Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #100 – November 28, 2019, 01:46:36 pm How much power does one need on an e-bike?An elite bicyclist produces about 400W with short bursts to 1000W.Human power - WikipediaIf a person wants an e-bike to do some, but not all of the work, it seems like a motor with 500W might be overkill. If a person wants the motor do all of the work and ride like a little electric motorcycle, 500W to 1000W should still be plenty.I like my bicycles to be bicycles and I don't pedal my motorcycle. The e-bike is a bit of a soup sandwich.Harold 3 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #101 – November 28, 2019, 07:48:33 pm I borrowed Bob Lawhon's Rad Mini at Quartzite 2018 and it fit nicely into my 2011 Honda CRV with the back seats folded.One may be in a really big stocking this year. 3 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #102 – November 29, 2019, 08:45:06 pm That is interesting. I also borrowed it at Q2018. That is what started us thinking about the e-bikes.Bob was very generous in letting us try his bike.Harold 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #103 – November 30, 2019, 09:54:46 am ABOUT THOSE E-BIKES . . .I just watched a favorite YouTuber. This week's subject is their RAD e-bikes. It is about 20 minutes long, and goes into a fair amount of detail about e-bikes and how they can be a useful asset to RV'ing pleasure.For those of you who have 21 minutes of your life to spare, and wish to know more, you can engage here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Y5zpSXvaz0&feature=em-uploademailVirtual hugs,Judie 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #104 – November 30, 2019, 11:56:06 am Very nice. Have to say after coming from many years as a hard core mountain biker, which is behind me now that I'm getting along in years, these bikes look like a lot of fun. Thanks for sharing. I'll be in the market for a new bike next year and sure will take a good look at the ebike option.Bob
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #105 – November 30, 2019, 05:12:13 pm Judie, thanks for sharing the video. She made a nice video with lots of good information. Cyndy is looking at the area for a future trip.Harold
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #106 – December 01, 2019, 09:18:39 am I have a hard time with labeling these thinks as bicycles. When I was a kid we'd go to Borrego Springs to ride motorcycles and minibikes and one friend of mind had a mo-ped that was pedal assist but basically a motorcycle and he kept up with all of us. Call a spade a spade here. It's a freaking electric motorcycle not a bicycle. Lots of fun I'm sure but NOT A BICYCLE! Had to be said. I could hold my tongue no longer.
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #107 – December 01, 2019, 09:42:19 am Quote from: Sawyer - December 01, 2019, 09:18:39 amIt's a freaking electric motorcycle not a bicycle. Lots of fun I'm sure but NOT A BICYCLE! Had to be said. I could hold my tongue no longer. But you can still use the pedals to move without turning on the assist (even remove the battery and still ride). :-)Admittedly, for me, unless I'm on level ground, it's difficult because of the bike's weight.
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #108 – December 01, 2019, 09:54:32 am Well, after this discussion and our test ride that I described in a previous post, I pulled the trigger last night and bought an e-bike for Cyndy. Merry Christmas.I decided on a Rip Current Fat bike by Juiced Bicycle . 750W hub motor, 52V, torque sensing pedal assist, 4 inch wide tires, hydraulic disk brakes, and Wall-Mart quality front shocks . 750W is about 1 hp. When she test rode it on Friday she had a big smile as she ripped around the parking lot and rode up a few steep side streets. Happy wife-happy life.Sawyer isn't far off the mark. This bike is pretty close to a motorcycle. I think she is going to have a ball. 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #109 – December 01, 2019, 10:57:12 am Maybe call them a hybrid? 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #110 – December 01, 2019, 11:44:17 am Quote from: Blueox25 - December 01, 2019, 09:54:32 amWell, after this discussion and our test ride that I described in a previous post, I pulled the trigger last night and bought an e-bike for Cyndy. Merry Christmas.I decided on a Rip Current Fat bike by Juiced Bicycle . 750W hub motor, 52V, torque sensing pedal assist, 4 inch wide tires, hydraulic disk brakes, and Wall-Mart quality front shocks . 750W is about 1 hp. When she test rode it on Friday she had a big smile as she ripped around the parking lot and rode up a few steep side streets. Happy wife-happy life.Sawyer isn't far off the mark. This bike is pretty close to a motorcycle. I think she is going to have a ball.I'm sure they are great fun and I actually think they look pretty cool and are a good technology. I just have a purists view of bicycles and am probably a bit anal about it. Bicycles are 100% powered by the person astride them. On a bicycle you pedal up steep hills in granny gear not any faster than you could walk and if it's a long steep hill it hurts. Your lungs burst, your heart pounds, your quads scream in protest and sweat pours off you like a horse and ultimately if the hills too long and too steep you get off and push. Thats a bicycle. An E bike is something else entirely.Rant over and thanks for your patience. LOL 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #111 – December 01, 2019, 01:22:01 pm Quote from: Sawyer - December 01, 2019, 09:18:39 am It's a freaking electric motorcycle not a bicycle. Lots of fun I'm sure but NOT A BICYCLE! Had to be said. I could hold my tongue no longer. Yes, the 'bike' Blueox rode isn't a legal e-bike, it is an electric motorcycle. If ridden on the street, technically, it should be licensed and used by someone with a motorcycle license . None of the Class 1, 2 & 3 e-bikes will pull a wheelie.With its very high power output and possible high speeds, it does not qualify for any of the three legal e-bike classes.If you research deeper, you will find many who've done such conversions to