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Propane usage
Hope I am doing this correctly.  I want to ask if anyone knows how much propane a Kozy World propane heater will use when left with just the pilot light on.  i assume that when the internal temp drops below a certain temp the pilot will crank up.  That happened this morning when I visited my LD.
Wife and I will be leaving NOv 18 and heading west.  We are in Saugerties, NY now and for the next several nights the temps will be below freezing.  Yes, the LD is ready to go with empty tanks but full water.  The LD is in storage so I cannot plug into electricity.  I have added antifreeze to the traps.
The internal temp  was fine this morning when I checked. 
Just curious if anyone would know the amount of propane used when the heater is left with just the pilot light on.  
Thanks, Mike Lewis
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #1 –
I have no idea how much propane it would use but it shouldn't be much. I doubt if anyone can tell you the pilot light's actual consumption, outside of the engineer that designed it.
We can run our refrigerator and water heater (for about a half hour a day) for over a month on less than eight gallons of propane.
Can't imagine a pilot light using nearly as much as the refrigerator.
As long as you have several gallons of propane, it should run the pilot for a month or more.

What is more important is the time that the main burner is on and its consumption rate.
I assume it is going on and off, as the thermostat dictates. With below freezing temps, the consumption could be high, depending on what temp the thermostat is set to maintain.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Propane usage
Reply #2 –
If you're going to leave the KW heater (or any unvented propane heater) running while the rig is in storage with (presumably) windows and vents closed, carbon monoxide is going to build up. This could be dangerous when you finally do open up and enter the rig. If it were me, I'd open the door and let it air out for ten or fifteen minutes before entering.
Andy Baird
2021 Ford Ranger towing 2019 Airstream 19CB
Previously: 1985 LD Twin/King "Gertie"; 2003 LD Midbath "Skylark"
Re: Propane usage
Reply #3 –
Quote from: Mike Lewis  - 
Hope I am doing this correctly.  I want to ask if anyone knows how much propane a Kozy World propane heater will use when left with just the pilot light on.  i assume that when the internal temp drops below a certain temp the pilot will crank up.  That happened this morning when I visited my LD.
Wife and I will be leaving NOv 18 and heading west.  We are in Saugerties, NY now and for the next several nights the temps will be below freezing.  Yes, the LD is ready to go with empty tanks but full water.  The LD is in storage so I cannot plug into electricity.  I have added antifreeze to the traps.
The internal temp  was fine this morning when I checked. 
Just curious if anyone would know the amount of propane used when the heater is left with just the pilot light on. 
Thanks, Mike Lewis

Hey, Mike. Nice to see you posting again. Last time was when you were trying to sell your RK. Guess you decided you couldn't part with it. 😢 Safe travels back to the West.

Chris

Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Propane usage
Reply #4 –
I've not yet invested in either a Buddy heater or KW, but this is of interest.  If I'm reading this correctly, Mike, you're leaving your rig in storage with a propane heater set to kick on as needed (per the thermostat setting).  I've given some thought to that, with the furnace, but have been anxious about leaving it unattended for several days at a time.  Mike, you mentioned antifreeze in the traps, but what did you do about the water heater?

My storage is an unheated machine shed with no electricity, but since I'm running back & forth to Texas every couple of weekends & hadn't yet needed to winterize (though we set a new record at 12 degrees last night), I've kept the rig in the driveway where I could check it a couple of times per day, with an electric heater keeping the temp at 50, bringing the water heater up to temp once a day, & keeping the cupboard/bathroom/pump access doors open...so far so good. 

Still, I'd prefer to have her inside when we have snow & ice; if it were safe to leave her unattended with one of these heaters set to kick on as needed, I could put her out at the farm.  Thoughts from the wizards are greatly appreciated. 

Thx--
Lynne 
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Propane usage
Reply #5 –
Hi Lynne;

