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older models' life expectancy
Hi! I am hoping to buy a LD after I sell my home in July of 2018, but I'm finding that I can only afford those that are about 13 years old. Can I expect that a 13 year old that passes an inspection will last for a good amount of time with appropriate maintenance? Thank you for any help, RG
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #1 –
We have a 2004 Rear Kitchen 26.5' that we bought when it was 8 years old, it had 48,000 miles and now
has 81,000 miles (it was in service late 2004 so it is 13 years old). the original owner kept good records and was
diligent about maintenance (As seems to be the norm with the type buyer LD attracts). We have had no problems
with the drive train and expect to get 150,000 without any major repairs like transmission. The coach may need
upholstery at the 20 year mark but I believe the structure to be made to last 30 years or more. We have replaced
things that deteriorate from sun like shower dome & vent covers, its a good idea to clean and treat the roof
seams with Dicor every couple of years (LD recommends removing and replacing the roof caulk every ten years)
but ours is still very malleable since the original owner did the dicor also). If its hard and cracked it could lead to a roof leak.
(we paid $40,000 in 2013 and am confident it would still bring $30,000 in 2018))
Mike Doyle
2013 Rear Bath
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #2 –
"Can I expect that a 13 year old that passes an inspection ..."

I am driving a thirteen year old 30'IB which I bought new in Oct. 2004. Outside of normal automotive maintenance I have had no major issues. Yes, I've replaced a windshield or two, an alternator, several sets of tires, etc. but have had little or no problems with engine, trans, or drivetrain. Any LD coach of that vintage, which has been properly maintained, should provide many years of additional carefree service.   ;)
Steve S.
Lazy Bones & Cedar
2004 30'IB (Island Bed)
Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery
Live for the day!
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #3 –
Quote from: Rimagibb  - 
Hi! I am hoping to buy a LD after I sell my home in July of 2018, but I'm finding that I can only afford those that are about 13 years old. Can I expect that a 13 year old that passes an inspection will last for a good amount of time with appropriate maintenance? Thank you for any help, RG

An LD could potentially last forever....if the proper amount of maintenance has been done to it.
LDs seem to average 7-8000 miles per year, so a 13 year old one could have 80,000 to 100,000 miles on it.
At this point, various items, such as the transmission may be near the end of it's life, a $5000+ repair.
Our LDs' transmission died a 99,000 miles.
A lot of older LDs have not been maintain correctly. Just being an LD means little if it has been neglected, they will happily rot away if the roof, windows and end caps have not been resealed in a timely manner.
I have inspected too many of these poorly maintained LDs.

To own and travel in an old LD, or any other RV, one should have a large reserve slush fund,.
Most buyers of old LDs  spend a several thousand dollars  buying new tires and batteries, as well as any repair and maintenancence to the coach or the mechanicals.
It is hard to find mechanics who work on LDs and their charge rates are usually much higher than auto repair work.
The parts can be a lot more expensive too, remember you will be driving a big truck.
Good RV techs and shops are scarce, expect to wait for extended time periods when repairs are needed
Upgrades need to be paid for too. Nothing is cheap to do, unless you can it yourself.

My best suggestion is to have any potential RV purchase professionally inspected by a qualified mechanic and by an experienced RV tech, in an attempt to find  hidden defects.
Our archives are full of sad stories of folks who did not follow this advice and ended up with nothing but trouble.
I really hope you do not become another one of these stories.

While the RV lifestyle is an attractive one, it isn't a cheap way to travel.
It is getting harder to boondock in many areas as the numbers of poor people living in RVs increases and the as local authorities put pressure on them to move on.
Even the National Forests are having the same issue with long-term campers, some forum members have reported being harassed by rangers, when staying in a spot for more than few days (but less than the 14 day limit).
Staying in campgrounds and RV parks are the safest places to park but that too comes at a steep price, plus getting into a lot of parks require long-term planning, due to the demands of an increasing amount of retiring baby boomers..