lightweight bikes and been successful but some have discovered that the bike frames can break when subjected to more torque that what they were designed for.There is a reason why all purposed designed and built e-bikes, including the most expensive german e-bikes, weigh much more than conventional bikes, even when the weight of the motor and battery is subtracted. As Hall pointed out, a strong rider can produce up to 1000-watts of power and the bike ridden is designed for this stress. Adding a 1500-watt motor and controller can be subject the frame to 2-1/2 times the torque that a strong rider can produce, not to mention the extra weight of the e-bike kit....ride at your own risk. The danger is even greater for aluminum frames which usually fail catastrophically, with no warning. I would be cautious to repeatedly hammer one of these bikes down steep trails at speed, frame breakage can get ugly fast.Some other problems with e-bikes and RVs that need to be considered. How do you plan on carrying your new e-bike{s]?They are very heavy and need to be lifted onto a rack or into a vehicle. What type rack is going to be used and how will it effect towing, if you do?A rack that stores the bikes across the rear of the RV will block access to either a tow ball or an RV-mounted tow bar.Our LD's two-bike rack has been lifted as high as practical and still interferes with easily connecting the Jeep's conventional tow bar, that stays on the Jeep and uses a 2" tow ball.With tow bars that stay on the RV, it's probably not possible to swing the bars up and into the stow position.While some bike racks that have 'u' shaped trays for the wheels could be used with a ramp of some sort, most e-bikes racks drop the wheels into baskets that do not allow using a ramp, requiring the total weight of the bike to be picked up and dropped in the baskets, dead lifting 60+lbs is a strain or not possible for most older users.If you op for a folding e-bike, so it can be stored in the rear of a Jeep or other vehicle, the same heavy lifting is necessary.Things to think about.Larry 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #112 – December 01, 2019, 02:55:58 pm Quote from: Sawyer - December 01, 2019, 09:18:39 amI have a hard time with labeling these thin[g]s . . .We can say that about a lot of things that have changed since we were young and foolish Are you snowed in yet Sawyer?Joel
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #113 – December 01, 2019, 03:55:43 pm I can still deadlift 40 pounds or a bit more, depending on the ‘configuration’ of what I’m trying to heft, but, as one of the ‘olders’ that Larry refers to, getting a 60-pound bike on and off a rack is, regrettably, not do-able. ☹️
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #114 – December 01, 2019, 07:14:16 pm Quote from: joel wiley - December 01, 2019, 02:55:58 pmWe can say that about a lot of things that have changed since we were young and foolish Are you snowed in yet Sawyer?JoelNow I'm old and foolish. No snow here yet. Looks like California is getting it all. My brother in Ridgecrest even got snow. 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #115 – December 02, 2019, 10:31:02 am We test rode the Rad Folding Mini with our friends and liked lots of things about it. However, it is still 68lb. When folded it is a smaller package, but still a hefty load to lift and store. The thought of lifting it and bending over to place it into the back of the Jeep made my back hurt just at the thought. Since the smallest folded dimension is wider than the door opening on the Lazy Daze, it would have to ride on the rack. We ended up with a 26 inch wheel bike that will ride on the rack.Being married to a younger woman, I am confident that she can put the bike on the rack when I get more feeble.Harold
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #116 – December 02, 2019, 10:40:17 am "Being married to a younger woman, I am confident that she can put the bike on the rack when I get more feeble."Look at it this way... a younger wife can give you more children, far into your senior life, and they can lift those bikes for sure! 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #117 – December 02, 2019, 02:55:40 pm Quote from: Jim Langley - September 18, 2019, 04:29:54 pmI wrote a review about the Hollywood TRS (about $330 when I reviewed it) 2-bike hitch rack we are using on our TK to carry the e-bike and my regular bike. Here's a link:Hollywood Racks TRS Rack & Rack Valet - Road Bike Rider Cycling Resource GuideIt does take more effort to get the e-bike on the rack because the battery and motor add so much weight. I've seen a few racks with ramps for helping to roll the bike up onto the tray it sits on. You could make your own ramp out of a piece of PVC tubing cut lengthwise I bet. That piece of PVC could be bunjied onto the rack maybe for easy storage.If there's 2 of you working together you should be able to get the bike on the rack without too much trouble. That's how we do it.Regarding theft, the safest approach is to remove the bikes from the rack and put them inside the LD anytime you're not around to watch the bikes. Locking them to the rack just means they stay safe from honest people. Thieves have no trouble with locks. But they are a lot more likely to steal bikes off of racks than they are to break into your LD to get them - if they even see that they're inside the RV. I'm talking about driving around more than while in campgrounds. Though, there are thieves in campgrounds, too, I know - witness generator thefts.If you read the review you'll see an accessory that Hollywood makes called the Rack Valet. That's one of my favorite bike products ever. It's a small cart for holding the rack that allows you to roll the rack out to your LD so you don't have to lift and carry the rack out. Also, the rack can be parked in the Valet making it easy to move out of the way in the garage when the racks stored and no on the RV. It should work with all brands/types of hitch racks.Hope this is helpful,Jim & DebSanta Cruz, CaliforniaThe estimated (lifespan 3-4 years) and the cost of new batteries (@$1000) pretty much puts the bike thing out of my reach.
