Are these wires solar wires?? March 04, 2018, 02:40:48 am I know we had custom components put in by the original owners, but I thought something might look familiar to someone.We are replacing our power center/charger/converter/inverter.Everything is removed and all wires figured out (coach AC circuits, coach DC circuits, shore, generator, and battery) except these few.I think they are solar wires - cause nothing is left. Originally it had 4 solar panels put in early 1990s (camping world if I remember right) but sometime before us it was reduced to 2 solar panels that are still there. Red and Black wires are coming from bottom of the compartment. I think these are the main solar panel wires - these come up from below and go to the right to connect to the battery positive and negative - I think the red was cut too short so this buss joins it to another piece of red to continue White, Black, and Green (green line marked with red tape though so likely really red). I think these are used to monitor the battery voltage/usage. These came up from bottom near the entry door, I disconnected the lines that joined these to the old battery monitor (showed amps and voltage) and then continued on to connect to the battery positive and negative. Jane 89 TK.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #1 – March 04, 2018, 09:24:10 am JandS2 wrote: "These came up from bottom near the entry door..."Do you, or did you, have an electric step at the door? Any 'extra' power outlets on the outside, or underneath (like to plug in AC pipe or tank heaters)? What's your trailer hookup wiring like, if you have it?If you go to where they come in near the entry door, you can trace to their destination. The tape is a 'code legal' way to re-define a wire's color code, but I usually see it done with black-only wires in commercial or residential entry panel work.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #2 – March 04, 2018, 09:43:30 am Chip,Manual step. No outside outlets we have found. It does have towing and also airbags to help with that - we can double check towing wiring.We do knpw there is solar. Records seem complete from original owner and we can double check with the second owner (we are the third owner). Looking underneath might give some clues - the only wire in conduiit in the power equipment cabinet is the generator 120v wiring. I don’t sremember seeing anything on the roof by the solar but I could double check if there is anything showing there.Jane
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #3 – March 04, 2018, 09:45:12 am These wires are connected to a pair of parallel-connected automatic circuit breakers. This would not be the wiring for the solar. My guess is it connects the batteries to the converter panel, and looks like a LD stock connection.Steve
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #4 – March 04, 2018, 09:52:00 am Jane, In response to “ - I think the red was cut too short so this buss joins it to another piece of red to continue red and black wires”The "buss" is a 40 to 60 amp self resetting circuit breaker. It is two 20 or 30 amp self resetting circuit breakers connected with buss bars. More commonly used at that time. Manual reset circuit breaker are more common now and safer because they force you to look at them and for the problem.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #5 – March 04, 2018, 02:43:15 pm Steve and Rodney,The two metal devices in the one pic:The larger one on the right marked ola-1 4495 does look like an automatic breaker (I didn’t look it up, I am replacing it with one that is not automatic and easier to get to).That one had only the battery positive cable connected to I both sides of it.The battery cables connected directly to the power center (distribution panel charger/converter and inverter all in one) - two spots one for each cable.The wires I didn’t know what they were are the smaller res and black ones on the metal device on the left. No markings on that device and only the red goes thru it.Maybe that is also an automatic switch (would make sense to have one between the solar panels and the power center/battery).That red wire and black wire continues on to connect at the same respective spots in he power center where the two battery cables connect (positive and negative).I tried to get pictures or videos before I took things apart to trace the wires going to the two metal devices but there was no room and a ton of wires and it just didn’t work.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #6 – March 04, 2018, 04:27:55 pm Look at diagram #5 for the battery connections both new and old(1986).
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #7 – March 04, 2018, 04:38:11 pm In imj 1253 the square thing on the left with 4 hex nuts is " Self Resetting Circuit Breaker" or "Automatic Fuse Breakers" in the old Diagram #5.OLA-1 8845 I have not seen before.I hope diagram #5 will help you figure out the wires before solar was installed.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #8 – March 04, 2018, 04:40:01 pm Quote from: JandS2 - March 04, 2018, 02:43:15 pmThe larger one on the right marked ola-1 4495 does look like an automatic breaker (I didn’t look it up, I am replacing it with one that is not automatic and easier to get to).That one had only the battery positive cable connected to I both sides of it.The battery cables connected directly to the power center (distribution panel charger/converter and inverter all in one) - two spots one for each cable.The large black wires look like they would go to the generator, from the coach battery, and possibly that round item is a circuit breaker. The large size is to carry enough current to operate the starter motor.QuoteThe wires I didn’t know what they were are the smaller res and black ones on the metal device on the left. No markings on that device and only the red goes thru it.These are the items I referred to. They are a pair of automatic circuit breakers bussed in parallel, and they likely connect your coach batteries to the converter distribution panel. LD typically uses this method, and they are typically in a concealed location.Steve
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #9 – March 04, 2018, 05:54:08 pm Hmm the red and black might connect the cab battery to the power center - the energenius does talk about being able to barge the cab batteries and there are extra wires to that cab battery.The black green white might be solar as they go to the battery monitor before continuing into the battery connection at the power center.I need to draw a picture. I will do hat tonight tomorrow and do some testing to see if we can figure out the wires. Figure 5 confuses me more - I know houses not cars. Diodes - what do they do? And what dies a diode isolated do? Scott forgets and I never knew.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #10 – March 04, 2018, 06:01:25 pm Think of a diode as an electrical "check valve," similar to a check valve in a water system. It allows current in one direction.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #11 – March 04, 2018, 06:15:19 pm I should say the drawings are confusing because I don’t know what a diode is - I follow the rest of them.I notice both pictures have a wire from the battery to the chassis for grounding. .Our old setup had the negative battery going to the power center (all in one distribution center for ac and dc, charger/converter/inverter). That had a ground wire going to it.Our batteries are only about 2-3 feet from the power center.Is there value having a ground also at the battery?Safety pieces, I understand a breaker between battery and power center is good (protects power center and batteries from each other doing a surges or short).Makes sense to put one also between solar controller and batteries.What about between generator and power center?I checked wires - bottom of inside compartment for power center equip is top of an outside bin - now wires coming thru and no access panels in the bin. Only wires coming out below RV is generator (ones that went straight to our power center and also ones that went to Onan switch inside RV.Boy the 120V were in conduit but the 12V and other 12V at backnof RV were not in conduit - exposed to road elements - I would want them in Conduit just to protect them. I think that will go on my todo list for the future.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #12 – March 04, 2018, 06:16:51 pm Check valve - that makes sense. Thanks.So a diode isolates with 3 wires coming into it? A double check valve (two check valves)? Read manual to know what direction flow is allowed?
