Class B suggestions? October 20, 2017, 11:10:26 am My dear friends are thinking about getting an RV. The lady of the house shows dogs, so travels with them frequently. She doesn't think she'd be comfortable driving anything larger than a Class B. They've asked me which of the many offerings are considered the "best, most reliable, well-built". Since I never considered one, I never did research on them, so I've got nothin', but would like to help them make a good choice. I imagine some LDO's have researched or owned a Class B at some time, or have friends or family with one. I'd appreciate any advice, recommendations, opinions, or precautions. I don't think they will buy new.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #1 – October 20, 2017, 11:44:54 am " I imagine some LDO's have researched or owned a Class B at some time"How many dogs, and what size? Behaviour problems, carriers, X-pens, other doggy equipment We have owned a Class B Sportsmobile for 18 years and LOVE it, BUT it is an adjunct vehicle to the Lazy Daze - a "toad" if you will. It is splendid for the occasional overnight, and really great for a day trip. We've taken several three-week trips in it - two people whose combined weight is less than 300 pounds - and it was tight.I relentlessly have lobbied to get a slightly larger Class B that has an enclosed toilet and that we can stand up in without putting up the penthouse top. And anyone who knows me will understand the RELENTLESS part. I have been at this for years!!I won't clutter up the list here with about 17 pages of "research report", so PM me if interested.Bottom Line: Check out the available space (inside and outside) and cost of a Lazy Daze TK, if "small" is desired, as compared to even the most spacious Class B. Be prepared with smelling salts when looking at prices of Class B units, even used.Hint: Get on Facebook and join the Roadtrek, and other Class B chat groups, and be prepared to be shocked at the number and severity of problems that are incurred by owners (new and used), and then compare to the posts on our own Lazy Daze list. Virtual hugs, Judie
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #2 – October 20, 2017, 11:57:57 am Hi Bill,We owned a 2013 Roadtrek Agile SS Class B (about 20' long). That model is built on a Mercedes Sprinter with a diesel engine. We put 30K miles on it over 3 years and loved it. The build quality was not quite as high as our LD, and some of the choices they used for cabinet latches, doors and other interior finishing details could have been better thought-out. But, for a small RV, it was a nice rig. Our mileage was amazing - about 19.5 - and that's driving as fast as you want to go - up to the governor on the Sprinter motor will let you, which is about 80mph.The Mercedes was a powerful, smooth driver. I once drove from Boulder, CO to Santa Cruz, CA non-stop right through a snowstorm on Vail Pass and endless fog up I5 - that was 22 hours of almost non-stop driving and I never even felt sleepy. The driving is that comfortable. However, the maintenance on Mercedes diesel engines is frequent and expensive.Overall though, if I was in the market for a Class B, I would look at Roadtreks first. I know they were recently acquired by a German company, but I believe the original Canadian owners are still involved. You are being redirected... Maybe the best thing is that Class B rvs are so popular right now, that if your friend buys one and needs to get out from under payments (cause they are getting really expensive), it's highly likely they will be able to sell it for very close to what they paid for it. There were so many people that wanted our Roadtrek we could have had a bidding war, if we had wanted to do something like that (not).Since you mentioned dogs, we traveled in the Roadtrek with 3 dogs - about 40 pounds each - and the crates, dog food, water bowl and so on. My wife loves dog agility and we used the Roadtrek to go to events and lived out of it on the road with the dogs no problem.I hope this is helpful,Jim & Deb2016 TK