Right now, there is a huge increase in those looking for used LDs, the forum has several new members sign up a day.
Remember that at maximum production, which ended in 2008, LD only produced a little more than 200 units a year.
Today, they build around a 100 units a year.  Expect to pay top price for whatever model and year you buy.
Too many people chasing too few, decent used LDs.

One last suggestion, join the Escapees and go to one of their RVer's Bootcamps or an Escapades, you can learn a lot form this organization, plus it has all sorts of benefits for the full timer, including mail forwarding.

Happy hunting.
Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #4 –
Quote from: Rimagibb  - 
Hi! I am hoping to buy a LD after I sell my home in July of 2018, but I'm finding that I can only afford those that are about 13 years old. Can I expect that a 13 year old that passes an inspection will last for a good amount of time with appropriate maintenance? Thank you for any help, RG

The older the rig the higher the probability of one or more expensive repairs.  Past and future maintenance is key.  As others have said, RVing is usually not a cheap lifestyle, and as more people are starting to RV, that puts pressure on facilities.

Some questions:
Are you planning to full time?
If so, do you have an exit strategy if you don't want to or can't continue to full-time?
Are you handy and prepared to make minor repairs and improvements yourself?
How much of your financial resources are you rolling into an RV?

Art
Art and Barbara
Settled in Atterdag Village of Solvang
2015-2022 fulltime in a 2016 Tiffin Allegro Bus 37AP
2002-2015 2002 LD MB
Art's blog
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #5 –
Thank you everyone for your help. I do plan to rv full time. I will have any potential buy examined-I live in Mass but will be moving west. I guess I will go ahead, but pay special attention to how well unit was maintained. TY for your help-if anyone knows of any good ld for sale, I'd sure appreciate any info.
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #6 –
"I guess I will go ahead, but pay special attention to how well unit was maintained."
----
In addition to the practical and realistic advice that you've received so far, I encourage you to spend as much time and energy as you can manage before making any buying 'jump' to take your time and diligently research; buying an RV, especially if one plans to fulltime, requires a lot of 'study'. Learning how to evaluate the condition of a used LD to maximize your chances of not ending up with a problem-filled rig is a critical learning curve,  but you will also need to realistically assess your budget, not only for the initial purchase, but also for the inevitable post-buy expenditures, and try to determine (as best you can having no experience) which LD models may best work for your proposed travel and lifestyle.

This checklist will guide you in learning the inspection points on a used (or new!) RV; do study it, and if you find a rig that you think may work for you, whoever is doing the 'inspections' (coach and engine/chassis) should do the same!

RV Inspection Checklist

You will need to ask and answer a lot of 'questions' about what you want and how you see yourself living on the road, but reading through the 'how to evaluate' above is likely enough for the present time to make your head explode. I do suggest that you not limit yourself to a specific geographical area, and be prepared to travel to check out a possible buy. This link will help you to determine generally what LDs are going for; there are many variables in asking prices, including the fact that some sellers overvalue their rigs and ask prices that are out of line with reality. (This is particularly true if one buys from a dealer, but that should not be a surprise.) And, IMO, some buyers pay too much for a rig because they are in a hurry and don't research enough to know how to value.

Having done timely, consistent, thorough maintenance over the life of the vehicle is not just 'important'; it's critical. As Larry and others point out, every 'wart' may not be discoverable at the time of inspection, but a 'clean', diligently maintained rig is likely to have a lot fewer than one which has suffered deferred or slapdash 'maintenance'.

Good luck!


2003 TK has a new home
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #7 –
Not sure where you are, Rim... (a name always helps), but the inspection process for states vary, so I would be cautious about your home state, and any older vehicles’ ability to pass.

Our LD is 25 years old, and going strong. I budget 1-2 thousand dollars a year for maintenance and upkeep, including tires, brakes, etc. this does not include the inevitable $5K transmission rebuild I will plan for at 90-120,000 miles. I consider this a low budget, since I have put about $8000 into it in the last 3 years, getting it up to my standard.

Many get by with less. I, like many here, enjoy having my RV perform and look tip top.  You have to plan how you will use your RV (long distance trips or park semi permanent?), how shiny and cherry it has to look, how tolerant you are of malfunctioning systems, whether some leakage and potential long term decay keeps you up at night. 