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #118 – December 02, 2019, 03:09:39 pm High quality LiPO battery packs with Samsung, LG, or Panasonic cells can be purchased for between $250 and about $800.18650 Ebike Battery PacksI agree that they are expensive, but the price continues to fall and the voltage and capacity improves. Interestingly, my resourceful but frugal Canadian cousin made his own battery pack at a significant savings. It isn't pretty, but he has been using it without problems for nearly daily commuting in the hilly Nanaimo area since 2015. 3 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #119 – December 22, 2019, 01:42:49 am After weeks of researching, obsessing, and consulting Jim, our forum bicycle expert, I decided to pull the trigger on electric bikes. Actually, Cyndy and I bought one for each other for Christmas.This is really about Cyndy. She has completed numerous metric centuries on her recumbent road bike, but isn't comfortable on trails and especially dislikes sand, gravel, and moderately challenging terrain. When we take our bicycles in the Lazy Daze, I am inclined to look for trails to ride, as many back roads don't provide much shoulder for safe bicycling. She is less comfortable on trails. Thus the dilemma. We settled on two Juiced Bikes Rip Current models. They are very similar to the Rad Bikes Rover with 26X4.0 inch fat tires and hub drive motors. I liked the Juiced Bikes for the 52V batteries, hydraulic disk brakes, 9 speed Shimano casettes, and a torque sensor to smooth the power delivery. I also like the fact that their headquarters is 35 miles from my home, so if I have a problem, I can toss the bike in the truck and show up on their doorstep. We bought the bikes during the Black Friday period, so the $300 discounted price was attractive. Unlike the Rad Rover which offers a one-size-fits-all (too big for her and too small for me), Juiced offers the bike in a medium frame for Cyndy and an extra large frame for me. It is more fun riding a bike that fits.RipCurrent - Fat Tire Electric Bike - Juiced BikesCyndy has now been joining me on the dirt trail circuit that I do on my evening mountain bike. She has learned to climb over curbs, exposed roots, and erosion control barriers in the trail, ride through deep sand and gravel, and conquer steeper inclines. She keeps the PAS level set at the minimum that she needs to keep going so she still gets a workout at the end of an hour or so. The fat tires provide so much traction that she has gotten quite brave in sand, gravel, and loose rocks on inclines. Tonight I asked her how she felt after she crossed a section of deep sand and she said "This thing makes it easy." That is a win.I sold a couple of the other bikes in the garage (her mountain bike) to gain a little space and offset the cost. Next is to modify or sell the bike rack so we can figure out how to bring these on our Lazy Daze trips. They weigh a honking 70lb. apiece, which is staggering for a bicycle. (The Rad Rover is 68lb.) The battery alone weighs 12lb. and each of the 4 inch tires weigh about 2.5lb. The battery should be removed when the bike is in the rack, but the bike still weighs nearly 60lb on the rack, which is beyond the capacity of our Hollywood rack. On the plus side, Cyndy has discovered that the weight transmits into momentum on the trail and combined with the fat tires, the thing just plows over obstacles. These things are keepers. Money's all spent. The kids can fend for themselves.Harold 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #120 – December 22, 2019, 10:56:49 am Quote from: Blueox25 - December 22, 2019, 01:42:49 amAfter weeks of researching, obsessing, and consulting Jim, our forum bicycle expert, I decided to pull the trigger on electric bikes. Actually, Cyndy and I bought one for each other for Christmas.This is really about Cyndy. She has completed numerous metric centuries on her recumbent road bike, but isn't comfortable on trails and especially dislikes sand, gravel, and moderately challenging terrain. When we take our bicycles in the Lazy Daze, I am inclined to look for trails to ride, as many back roads don't provide much shoulder for safe bicycling. She is less comfortable on trails. Thus the dilemma. We settled on two Juiced Bikes Rip Current models. They are very similar to the Rad Bikes Rover with 26X4.0 inch fat tires and hub drive motors. I liked the Juiced Bikes for the 52V batteries, hydraulic disk brakes, 9 speed Shimano casettes, and a torque sensor to smooth the power delivery. I also like the fact that their headquarters is 35 miles from my home, so if I have a problem, I can toss the bike in the truck and show up on their doorstep. We bought the bikes during the Black