA weather radio or FM. No cellular data either.

Larry

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #6 – January 22, 2020, 06:57:51 pm

We depend on the kindness of strangers. In other words we gamble. I know not a good strategy.

Glen

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #7 – January 22, 2020, 08:42:56 pm

When my son was sailing in Mexico and always off the grid, he had no radio or sat phone. He had a VHF when he started his journey, but it died on the trip.

When at anchor, Scotty would get in his kayak and paddle from boat to boat and inquire about the weather. He made it through 2 hurricanes over 18 months. As an added bonus, when he didn't check in with us for months on end, I could contact cruisers and ask if they had seen him. I still correspond with one of them.

No one died, he made it home, and it was much more remote than anywhere we can go with the Lazy Daze.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #8 – January 23, 2020, 02:26:38 pm

If you have internet, there's a cool little android app called Scanner Radio. It can get your location from GPS and stream nearby public safety channels via radioreference.com among others.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #9 – January 23, 2020, 05:12:33 pm

Quote from: thefuofus - January 23, 2020, 02:26:38 pm

If you have internet, there's a cool little android app called Scanner Radio. It can get your location from GPS and stream nearby public safety channels via radioreference.com among others.

Thanks for the heads up. Just installed the app and so far it has found many safety channels nearby.

Charles

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #10 – January 23, 2020, 07:12:18 pm

"...how do you stay informed about any potential poor weather or dangerous goings on (e.g. wildfires..."

I have the impression that Jane wanted to know info concerning emergency situations in the outback.

How does a Police Scanner (ie.: Scanner Radio) fulfill that need. I've owned and used police scanners for years but they only broadcast activities of local LE agencies. My current scanner does have a separate band to pick up national weather broadcasts but I doubt it would be useful in the back forty.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #11 – January 23, 2020, 07:31:27 pm

Wx is pretty much the only thing I use the cab CB radio for anymore.

I know it won't turn on and alert me like a NOAA weather radio, but I do use it for weather observations and alerts when out of cell phone range.

Rich
'03 MB in NC

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #12 – January 23, 2020, 10:34:54 pm

Steve S - yes, I want to know about that tornado or wildfire before it is visible and before we get cut off from our escape path. Same with any really bad storm that an RV should not be out in.
Same for wild critters out of control (2 and 4 legged ones) though those I would expect would be less often.

We did take a trip and didn't check conditions before hand and it wasn't until we saw the signs warning of smoke and wildfire that we were aware of anything - we thought about it and figured we would progress up and see what was what since the group we were going to see hadn't posted any warnings. It turned to to be a distance from where we were going but close enough we saw the smoke as we traveled there.

I am reading replies and bookmarked this post.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #13 – January 23, 2020, 11:57:00 pm

"yes, I want to know about that tornado or wildfire..."

I understand your concern but perhaps you should examine what you wish for...

Two instances come to my mind, one in Oklahoma City while visiting friends who had nearly lost their lives earlier when the town of Moore, OK was devastated. That night was rife with warnings on public radio. I had, at that time, a Weather Alert radio so I fired it up and programmed in the local area emergency channels. That radio ALARMED seven times that night! The following morning I put the radio back in it's box and have not used it since.

The second time we were in a campground in Minnesota when the host knocked on our door reporting tornado warnings for that area. He said; "If the wind picks up you are welcome to come shelter at my house." His 'house' was a 55' double-wide mobile home. Fat chance of surviving a direct hit!

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #14 – January 24, 2020, 12:52:28 pm

"That radio ALARMED seven times that night! The following morning I put the radio back in it's box and have not used it since."

Being awakened by weather alerts is annoying. Being awakened by a tornado would be worse.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #15 – January 24, 2020, 02:50:55 pm

"Being awakened by a tornado would be worse."

If it weren't for human nature the good folks in Reno and Vegas would starve to death!

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #16 – January 24, 2020, 09:02:56 pm

SSB (Single Side Ban) marine radios. $250+ for a decent one will reach up to 400 miles. 1500-2000 miles if its high frequency.
We had one on our boat. Basic channels as ham, plus weather channels.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #17 – January 24, 2020, 10:48:55 pm

Nice looking boat!

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #18 – January 25, 2020, 01:31:03 pm

Quote from: hutch42 - January 24, 2020, 09:02:56 pm

SSB (Single Side Ban) marine radios. $250+ for a decent one will reach up to 400 miles. 1500-2000 miles if its high frequency.
We had one on our boat. Basic channels as ham, plus weather channels.

Thanks, that sounds like something definitely to check out. It would give me a check in 1-2 times a day and a way to do emergency calls when no cell coverage/internet was available.

Steve S. - hmmm sitting where the tornadoes are all coming is not my plan so my first preference it to not be where it goes off 7 times in a night (yup sometimes it is surprising where those things spring up) , but I fully understand why you were there.

Everyone - I do really appreciate the information, gives me a place to start researching and figuring out what we would want.
Jane

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #19 – January 25, 2020, 06:42:44 pm

Coupla good intros to Marine SSB operation:

Idiot's Guide to Marine SSB

Should You Get Your Ham License?