The advice here is very good. I would add emphasis to having a big enough reserve fund that when you need a couple of thousand dollar repair you are not putting your spell at risk.

Safety though, is of paramount concern, and can be costly. Good luck!
Paul
'92 Mid Bath
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #8 –
Hi! Ty! I am in MA, but want to settle in Oregon or CA-most likely northern CA. I will be starting a new teaching job in fall, I hope-if not fall, then next spring. I would prefer to do this as I'd like to enjoy national parks for a bit. Speaking of bits, I do find myself chomping on one-I want to sell house quickly before bubble bursts! (or whatever the correct terminology is). But i could stay put for a year, and save a lot towards buying a newer model. So many decisions!
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #9 –
Hi,

Bought a 2006 rear kitchen, 26.5' LD last October.  It had 52k miles at time of purchase and had been sitting unused for over 2 years.   Here is a list of the repairs/replacements that I have had to perform.
1. water pump
2. bathroom skylight
3. batteries - 2
4. Fuel filter, pump and carburetor for generator
5. tune up, including replace all belts and hoses
6. complete brake overhaul
7. tires - 7
8. awning repair - broken plastic shocks

the above I consider a necessity to get the rig in a condition to take on trips.  Here are some of the upgrades that I have performed since purchase.  These are not absolutely necessary but I think add to the safety and comfort of the RV.

1. TPMS
2. LED lights
3. New shower head
4. 300 watt pure sine wave inverter
5. water filtration kit

Last but not least this is a list of future repairs/upgrades

1. roof reseal at factory
2. battery monitor
3. surge protector - internal
4. carbon Monoxide detector replacement
5. repair/replace air conditioning shroud
6. replace kitchen vent
7. new stereo with USB port
8. hard plumb a catalytic heater
9. tow setup

If someone had shown me this list before I bought my LD I probably still would have done it.  (Just don't show the list to the wife!)

Bob
2006 RK
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #10 –
Ty!! This will be a great help, as I don't know the difference between an rv and a sweet potato! Really, I have my abilities (such as they are), but they are in other areas. This will be great to take to an rv mechanic, and gives me an idea of how much i'll need to put aside.
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #11 –
One other thing to think about.  RV tires usually age out before they wear out.  It the tires on the rig you are looking at are older than 6 years old, they should be replaced no matter how good the tread looks.  Some recommend changing at 5 years.  If you get a blow out on a rear tire, there could be considerable damage done to important RV structures under the rig, and some have reported internal damage from a blow out as well.  Good luck.
2011 MB
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #12 –
Ty! I'm not sure how a forum works: do I need to post another question separately? I was wondering if there were more older LD's in Florida, as compared to other states. I live in MA, so I think there's a pretty good chance that I'll have to travel. Is it common practice to hire an inspector in the environs where the LD is being sold?
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #13 –
"...to take to an rv mechanic, and gives me an idea of how much i'll need to put aside."
----
Just a comment on 'RV mechanic': While 'generalists' in the mechanical sphere who are skilled and experienced with chassis/engines and coach components do exist, in my experience, they are not common. A mechanic who can service and repair the chassis and/or engine of a motorized RV 'platform' may not - and probably doesn't - know a thing about the electrical, plumbing, appliances, tires, etc., that are coach components. In other words, the person who can change out engine hoses and flush a transmission may be clueless if the refrigerator goes south!

When one finds a potentially good buy, I suggest having a 'dual' inspection done by a mechanic who's knowledgeable about the particular engine/chassis, and a service tech who can inspect for leaks/water damage, appliance condition, and other coach components, i.e., wiring, plumbing, generator, etc.

Inspections done by competent professionals can be expensive, but buying a POC will be a lot more so! The inspection list linked in my previous post will offer an idea of the complexity of all the bits and pieces that need to be checked out.

YMMV, as always.
2003 TK has a new home
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #14 –
If you're going to move to California I'd do that first and then buy there, particularly southern CA, or in NV or AZ. There are more LDs in those areas and I personally wouldn't buy one that has sat out in a wet environment for over a decade (the exception might be one from elsewhere that has been kept indoors). Plan on a long search.