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #3 – October 20, 2017, 12:44:47 pm "I won't clutter up the list here with about 17 pages of "research report", so PM me if interested." "Hint: Get on Facebook and join the Roadtrek, and other Class B chat groups, and be prepared to be shocked at the number and severity of problems that are incurred by owners (new and used), and then compare to the posts on our own Lazy Daze list."Thanks Judie, I'll PM you. As for problems, yes, I have a colleague that purchased a new SOB about a year ago, and he had a 34 item punch list that he's still trying to whittle down...seems it's been in the shop whenever he isn't out in it! I have another acquaintance that wanted a Class C. He'd seen mine, liked it. I encouraged him to shop for a used LD, but he was too impatient to wait. Ended up with a used Winnie of some sort. It hasn't been much trouble, but they haven't used it much either. One can offer guidance\recommendations, but after that... "Since you mentioned dogs, we traveled in the Roadtrek with 3 dogs - about 40 pounds each - and the crates, dog food, water bowl and so on. My wife loves dog agility and we used the Roadtrek to go to events and lived out of it on the road with the dogs no problem."Jim and Deb, thank you as well. I think your comments will be very helpful. I'm going to copy and forward them to my friends. 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #4 – October 20, 2017, 01:12:38 pm We were “this close” to buying a Winnebago Travato. It is built on the Dodge Promaster. Nice class B. To us, all class Bs are surprisingly expensive new. And the forums are like what I read on most other motor home forums- full of dealer issues, build sloppiness, issues with all the gadgets built in. We sure liked the Liesure travel B+ vans, though found they are in fact the same size as an LD 24 footer. We did not seek out an LD, it found us. We love be it, and have also built our own class B, a true camper van, more like a sports mobile. It is what we drive as a primary vehicle. So nimble. When I get more money than brains I’m ordering an Advanced RV
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #5 – October 20, 2017, 01:51:11 pm I am not a fan of the Sprinter based class B's. Only for the legendary Mercedes price to have one.Chrysler / Fiat does not inspire confidence with their products.That leaves Ford. I see Winnebago has a new class B built on the Transit chassis. The Paseo.I think Ford has done a great job on the Transit, and if I were looking at a class B, Ford would be my chassis of choice to start with.Others might have a Ford class B as well, I haven't done any more that a google search and found the Winnebago first.Paseo Overview | Winnebago RVsEdit. Looks like they don't offer it with the diesel engine, only gas, too bad.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #6 – October 20, 2017, 02:17:54 pm "I think Ford has done a great job on the Transit, and if I were looking at a class B, Ford would be my chassis of choice to start with."A friend just bought a mid-top Transit to build out as a work van. He brought it over to our house for show and tell the day before yesterday. It was very nice to be able to stand up in there, but I was trying to imagine the build-out of the RV-type cabinets, etc. that are in our Sportsmobile inside of that box. It was frightening. I'm sure the "in person" feeling might be different, but it gave me a whole new perspective on what I had imagined. I had been thinking that a Sportsmobile on that mid-top would be perfect, but walking around inside was very enlightening.The Dodge/Fiat chassis is four inches wider than a Transit when building out a Sportsmobile, but I'm not sanguine that four inches in width would have made a big difference.Driving the Transit was a delight, though. I did not feel like it was much different from our low-top Dodge Sportsmobile, but it was a short experience, light without any RV amenities, and not in windy conditions. The owner had just driven it from Ohio back here to Arizona, so he already has a couple of thousand miles under his belt. He was very pleased with its handling, etc.. And this is a man who knows vehicles!Still . . . when the dust settles, if one wishes a small vehicle for comfort and pleasure, the Baby Daze just can't be beat. High mileage use would cost some bucks over and above one of the smaller chassis vehicles, but one must name one's poison. Virtual hugs, Judie
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #7 – October 20, 2017, 02:30:36 pm One thing to keep in mind with the Transit-based B's, should you want the option of a toad/towed, the Transit is limited to no more than 300 lbs tongue weight/3000 lbs tow weight (at least on LTV's Wonder).Sprinter-based B's towing limits are something like 7500 lbs for a "pure" B-van, 5000 lbs for a cab-chassis build up B+/C.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #8 – October 20, 2017, 02:37:39 pm I agree that the 24' LD is the way to go with the animals. They are easy to drive, have the full bath, and adequate room. Trying to make B work in this situation is not practical. A SOB C is another option, of course. The B is just too tight and too expensive for this application. Frank