Yes, you read it correctly.  But I am leaving NY on Nov 18 for points in the southwest.  8 more days and I am out of here.  A propane heater is the way to go though.  Furnaces will kill your batteries and waste more propane too as the outside is also heated.  I have not used my furnace more than 2 or 3 times/year and that was on really cold nights.  I guess that the Wave heaters are safer but I have had my Kozy World for about 8 years now and it works fine.  Just remember to open the exhaust fan a bit.
My water heater is under the bench seat at the rear table (mine is a RK).  My heater is mounted on the back wall so is very close to the water heater.  I pulled out the bench seat slightly to allow more hot air to enter.  Ditto for my couch bed where the water tank is located beneath.
The storage yard is about 10 miles distant so I am wasting gas.  Will check the propane gauge soon and turn off the heater until I return in the late afternoon.  Daytime temps are in the 40's and 50's.
One thing I forgot to do was to remove the 6gal bottles of water I carry outside under the drivers seat.  I will move them to the shower today.
Wish me luck!
Mike
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #6 –
Thanks Chris!  Yes, we went camping last winter and decided we still liked our LD too much to part with.  Felt guilty as one party drove some 700 miles to look us  over...
But time is running out due  to health issues.  My wife has Parkinson's and it will not get better.  One day and season at a time.  Hope to see some of you out west again.  We will use campgrounds,  Escapees especially, rather than boondock on the desert near Bouse and Parker.  Will a group of you be at Elephant Butte, NM again? Safe travels everyone and stay warm.
Mike
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #7 –
Hi Andy;

I figured you  would post that warning!  I am still alive.  I do  open the roof vent in the kitchen area (it is covered outside) by an inch or so to  play  it safe.  Opening windows is a no no in case it rains.  Thanks for your concern though.
Mike
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #8 –
Mike, Thank you so much! I have been trying to figure out where my water pump is in my 2005 RK. I pick up my rig Monday and have to keep everything from freezing until Friday when I set sail. I have rented a hookup and am going to have two small space heaters and the furnace set to 55. I will pull out the drawers and now the bed! And open the bench cupboard!
I would value your opinion on leaving the water heater on at night? Very little water in fresh water tank, gray empty and black just small amount. Another video showed a camper turning on all faucets with water pump off.???
Temps are predicted for low 20's, maybe colder and 50's maybe warmer, during the day. It will be in the sun.
I am 20 miles from the spot so thought I would leave water heater on all night.
Any thoughts appreciated.
2005 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #9 –
Also, I have two solar panels and brand new batteries.
I am sorry to hear your wife's health is failing and am happy that you both have another trip planned.
Sincerely, Sharon
2005 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #10 –
My RK is a 2007 but I assume that your water pump is in the same location as mine:  under the draws at the wardrobe on the drivers side.  If you pull out the bottom drawer slightly warmth should flow down to the pump and keep it from freezing.
I have not run the water heater.  I am counting on keeping the coach above freezing and that heat should reach the water heater.  I  would be very careful about running the furnace as that is an energy hog.  It wastes much propane, heats the outside air (makes a great hand warmer if you are outside near the exhaust) and uses up battery power too.  With two small heaters you should be fine.  Hang a blanket over the front seats to seal off that part from the house.  More heat may remain where you need it.
Good luck!
Mike
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #11 –
Our units are similar.  I have two solar panels too.  Did you get new tires too?  Sounds like a good deal.  I like the RK for having two wardrobes!  His and hers!  Enjoy! Mike 2007RK  Honda 2005 CRV toad
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #12 –
"Hang a blanket over the front seats to seal off that part from the house."

Mike

And don't forget to close those fresh air vents on the dash as well.   ;)
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: Propane usage
Reply #13 –
Hi, Mike--

Thx for that response about safely leaving the rig unattended with the propane heater set to keep the innards happy.  The machine shed at the farm is about six miles out of town--not a great distance, but just far enough off the highway/down a gravel road to be unhandy for daily checking.  Unfortunately my hot water heater, although it is encased in styrofoam, is under the stack of drawers in the kitchen, amidship along an outside wall.  From the outside venting, I'm thinking the furnace is under the sink cabinet; there is a vent right in front of the water heater (it looks like they've used flexible ducting like my dryer vent to run along the inside of the cabinet wall/next to the water heater & I'm guessing there's another duct under the kitchen sink to the bathroom vent & further along under the toilet riser into the bedroom, under the driver's side wardrobe drawers).  I wonder how much heat is lost in those runs when the furnace is on...would that make it a better idea to just  keep the furnace at 55, even though the furnace guzzles propane, rather than a Wave/Buddy/etc.?

Chris--or anyone with a 30' rig--what are your thoughts about a propane heater set as Mike has done?  I took out the bottom kitchen drawer to confirm where I thought the water heater was located...would a heater with an inside hose that allowed moving it from the lounge to the middle of the rig (with the bottom kitchen drawer pulled out, cupboard/bathroom/fresh water access doors open) be a reasonable consideration?  Traveling between north Missouri & central Texas every other weekend, I hate the idea of winterizing every time I leave Texas, but also don't want to keep the rig outside in the driveway all winter just so I can keep it plugged in with the electric heater/turning on the water heater & checking the inside temp/etc. daily--though that may be the lesser of two evils vs. winterizing twice a month  :P .