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #13 – March 04, 2018, 08:08:01 pm Diode isolator is really two diodes The truck generator supplies 14volts DC to the center post.The truck battery is connected to one side post.The coach battery is attached to the other.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #14 – March 04, 2018, 11:13:58 pm Testing:Red and black wire. I did trace these going towards the cab. Hard to trace - felt by hand at times around objects, so 90% certain ended up in cab area. Not able to really trace them to battery or alternator.However, no voltage in them - not from cab battery and not when engine running (from alternator). So no idea what these do (or if they are disconnected somewhere).Green/white/black wires - no voltage in sunlight. However, tracing these (pulled out drawers and volia could see them) shows they go up the wall towards the roof from between the fridge and the tk bed/lounge area. Since these also were connected to the battery monitor, I am still guessing they are solar.Picture (jpg) of the wiring - kinda big but readable and people can zoom in and out - it gives details is (pictures added for clarification):Wiring when we got the LD
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #15 – March 04, 2018, 11:29:08 pm Ok, outstanding questions:Safety issues:Breaker should be between battery and power center (per progressive dynamics when talking to their tech support).Follows that solar panel controller should also be protected (if that is not protected somehow by the power center).Question: What about breaker between generator and power center? Is there protection in the generator to not spike power / short that there is no concern about this? Since we are installing an ATS from progressive before our power center (not one built in) and generator and shore power go into the ATS (with the breaker between the ATS & battery), I will double check with them if one is needed between generator & their ATS.The red and black that go toward the engine but seem to get no power from the battery or alternator, we are going to do a couple other wild tests for in-case and if we can't get any power or continuity to show on them, wirenut them off and secure them (they are 12v so should be fine). Anyone able to see any problems with this?The green and white and black wires - if those are solar, when we dig into solar more we will work with these. We see no solar controller, unless it is inside the panels, but I am betting we will want larger wire when we add solar.Jane
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #16 – March 05, 2018, 10:41:09 am Roof wiring is most likely solar-related, as you surmised. Other 'orphan' wires of substantial gauge could be supply or output for a since-removed power inverter -- 12V in, 120V out. Any chance 'roof wire' takes a detour to fridge, as part of an inverter-supplied '3-way' fridge mod? (Again, now removed...)I couldn't open the link above (Mac/Safari). Could be link, could be me...
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #17 – March 05, 2018, 10:53:18 am Jane,On the 12 volt side, I put fuses at each power source point( i.e. battery, Power converter, Solar Controller, Solar Panel).Circuit protection between the battery and Power center: one is required within 18" of the Battery. My 1988 MB has an Self Resetting Breaker ( the squre thing with 4 hex nuts) outside, but in front of the battery box.Posative Wire to the solar controller: On my installation, I put a fuse within 18" of the solar controller output B+ and I put a fuse protection within 18"of the Power center. Connecting to a fuse in the power center Qualifies. Solar Panels, I put a fuse at each solar panel.My Power center is old and only provide 6 amps of charging current compared to the 50 amp wire rating, it uses sacraficial compnents to provide protection.Generator starter protection, I am not sure what is needed there, I have not traced my wires,yet.ATS is not used on the 12 volt Direct Current side.On the 120 Volt side:Onan Generator should have a 30? amp Circuit Breaker on the Generator. This protects wiring to the ATS. My ATS is mounted on the Power Center, it is within the 18",so its protection for the ATS Output is the 30 main breaker in the Coach Power center. The Shore line is to be procected by a circuit Breaker at the camp ground pedistal. The shore line is also protected from Coach overloads by the 30 amp main breaker in the coach power center. You will need to check with the manuafturer on a circuit breaker between your ATS and the Power Center.The ATS is used on the 120 Volt Alternating Current (60 hz)side because differences in the sine wave phases between the pedistal and the on-board generator could result is a short circuit even when wired correctly. This is the same effect as canceling soundwaves in a stereo system. This paragraph is hard for many to understand but true.
Re: Are these wires solar wires?? Reply #18 – March 05, 2018, 12:17:29 pm [quote author=rodneyhelfrich date=1520265198 link=msg=185004The ATS is used on the 120 Volt Alternating Current (60 hz)side because differences in the sine wave phases between the pedistal and the on-board generator could result is a short circuit even when wired correctly. This is the same effect as canceling soundwaves in a stereo system. This paragraph is hard for many to understand but true.[/quote]Besides providing safe power for the RV, the ATS prevents back feeding of A/C power into the shore power system. another potential source of harm and damage. This has become bigger problem as more people have their own home generator, few have the proper transfer switch.Larry 1 Likes
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