If you look at the market for classic cars you'll see a principle that I think applies well to a Lazy Daze. If an old car has been in the southwest all or most of its life that will be a featured selling point. Why? Because body rot is the most difficult challenge to overcome in restoring or maintaining an older car. Mechanical problems can all be fixed but body rot can quickly spell the end for all but the most valuable cars.

I think the same applies to a LD. The most important thing to avoid is rot in the wood framing. And that's also difficult to detect. Like an old wooden boat, everything can look fine, but it can be deteriorating seriously from within. And I wouldn't trust your average RV tech to discern this. They're used to dealing with water pumps and refrigerators, not wood framing. I'd want to have someone very familiar with LDs do the inspection or learn from them how to do it properly myself.

The best place to get an inspection would be at the LD factory, so looking near there could be an advantage. But you could learn a lot about how to look for dry rot yourself by searching this forum. And with a coach that old you need to buy from someone who can show you proof of proper resealing of the roof, windows and perhaps end caps when that was needed.

Everything else can be fixed but I'd do my best to walk away from a LD with any history of extensive leaks or dry rot. It's hard to know where that will end.  And unlike cars, where rot often results from driving salted snowy roads, dry rot in a LD can be worst in a warm wet climate, like the SE.

But can a LD last? Yes, of course. We have a 2003 with about 106,000 miles. It was stored outside for it's first 18 months but has been stored in a fully enclosed garage since, in dry northern Nevada (one reason we moved here). I try to take it by the LD factory every year to have Vince there examine the roof, window seals and end caps and to discuss anything on my to-do list.

Our major expenses have been a roof reseal at the factory a few years ago and a transmission rebuild last year. It's been serviced regularly and when things break I fix them or have someone do that. I hope to be RVing for another 15 years and don't plan on buying another. I'm confident I can keep this one going. The V-10 is a solid motor and the transmission should be a non-issue now. Other things will break but hopefully not all at once.

And I second the comments that RVing is not a way to save money. Your RV will always be a depreciating asset, unlike most real estate, and it will need regular maintenance. As Larry said, I've found conditions in the field to be deteriorating. More competition for places to stay, with steadily rising prices, and the requirement to make reservations well in advance in many places. We basically avoid travel in the summer now and if we do travel in summer we look for places others don't go, like eastern Montana last summer. There are those who full-time economically and I'm sure they will speak up, but I think that usually involves a strategy of finding the low cost and less popular areas and staying there most of the time. Not, say, touring CA state parks for six months.

This will sound harsh but I'd say if you can't afford to buy a LD new or less than 8 years old (on which leaks should not yet be  an issue but some significant repairs will soon be in order–I'd want $10K or more in reserve for those) you might want to think carefully about your strategy. Living on the road can be a great choice but probably not one you want forced on you.
Terry
2003 26.5'RB
Gardnerville, NV
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #15 –
ty! I'm not ready to give up, but with the help i've found on this site, it's becoming a lot less likely that I'll dive right in to the first LD that has a nice interior-which they all do!
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #16 –
Quote from: Terry Burnes  - 
If you're going to move to California I'd do that first and then buy there, particularly southern CA, or in NV or AZ. There are more LDs in those areas and I personally wouldn't buy one that has sat out in a wet environment for over a decade (the exception might be one from elsewhere that has been kept indoors). Plan on a long search.
If you look at the market for classic cars you'll see a principle that I think applies well to a Lazy Daze. If an old car has been in the southwest all or most of its life that will be a featured selling point. Why? Because body rot is the most difficult challenge to overcome in restoring or maintaining an older car.
But can a LD last? Yes, of course. We have a 2003 with about 106,000 miles. It was stored outside for it's first 18 months but has been stored in a fully enclosed garage since, in dry northern Nevada (one reason we moved here). ant forced on you.