I really appreciate all the discussions here...I didn't winterize when I first got back to MO with the rig five years ago (thinking I'd be leaving for a trip shortly) & then got iced in.  I had an electric heater that apparently tripped the breaker in the house one night/didn't have the furnace set to come on at 55 degrees as a backup/didn't know I should have brought the water heater up to temp--a stupidly expensive lesson in having an icicle out of the bathroom sink spout & replacing the water heater/pump/ toilet line  :P  :-[  :( )...and not an experience I want to repeat.

Mike--happy escaping from NY to warmer climes...if coming through Missouri is on your route, give a holler & perhaps I can meet y'all along the way for lunch/dinner/etc.

Lynne
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Propane usage
Reply #14 –
Hi again Lynne;

Your 2005 RK is different from my 2007RK.  My water heater, pump, and furnace are all in different locations than yours.  From all your writings I am wondering if it would not be better if you did winterize so that you could stop worrying about it.  For your biweekly trips to TX carry some bottled water with you.  Can you dump in TX and MO when you get to either location?  Do you stay in the RK in TX or can you stay inside with your mom?  Whether you use bottled water or the pump and water tank in the RV you have to be able to dump.  When back in MO use your portable heaters as I feel they should be ample to keep your coach at a comfortable temp for your next trip.  My ideas anyway.
Since you live in a cold climate I would strongly suggest you get a Wave or other propane heater.  They are much more efficient then the furnace.  On a really cold night you can turn on the furnace.  My head is under the thermostat and if I awake from the cold I can reach up and flip on the furnace...
Enjoy your RK.
Mike
2007 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #15 –
Thanks for the tell on the air vents!
I purchased my 2005 RK as a third owner. Has 27,000 miles and sure seems to be in excellent condition. The fellow I bought from gave me all kinds of supply, knocked 1K off the price if I promised to get the roof resealed as he thought it was due. He went to the store twice before he would let me go, once for a funnel and some humidity stuff. He also rode with me to the gas station and put $50 in the tank and said to "Always put in 89". He said his wife was crying and I almost was. They just didn't use it enough and liked it so much that they wanted it to go to a "good home".
I had the roof resealed, actually all the windows and end caps checked. Put on a tire minder system, and a rear camera. I feel an almost overwhelming responsibility to take good care of him...Fred, (for Freedom Daze.)
After being on the hunt for well over a year and dragging my sister with me 'cuz this is the one-Ah, the stories I could tell, I knew when I opened the door. Oh, and no, not new tires but tire guy said they were in good condition.
Now you all keep me in your thoughts as I try and figure everything out-) My sincere thanks to you all.,Sharon
2005 RK
Re: Propane usage
Reply #16 –
Sharon, the Ford manual for your 2005 V-10 states that 87 octane gas is recommended; paying extra for mid-grade, i.e., 89, doesn’t get you any improvement in mileage, performance, or engine longevity. Save the cash for additional 87! 😉

As ever, YMMV.
2003 TK has a new home
Re: Propane usage
Reply #17 –
Quote from: Lynne Broyles-Greenwood  - 
Hi, Mike--

Thx for that response about safely leaving the rig unattended with the propane heater set to keep the innards happy.  The machine shed at the farm is about six miles out of town--not a great distance, but just far enough off the highway/down a gravel road to be unhandy for daily checking.  Unfortunately my hot water heater, although it is encased in styrofoam, is under the stack of drawers in the kitchen, amidship along an outside wall.  From the outside venting, I'm thinking the furnace is under the sink cabinet; there is a vent right in front of the water heater (it looks like they've used flexible ducting like my dryer vent to run along the inside of the cabinet wall/next to the water heater & I'm guessing there's another duct under the kitchen sink to the bathroom vent & further along under the toilet riser into the bedroom, under the driver's side wardrobe drawers).  I wonder how much heat is lost in those runs when the furnace is on...would that make it a better idea to just  keep the furnace at 55, even though the furnace guzzles propane, rather than a Wave/Buddy/etc.?