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #9 – October 20, 2017, 10:53:47 pm My sis and her husband have a Pleasure Way Pursuit. I am very impressed. This is the second one. The or first was purchased used. They traded for a new one that has a floor plan better suited to how they use it. I’m very impressed with the build. This has the better cabinetry than my LD. Not sure I would leave my mid bath for one, but if someone is looking for a class B, the should be on the list.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #10 – October 21, 2017, 10:24:07 am Never been in a Pleasure Way, or even seen one in the wild. But on their site, it looked like it pushed a lot of the right buttons.Chip 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #11 – October 21, 2017, 11:59:20 am Dynamax might be worth looking at.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #12 – October 21, 2017, 12:08:21 pm Quote from: Duro - October 21, 2017, 11:59:20 amDynamax might be worth looking at. They were bought out by Forest River.... build quality has gone downhill.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #13 – October 21, 2017, 12:36:48 pm "Never been in a Pleasure Way, or even seen one in the wild. But on their site, it looked like it pushed a lot of the right buttons."I have spent untold hours watching videos put out by Pleasure-Way. There are so many at their site. Very impressive is the one where they go into excruciating detail about building their cabinets. Each set of cabinets is made specifically for the unit they will go into. Each video is about 15 - 20 minutes long, so bring along a cup of coffee to sip.The videos made by RV dealers with Pleasure-Way units for sale are also useful in that you can see the salesman climbing about inside of the rig, which will give some sense of what it would feel like in person. HINT: Much as an advocate I seem to be, the few times I have been inside of a Pleasure-Way or even a Roadtrek, it felt very closed in to me. A single, even with a small pet or two, may do okay, but for two people (or more) it will be a constant "Pardon me, Dear" situation. Somehow it seems moreso than what we experience in our own Sportsmobile. I can't explain it.After two VW's and our current Sportsmobile, we have worked out this tango decades ago . . . DH just stays seated (or goes outside) if I am bustling about, and vice versa. The front passenger seat can spin around to be part of the living area, and that is the best spot for the current "non-user" to hide out. There is a pop-up shelf that serves as a computer desk right there, so it is easy to just do 'puter stuff whilst other activities are taking place in the rest of the van. Or recline the seat and read, or the ever popular . . . take a nap.The way our Sportsmobile is set up is that the "bed" is a gaucho sofa across from the kitchen. The kitchen appliances and cabinets are at the height that is most conducive to use from the vantage point of sitting on the gaucho. If a unit has the two beds in the back, then that gives a better variety of places for the "non-bustler" to stay. But the width of those two beds is somewhat narrow. Haven't tried to sleep on them, but they don't look wide enough to me. Our gaucho pulls out to be nearly as wide as a full-size mattress, but takes up the whole aisle, except for about four inches, which really isn't enough to scoot by, or open any of the cabinets.I could go on (but mercifully, I'll stop here) - there are many, many aspects that one doesn't consider until put in the actual situation of having to live in that cramped space. It looks so perfect in all the literature and videos. Truly, it IS doable, but one must be prepared to make extreme sacrifices. Also keep in mind that the cost of any given unit as compared to a Lazy Daze of the same vintage will be higher - by a lot! Virtual hugs, Judie 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #14 – October 21, 2017, 01:23:35 pm “They were bought out by Forest River.... build quality has gone downhill.“He said in the original post that he didn’t think they would buy new. So may be able to find a used Dynamax prior to the Forest River buy out.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #15 – October 21, 2017, 05:09:17 pm Reading this thread with great interest as we still go back and forth between LD and a quality class B. Pleasure Way is another RVCG highly rated RV that is on my research list. 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #16 – October 21, 2017, 05:52:46 pm Also check the German company that bought Roadtrek, Hymer. They are a giant European RV concern that builds good quality motor homes with some interesting ideas you may not see from North American companies.