Terry brings up a very good point, eastern and northern climates are very hard on the coach, the best units are either stored inside or in a dry climate.
There are more LDs in Southern California than any other region, the Factory is located here.
Looking for one here is a good idea, as they are not very common once leaving California.
Yes, they are available out of state but they are rare compared to the numbers available here, which are not available in abundance either, LDs are built in small numbers, compared to other Class Cs, and their owners tend to keep them longer than other brands.
We bought our 1983 LD used, in 1995. Even living in SoCal, we spent six months looking for a good used one, finally finding one in Palm Desert, a place with little rain to cause problems .
Another thing that slows the search is that many well maintained LDs are sold without ever being advertised, passed along to family and friends

There is a huge demand for used LDs, which drives their value upward, much higher than other comparable Class Cs.
It may be sacrilege to say this but you may find a better RV locally if you look at other brands, especially if your budget is low.
I would want a low mileage model if moving to a full time lifestyle, hoping to avoid major work for a few years.

Our 2003 has never been garaged but the roof, windows and vent seals have been regularly serviced (by me) and has remained leak free. At 108,000 miles, it has required a rebuilt transmission and rear axle, close to $10,000 in repairs, even with all the maintenance items done on or ahead of time.
I have seen several same year LDs, stored outside with serious leaks. Any LD over eight years old is a candidate for rot if not maintained. A large percentage of LD owners are not savvy to the needs of keeping the seals in good condition, feeling that such an expensive RV shouldn't require much maintenance.

Finding a qualified inspector can be very difficult, finding one that can check both the coach and the drivetrain is just about impossible, few techs have the combined skills, they are different occupations.
Not trying to scare you, instead, we want  you to enter this search with your eyes wide open.
We want to you to find an LD in good shape, we have seen too many used LD nightmare scenarios, as recently as two weeks ago.  
Too many nightmares.

Larry
Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
 
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #17 –
 I have to say, reading this thread has really discouraged me.
In the beginning, I was so excited to eventually become the owner of a new LD. I read all the great stuff on the internet about how cool LDs were. I visited the factory last month, as I live in the San Diego area, and immediately fell in love with a 27MB on the showroom floor and put my name on the list for the 1-year wait. I chatted with Steve at length. I also explained to him I wasn't very mechanically inclined. At no time did he say "forget it, you're not cut out for this."
What can I say, I'm like the OP. I'm a newbie too. My only experience is a 1963 VW camper van I owned after graduating high school. I love the outdoors. I love camping. I love seeing new places and meeting new people. What better way to do it than by RVing. Especially in an LD.
My "plan" was to buy new with an RV under warranty and pretty much learn as I go.
Now I'm feeling like I "might" be good for 8 years or so, then I'm screwed. Most of the negativity I've read in this thread has been by the individuals who seem the most knowledgeable!

I guess like it's been said...rethink the whole thing.
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #18 –
So, is your plan to buy it and hit the road full-time? Or just travel as you can when the kids are on summer break? Or do weekend jaunts when the weather is nice? Only one of those will come close to 7000 miles a year, unless you drive it to work, too.

And lots of weather-related maintenance can be avoided if you can get it under roof when not being used.  No need for climate-controlled, hermetically sealed storage.  Just out of the sun, rain, and snow.

Tires get too old to rely on well before there are treadwear issues. Generators fail from non-use more often than overuse. Ford engine/trans is pretty much OK except for known sparkplug issues, which do have solutions.  Insufficient winterizing is more fatal to water systems than age, also. 

The reason many other class-C campers fall into disrepair is that they're not worth fixing. That is less of an issue with LDs. Most problems are definitely worth fixing if you catch them early, fix them right, and document the details so you can prove your case at re-sale. 
2000 Front Lounge
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #19 –
Quote from: wrightstuf  - 
I have to say, reading this thread has really discouraged me.
My "plan" was to buy new with an RV under warranty and pretty much learn as I go.
Now I'm feeling like I "might" be good for 8 years or so, then I'm screwed. Most of the negativity I've read in this thread has been by the individuals who seem the most knowledgeable!
I guess like it's been said...rethink the whole thing.
You have misinterpreted what has been said.
A well maintained LD can last a long time, the key words being "well maintained".
As I mentioned in the previous post, our present LD is 15 years old and is in good condition considering the mileage and being stored outside its entire life. Our previous 1983 LD was 20 years old when we sold it it and the coach was in excellent shape, due to being maintained properly. It was never stored inside either.