Note that even without a ham license, you will need a "restricted radiotelephone license" ($60; good for life). You may also need a "Ship Station License" ($160; good for ten years)--it's not clear from what I've read whether this would be needed for an SSB radio installed on an RV. Maybe some of our members can clear that up.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #20 – January 26, 2020, 02:34:30 am

Quote from: hutch42 - January 24, 2020, 09:02:56 pm

SSB (Single Side Ban) marine radios. $250+ for a decent one will reach up to 400 miles. 1500-2000 miles if its high frequency.
We had one on our boat. Basic channels as ham, plus weather channels.

Marine radios are for marine use and the bands are not monitored all around the country. Not sure how many people monitored the marine bands in Nebraska, much less if phone patches or marine operators are available .
Is it even legal to operate a marine radio while inland and not on a waterway?

If communications everywhere is really needed, a satellite phone is the way to go.
For just emergency use, look into the various SPOT devices.
SPOT Satellite Messenger - Wikipedia
Satellite Communication Devices | inReach® by GARMIN

Larry

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #21 – January 27, 2020, 10:39:04 am

Emergency communications,
We tell the adult children where we are camping and use the "weather rock" for the rest.

The kids can call the local jurisdiction and ask them to find us.

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #22 – January 27, 2020, 12:32:41 pm

Amateur radio with a Technician Class license will give you access to a vast array of repeaters and linked repeater systems across the US and Canada. These repeater systems are a great way to communicate. Amateurs also use a system called APRS (Automated Packet Reporting System) to use GPS to locate themselves and others on mapping systems. There are so many benefits to having an amateur radio license that I cannot list them all here.

The entire NWS uses a system of weather spotters that use amateur radio on VHF and UHF repeaters to provide the NWS with immediate local updates on severe weather events. These spotters, using amateur radio, provide information to the NWS on hail, wind speeds at or gusting to 40 mph, local flooding, and any sighting of wall clouds or tornadoes. Using amateur radio, you can listen to these reports as they come in to NWS in real time.

You do not need to be licensed to listen, but you do need a license to transmit. A VHF-UHF scanner would give you access to the necessary frequencies. You may find NWS Sky Warn amateur operating frequencies by looking them up on the NWS system of interest.

I have been a licensed amateur radio operator since my high school days. As I sit here in my Lazy Daze in Quartzsite, I can communicate with other amateurs all over the western US via a linked system of repeaters. I am able to talk directly (simplex) to hundreds of other amateur stations located here in Quartzsite for the annual Quartzfest ham radio gathering here. We also use VOIP to link amateur radio repeater systems. I regularly communicate great distances (Europe and Australia) using nothing more that a hand-held VHF-UHF hand-held transceiver (walkie-talkie) and my Internet-connected hotspot.

Amateur radio requires a bit of commitment to become involved but it opens up a vast communications system that remains hidden to the rest of the world that relies only on cell phones and the internet.

Dan

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #23 – January 27, 2020, 06:10:19 pm

Quote from: rodneyhelfrich - January 27, 2020, 10:39:04 am

Emergency communications,
We tell the adult children where we are camping and use the "weather rock" for the rest.

The kids can call the local jurisdiction and ask them to find us.

Rodney - LOL. I did an internet search for weather rock and yup, it was what I thought it might be (this description a little more detailed). Wikipedia - Weather Rock

Re: How do you stay in touch with weather/local emergencies when off grid?

Reply #24 – January 28, 2020, 01:41:20 pm

Dan gave you a good idea of what you can do with a Technician class license, but, depending where you camp, there may or may not be VHF or UHF repeaters available. Very often when cell service is unavailable, neither is one of these repeaters. To be sure you will always have communications available, you will need to get on HF, which (besides 10 meters which is pretty much unusable with the current sunspot cycle) requires a General class license but will get you beyond "ground wave" of 30 or so miles. 40 meters has an RV service net each morning on 7268.5 khz at 9 AM out West, with others in the Midwest and East. With typical propagation, one can assume 1000 miles or so of coverage on that frequency. While the General class license used to require 13 WPM morse code and a fair amount of technical knowledge, it now has no code requirement and a multiple choice written test, mostly on rules and regulations of the license. The question pools are available, so with a little homework, all that is needed is to find the local ham club that administers the test. There is no charge for either of these licenses.

As far as gear goes, there are several radios available that cover HF, VHF and UHF. For example, I run a Yeasu FT-857D in my truck. It covers all those bands, with 2 antennas, one for HF and one for VHF/UHF. The Lazy Daze, being mostly aluminum, provides a good counterpoise for both antennas, and while an HF antenna would normally be quite long (1/2 wave antenna for 40 meters is about 66 ft long) we fake that length by using some form of loading coil with much less length overall. An antenna of this kind can easily be mounted on the ladder of an RV and kept at a height that can be used even while underway. Interestingly, I can't be sure about other states, but Washington makes an exception for hams using their equipment while driving even with all the latest cell phone laws.

Hope this information helps those who want to always have some form of communication available.

Rich - W7JVL - Amateur Extra class - Licensed since 1956 - Birch Bay, WA

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