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #17 – October 21, 2017, 05:59:02 pm "Also check the German company that bought Roadtrek, Hymer. They are a giant European RV concern that builds good quality motor homes with some interesting ideas you may not see from North American companies. "Please, please, please . . . do VERY careful due diligence and research. The thought seems to be that their quality etc. in Europe did not translate. It was easier to slip into "shoddy mode". Virtual hugs, Judie 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #18 – October 21, 2017, 11:23:24 pm We too have looked seriously at the "B" class vans before our LD and still would like to find one the same or like one we saw 3 years ago. It was on a sprinter chasses and had a rear bath with a central bed which folded down so you slept forward and back and not head to side and feet to other side. I can't find anything like it now! Karen~Liam 26 ~ MB
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #19 – October 22, 2017, 09:27:47 am Quote from: Karen & Liam - October 21, 2017, 11:23:24 pm It was on a sprinter chasses and had a rear bath with a central bed which folded down so you slept forward and back and not head to side and feet to other side. Can you describe where the bed folded down from? The only Murphy bed models I've seen have the bed fold from the side wall so you sleep across the van, not down the centerline.
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #20 – October 22, 2017, 12:50:21 pm Quote from: Karen & Liam - October 21, 2017, 11:23:24 pmWe too have looked seriously at the "B" class vans before our LD and still would like to find one the same or like one we saw 3 years ago. It was on a sprinter chasses and had a rear bath with a central bed which folded down so you slept forward and back and not head to side and feet to other side. I can't find anything like it now! Karen~Liam 26 ~ MBThis one, perhaps?Plateau XLMB - Pleasure-Way Industries 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #21 – October 22, 2017, 02:15:25 pm We test drove the sprinter about 3 years ago. The bathroom was in the rear with a separate shower which st reached ac cross the whole back with an internal sliding door. Just in front, forward of the bathroom was two couches which faced each other and ran about 6'4" long front to back along each wall. The interesting thing was that the upper part of the back shushing folded over and down on two metal arms so that when the bottom cushion was pulled out which was also on arms the top part filled in between both couches to make a full vehicle width bed which was queen size or a little larger and was 6"4" long. Then in front forward of the couches was the sink and stove two burner and ac cross was the door and a small cabinet. The way the coach was designed you could just pull out one bed if that was all you needed and drive with The bathroom door open to see behind you. Best part there was no window restrictions like in the side bathroom models, full view made it feel very open. We may plan to outfit a sprinter van if we can not find one we like and this is how we would do it. Karen~Liam 26 ~ MB
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #22 – October 22, 2017, 06:37:54 pm Have you checked out sprinter-source.com forums? Best resource for self conversions. There are also good forums for Transits and Promasters. There are some great ideas out there to make a conversion that suits your specific needs.I wanted to like a Sprinter van, but the sharp increase in reliability issues as they have worked to make their diesel pass EPA was alarming. Many nice features though. 1 Likes
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #23 – October 23, 2017, 07:54:47 am Thanks very much to everyone who replied to my inquiry. I've put all comments in one document and sent it to my friends for their information. There's plenty of really good information to help them know what to consider, expect, and perhaps avoid with regard to Class B's if that's the way they choose to go. Bill
Re: Class B suggestions? Reply #24 – October 23, 2017, 10:07:14 am We looked into the Sprinter van a few years back and learned a few things.1) not all MB dealers will work on the Sprinters so call around before you buy to see where you will have to go for service.2) when you drive your Mercedes$$$ into a Mercedes$$$ dealer leave your small checkbook at home; you won’t need it. Bring the big one. 😩Just for grins, call and ask how much they charge for a Sprinter oil change (called Service A.) Likely in the $200 to $300 range.We went with the Baby Daze instead. Ford parts and service are available just about anywhere in North America. Not so with a MB. 3 Likes
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