Chris--or anyone with a 30' rig--what are your thoughts about a propane heater set as Mike has done?  I took out the bottom kitchen drawer to confirm where I thought the water heater was located...would a heater with an inside hose that allowed moving it from the lounge to the middle of the rig (with the bottom kitchen drawer pulled out, cupboard/bathroom/fresh water access doors open) be a reasonable consideration?  Traveling between north Missouri & central Texas every other weekend, I hate the idea of winterizing every time I leave Texas, but also don't want to keep the rig outside in the driveway all winter just so I can keep it plugged in with the electric heater/turning on the water heater & checking the inside temp/etc. daily--though that may be the lesser of two evils vs. winterizing twice a month  :P .

I really appreciate all the discussions here...I didn't winterize when I first got back to MO with the rig five years ago (thinking I'd be leaving for a trip shortly) & then got iced in.  I had an electric heater that apparently tripped the breaker in the house one night/didn't have the furnace set to come on at 55 degrees as a backup/didn't know I should have brought the water heater up to temp--a stupidly expensive lesson in having an icicle out of the bathroom sink spout & replacing the water heater/pump/ toilet line  :P  :-[  :( )...and not an experience I want to repeat.

Mike--happy escaping from NY to warmer climes...if coming through Missouri is on your route, give a holler & perhaps I can meet y'all along the way for lunch/dinner/etc.

Lynne

Lynne, you have 4 choices to keep the LD warm if you don't winterize: 1) run the furnace on low 2) run a cat heater all the time 3) run a small space heater on low all the time or 4) keep the LD in enclosed, heated storage. Of course, your gray and black tanks will freeze up (you'll have a crapsicle in the black tank). None of these options is at all practical. Have you looked into running a 30 amp line (or 20 amp) to the barn? The option then would be to run a space heater on low, just enough to keep the inside from freezing, in between trips. In my old storage space, I had an outlet and did that but never for more than week at a time. I never had anything freeze up as long as cupboard doors were left open, etc. Surely one of your country friends owes you an electrical favor. ;)

I have a Wave 6 plumbed into the propane tank and hooked to a long hose. I can move it all over the 30'.

Chris

Formerly: 2002 30' IB
Re: Propane usage
Reply #18 –
Quote from: HalfMile20  - 
".
Now you all keep me in your thoughts as I try and figure everything out-)

Sharon

The owner's manual Lazy Daze provides to all buyers, it is the best source of information on using your LD.
Read it cover to cover a couple times and then ask questions.
It is one of the better users manuals around, containing a lot of information.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: Propane usage
Reply #19 –
Hi, Chris--

Thx for such a clear summary of options.  This discussion has been helpful in easing my mind about leaving the rig hooked up to something (either a heater or electricity) while in unattended storage...I had visions of something lighting up the night sky, or finding an interior icicle again, due to either an undetected propane or electrical defugilty.

There's not currently any electricity at the farm, except for a solar panel that was running the pump in the well. The rural electric co-op, which wants to maintain its customer base, doesn't have any short-term plans--when the well needed more ummph than the solar-powered pump could give during the drought last summer, the tenant briefly hooked up the meter, but was told if he disconnected (e.g., for the winter when he wasn't using it) & reconnected in less than 12 months, he'd have to pay for an entire 12 months of connection.  Sounds like a Wave is in my future, too.

Thx to all who have shared experience & wisdom--

Lynne
Lynne
LDy Lulubelle, Green '05 31' TB
Lilly, the 4-Legged Alarm
Re: Propane usage
Reply #20 –
Quote from: Lynne Broyles-Greenwood  - 
Hi, Chris--

Thx for such a clear summary of options.  This discussion has been helpful in easing my mind about leaving the rig hooked up to something (either a heater or electricity) while in unattended storage...I had visions of something lighting up the night sky, or finding an interior icicle again, due to either an undetected propane or electrical defugilty.

There's not currently any electricity at the farm, except for a solar panel that was running the pump in the well. The rural electric co-op, which wants to maintain its customer base, doesn't have any short-term plans--when the well needed more ummph than the solar-powered pump could give during the drought last summer, the tenant briefly hooked up the meter, but was told if he disconnected (e.g., for the winter when he wasn't using it) & reconnected in less than 12 months, he'd have to pay for an entire 12 months of connection.  Sounds like a Wave is in my future, too.

Thx to all who have shared experience & wisdom--

Lynne
So the farm does not have a residence on it, right? And your tenant just grazes cattle or raises crops? Just curious.

Chris
Formerly: 2002 30' IB