Part of the maintenance is renewing the roof, vents and windows seals, when needed.
It does require a bit of work or money to do.
This time period will vary according to the how much time the rig has been stored outside and the local climate.
All RVs, no matter what brand, will need the same treatment.  RVs live a hard life, being exposed to the elements and rough roads.
We have been discussing buying used and the problems that need to be looked for.
There is no such thing as a perfect RV, all can have problems, especially if neglected.

Buy a new LD, take proper care of it, spending money on it, when needed, and it can last a very long time.
Neglect it and it WILL fall apart. This applies to any RV, no matter the type or brand or year.
I have seen dozens of older LDs in great condition, the result of conscientious care.
It's long term survival is up to the owner, if you are willing to take care of it, it will last a long time.
To do so does require constant vigilance and the periodic expenditure of your own labor or the paid labor of others.

Sorry you find this distressful but I do try to present a realistic view of LD ownership, based on over twenty years of ownership and a lot of personal experience working on and inspecting dozens of LDs.
Too many enter this lifestyle with 'stars in their eyes', ignoring the reality of ownership.
LDs are not perfect but are built better than any other Class C, IMHO.
I wouldn't hesitate ordering a new one today.
Just be prepared to spend a significant amount of time and money, over the years, to keep it in good shape.
You would have to do the same if owning a house or a car for long time.

Larry


Larry
2003 23.5' Front Lounge, since new.  Previously 1983 22' Front Lounge.
Tow vehicles  2020 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2001 Jeep Cherokee
Photo Collection: Lazy Daze
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #20 –
"My "plan" was to buy new with an RV under warranty and pretty much learn as I go. Now I'm feeling like I "might" be good for 8 years or so, then I'm screwed."
----
IMO, you have taken the wrong message away from this thread!

What one person interprets as 'negativity', another sees as simply 'cautionary'.  Many of the posters on this board have long experience with RVs in general, and LDs in particular; some have owned multiple LDs, do a good deal of their own chassis, engine, and coach work, and some have inspected and repaired LDs for others. From their own experiences, and from those of other owners of all ages, models, and conditions of LDs, the advice and suggestions (along with the 'bouquets and brickbats') are intended only to provide a realistic picture of RV ownership for those considering the lifestyle or new to it.

Certainly, a more rosy scenario would be for posters to focus solely on the upsides and pleasures of RVs and RVing to 'new' people and downplay or ignore the rest, but how would sharing only the 'It's all fun!' viewpoint benefit someone who comes to the board seeking real life answers about LDs and the lifestyle? Would it be preferable to minimize the strong advisability of doing the research and learning as much as possible about LDs and the lifestyle, or to gloss over the ongoing expenses, well past the initial purchase price, involved in RV ownership? Or, to fail to point out the necessity of doing comprehensive inspections of all components of a used LD before purchase, or to neglect to stress the need for regular service and maintenance to ensure longevity of the rig? IMO, it would not.

Many people looking for LDs, used or new, come to the board seeking advice and information on all aspects of LDs and the associated lifestyle, a few have some RV-related experience, but some are so new they 'squeak'; their primary concept of RV ownership and RVing may well be limited to a 'rainbows and unicorns' marketing ad.  For these particularly, not being completely candid about the fact that, while the RV lifestyle can be a wonderful, freeing experience, it would be a disservice not to attempt to present enlightening reality checks!

I don't presume to speak for anyone else, but I believe that the purpose of the LDO board is to share knowledge, ideas, and experiences that we have gained, some over many years, to make friends, enjoy adventures, and, to offer a balanced, but truthful and accurate picture of this lifestyle, including its 'warts'.
2003 TK has a new home
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #21 –
Wrightstuff,

I think you're taking away the wrong message. This thread is about used LDs in the range of 10-15 years old, for a person who anticipates full-timing. What would you expect if buying a 10-15 year old car with, say, 100,000 miles, that needed to have a long and reliable life ahead of it? Wouldn't you expect to have or soon have some problems that need to be addressed? And wouldn't you be careful about a purchase? And if you bought it new wouldn't you expect to have to carefully maintain it if you wanted it to last beyond that age, say to 20 or 25 years and perhaps 200,000 miles?