Friday period, so the $300 discounted price was attractive. Unlike the Rad Rover which offers a one-size-fits-all (too big for her and too small for me), Juiced offers the bike in a medium frame for Cyndy and an extra large frame for me. It is more fun riding a bike that fits.RipCurrent - Fat Tire Electric Bike - Juiced BikesCyndy has now been joining me on the dirt trail circuit that I do on my evening mountain bike. She has learned to climb over curbs, exposed roots, and erosion control barriers in the trail, ride through deep sand and gravel, and conquer steeper inclines. She keeps the PAS level set at the minimum that she needs to keep going so she still gets a workout at the end of an hour or so. The fat tires provide so much traction that she has gotten quite brave in sand, gravel, and loose rocks on inclines. Tonight I asked her how she felt after she crossed a section of deep sand and she said "This thing makes it easy." That is a win.I sold a couple of the other bikes in the garage (her mountain bike) to gain a little space and offset the cost. Next is to modify or sell the bike rack so we can figure out how to bring these on our Lazy Daze trips. They weigh a honking 70lb. apiece, which is staggering for a bicycle. (The Rad Rover is 68lb.) The battery alone weighs 12lb. and each of the 4 inch tires weigh about 2.5lb. The battery should be removed when the bike is in the rack, but the bike still weighs nearly 60lb on the rack, which is beyond the capacity of our Hollywood rack. On the plus side, Cyndy has discovered that the weight transmits into momentum on the trail and combined with the fat tires, the thing just plows over obstacles. These things are keepers. Money's all spent. The kids can fend for themselves.HaroldPost merged with existing thread.Chris
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #121 – December 23, 2019, 12:58:49 pm Quote from: Blueox25 - December 22, 2019, 01:42:49 amNext is to modify or sell the bike rack so we can figure out how to bring these on our Lazy Daze trips. They weigh a honking 70lb. apiece, which is staggering for a bicycle. (The Rad Rover is 68lb.) The battery alone weighs 12lb. and each of the 4 inch tires weigh about 2.5lb. The battery should be removed when the bike is in the rack, but the bike still weighs nearly 60lb on the rack, which is beyond the capacity of our Hollywood rack. On the plus side, Carrying the electric bikes has turned out to be a bigger hassle than expected, the rack is high off the ground and requires a serious grunt to lift the two 60-lb bikes into their wheel cradles. Even with the rack raised as high as possible, it interferes with hooking up the toad or a trailer.Since you pull either a Jeep a trailer, take this into consideration when figuring out how the bikes will be carried .If using a hitch mounted towbar, you will not be able to lift the arms straight up for folding and storing, another way to secure the arms, when not towing, will need to found.Our Jeeps use folding towbars that require some contortions to connect or disconnect, crawling under the rack is not easy specially when the weather is bad, yesterday I had to hook up in downpour, not a pleasant experience.I'm considering switching to vertical rack, to clear the hitch and towbar but this still will not cure the heavy lifting issue unless some type of assist is used. I want to be able to use it on the Jeeps too.Stay tuned.Larry 1 Likes
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #122 – December 23, 2019, 02:03:13 pm Quote from: Larry W - December 23, 2019, 12:58:49 pmI'm considering switching to vertical rack, to clear the hitch and towbar but this still will not cure the heavy lifting issue unless some type of assist is used. I want to be able to use it on the Jeeps too.Stay tuned.LarryThere is a swing-away system that may work for you. It's pricey but would help with your access to the tow bar issue (though not with the weight of the bikes).Kuat Swing Away Extension 1 Likes As an Amazon Associate Lazy Daze Owners' Group earns from qualifying purchases.
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #123 – December 23, 2019, 05:47:15 pm While at the Home Depot this afternoon, I saw a big expedition vehicle from another state with a vertical bicycle rack on the rear. I hadn't seen one before, so I checked it out. Here it is:Talon Rack - 1 Bike – SeaSuckerIt probably won't hold a 60lb. bicycle, but it is an interesting idea.
Re: Electric bikes (Ebikes) Reply #124 – December 23, 2019, 05:53:26 pm Harold, thanks for the information specifically about a recumbent bike on trails. That information is of great interest to me and I will PM some questions.Jane 1 Likes
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