A new coach will have few problems and LD will be very responsive about fixing those that do exist. From there you just have to keep up with things. Find a good mechanic, follow the Ford service schedule for the chassis and have your mechanic fix any mechanical problems that arise. Larry and I have transmissions that are now three generations old and we both tow relatively heavy Jeeps almost every time we travel. It's quite possible that the newer transmissions will last longer, especially if not towing or towing light.

There is nothing magical about maintaining the bodily integrity of the coach. When we had our roof resealed at the factory they used the method they now use for new coaches. Vince told me that they had yet to have to reseal one done that way, but I think it would be wise to plan on having to do that at about 10 years, depending on the conditions it lives in.

There are many posts here about resealing the roof yourself with Eternabond and about how to seal the windows and end caps. The factory can do all of that if you don't want to. Or you might be able to find an RV tech who can do that, provided he will study and learn from other LD owers and not just barge ahead with what he'd do on other brands.

Larry does things himself. While I probably could I tend to rely more on the factory and my mechanics. If you don't live near the factory my advice would be to keep a list of the preventive maintenance you want them to do by whatever age you think is wise, make an appointment well in advance and then plan a vacation to SoCal to get those things done. They can do everything from the most minor repair to a complete reseal and repaint, even reconstruction to deal with dry rot. $$$$, yes, but what would you expect?

Our 2003 coach was essentially trouble free until about two years ago, then the roof reseal and a transmission rebuild, perhaps $7K altogether, probably a bit more now.

I don't think many LD owners on this Forum would have reservations about purchasing a new LD if we could afford it. But I think most of us would also caution people who are excited about RVing, as we all once were and mostly still are, to be careful about purchasing a used model more than a few years old. There are good ones out there but they're hard to find and it can be hard to ascertain how they've been cared for. Dealers of used vehicles often just toss service records for instance. Then they can just say whatever they want or "I don't really know, sure is pretty though, huh?" And are they really going to tell you about the leak that was in those records and supposedly repaired?

Every make has its weaknesses, but I'll take a LD over any other Class C I've seen. Friends with a new very well-know SOB Class C once met us at a campground. As they climbed out and we were admiring their new coach he said, "Well, it's our first trip and the TV just fell off the wall." The mounting screws just went into thin plywood, nothing else. I guarantee that won't happen with a LD.

Having said all that I think you should understand that RVing does require a certain degree of self-reliance. You need to have a basic understanding of your coach, how to use its various systems, and what it needs. And you need to pay attention to it and get it the help it needs reasonably promptly, not letting  problems accumulate or fester. And it's not a bad idea to be able to make some minor field repairs yourself, say replacing a coach water pump. But there are usually people around to help. And there is lots of help available on the Internet, mostly right here. Other help may be some distance away and not entirely convenient, but you'll eventually solve your problem and be back underway.

As to overall cost, I think you need to expect some expense when hauling what amounts to a tiny house up and down all over the place. And when you pass an RV dealer especially in the west, with hundreds of new RVs on the lot, sometimes several dealers like that in a row, surely you ask yourself who's buying all those and how they're going to affect your travels? It's not 1960 anymore, when the rural parts of the U.S. were essentially empty and untraveled.

No one is trying to scare anyone off. But you should go into a purchase like this with your eyes open, especially with an older high mileage LD that may have been stored in harsh conditions. I too owned VW campers, three to be exact. Our LD has been more reliable and more fun. And more comfortable.

Go for it! Or not.
Terry
2003 26.5'RB
Gardnerville, NV
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #22 –
Rimagibb, wrightstuf,  mentioning the possibilities of problems with an older model is not meant to be discouraging but to help give you a realistic picture of what an older rig entails.

A rule of thumb in IT projects I've seen is "The first 90% of the project takes the first 90% of the resources and the rest of the project takes the other 90% ".
About a month ago a new member posted this: 1991 LD with 90K miles 
The poster recognized there would be problems and proceeded.   You might take a look at that as to what was found and the support received from people on the board.

I purchased a brand new 27' travel trailer in 2010.   A 1/4 " screw holding a window blind string stripped out.   I went to replace it with a 1/2" screw that went clear thru the trailer wall.  It was an indicator of a quality lack I overlooked when signing.   The loss I took in selling it was less that the loss I'd have taken keeping it.   LD's are in a different world in terms of quality coming out of the factory.   Owner attention to maintenance is a big factor in a rig's longevity.

I had my 2013 31' in for its 30K maintenance last year.    Brakes and Transmission fluid were good.   The rear axle fluid appeared 'burnt' due to constant towing and always running near the GVWR.    As a maintenance item, I'll replace the axle fluid at 15K rather than the recommended 30K.  I expect a couple thousand for brakes in about 2 years,  and several thousand for a transmission in another 6 -7 or so.   It's just part of the cost of doing living.

Don't be discouraged, but keep your eyes open.
The worst questions are those that are unasked.

Joel & Terry Wiley
dog Zeke
2013  31 IB   Orwan   / 2011 CRV Tow'd LWEROVE
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #23 –
thank u to all-much to think about. I am the least mechanically inclined person I know, so I would be relying on mechanics. I had just started to research selling my home, declaring freedom (partial, anyway, because I want to start a new teaching job in CA-but maybe I won't get that, either, due to age!), and being mobile. I just fell i love with LD, and thought I'd be able to maintain it with my new salary.  I had thought along the lines that I wouldn't mind spending 40g for what would be both my home and my transportation, but I am starting to feel that I do need to reconsider.
As everyone has pointed out, buying a much older rv has many risks, and I am not equipped to deal with them all. My plan was all based on finding an older one that was in good enough condition to only require a thousand or two a year in upkeep. I think that I may have to settle for another brand that is only a couple years old, and chalk it all up to a lesson in humility.
I am not well-off financially, but I will clear enough to be able to purchase a new LD. I do not want to take a chance with what will be my child's only inheritance, though---is this "TMI"? I'm trying to explain my reasoning here. Perhaps with a salary I'll be able to save for a few years and be able to buy the RV of my dreams, which is the LD! Thanks to all! I don't know if it would be considered sacrilegious here, but if circumstances prevented you from buying an LD, what "cheap brand" (boo hoo) would you rank as "better than the rest"? Thank you
Rita
Re: older models' life expectancy
Reply #24 –
 Thanks for the response! As usual, there is no shortage of intelligent and thoughtful input into most matters posted on this forum.
I should have been more clear on my feelings. What I took away from this thread was an idea that unless you're mechanically inclined enough to deal with all but the big items that come up thru the use of your RV, then you're fighting an inevitable uphill battle. Statements were made about how "hard" or "impossible" it is to find good mechanics.
What I want to do leans towards a lot of use and a lot of miles. I want to pretty much follow the sun for 10 or more years. I've already seen the world and have been virtually everywhere on earth as a retired pilot. Now it's time to see it all by land. After I sell my home in Carlsbad, Ca. later this year, I had "planned" to do just that.
I'm not mechanically inclined, but I'm not stupid. If I put 8-10k miles on an LD annually, then it won't take long before big ticket maintenance items and all the rest surfaces. All of it will be budgeted for. My "plan" was to spend the kid's inheritance for 10 years then give the LD to my son. I'm not about to hand him the keys to a PoS RV with upwards of 100k miles on it, long since fallen out of repair. All of my vehicles have been meticulously maintained. Just not by me! Lol.
It needs to be fun for me or why do it at all. There have been statements in this thread about the difficulty of finding good mechanics. If I'll need one for 98% of all issues, am I going to spend half the time stuck in hotels somewhere waiting for repairs?
I've ALWAYS been able to fix or have fixed everything. Can I do that too in an LD or not? I don't see why not...I think.

Rimagibb....I apologize if I've hijacked your thread. I just felt that this was the place to have my say.