Winterizing with compressed air tips

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Winterizing with compressed air tips

February 08, 2017, 12:29:15 pm

Hi folks,

I'm getting ready to unwinterize my system (after 8 years of RV antifreeze in the system)

My timing is not so good (being in NH in Feb -;)

Anyways, I wanted to prep myself with fitting for using an air compressor next time. I found an old post by Yonder with a T-connection, ball valve, and permanent compressor fitting. Sounds like what I want to do.

So my question to Bumper (or anyone else) is "is there an easy way to handle the pump itself". Will air blow that out too (I'm assuming not if the T-connection is on the output side). Must I remove the pump (seems like a pain).

Open to any suggestions and tips re: the pump or the process in general.

Oh, and I also welcome any tips for dealing with the fact that there has been RV antifreeze in the system all this time, including the heater.

Thanks much in advance,

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #1 – February 08, 2017, 02:43:58 pm

Hello Steve.

I use the blow-out procedure exactly as stated in the owners manual. I have never put Pink Stuff in the system. If your 2000 manual doesn't have a detailed section, let me know and I'll get you a copy of mine.
In addition to what the book says.
Remove all the aeration screens from the faucets, plus remove the shower head, toilet sprayer head, etc before you start using the compressed air. That will keep crud from blocking things up when the lines are blown out.
I put Pink Stuff in the toilet bowl to keep the seal wet.
I also pour some Pink Stuff down all the sink/shower drains.
Come spring time, I do the bleach treatment. Since your rig has set for a long time, I would certainly do it. That would likely remove any remaining Pink Stuff from the system. If you did the air winterizing procedure now, that should clear all the residue and general crud from the system.

Here is a picture of the pump blow out fitting I bought from LD. You could probably make something like this. It attaches to the fresh water line downstream of the pump. That is, the line attached to the pump that does not have the filter bowl.

Any specific questions, let me know.

Ed

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #2 – February 08, 2017, 07:42:41 pm

Steve, you know what's coming your way weather-wise, don't you?

But back on-topic, what's the "target" air pressure to use, so that it's aggressive enough to blow things out, but not blow things up?
This past fall, I had trouble getting the heater to pump line clear for some reason...

Chip

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #3 – February 08, 2017, 09:22:27 pm

Quote from: Chip Chester - February 08, 2017, 07:42:41 pm

Steve, you know what's coming your way weather-wise, don't you?

But back on-topic, what's the "target" air pressure to use, so that it's aggressive enough to blow things out, but not blow things up?
This past fall, I had trouble getting the heater to pump line clear for some reason...

Chip

The LD owners manual recommends 50 psi.
Ed

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #4 – February 09, 2017, 12:06:35 am

Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp - February 08, 2017, 12:29:15 pm

I'm getting ready to unwinterize my system (after 8 years of RV antifreeze in the system)

Can't you put water in the tank and run the pump until the water comes out clean? That's how I clean the pink stuff out of my plumbing after the winter - easy, quick.

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #5 – February 09, 2017, 04:46:02 am

Quote from: Ed D. - February 08, 2017, 02:43:58 pm

Hello Steve.

I use the blow-out procedure exactly as stated in the owners manual. I have never put Pink Stuff in the system. If your 2000 manual doesn't have a detailed section, let me know and I'll get you a copy of mine.
In addition to what the book says.
Remove all the aeration screens from the faucets, plus remove the shower head, toilet sprayer head, etc before you start using the compressed air. That will keep crud from blocking things up when the lines are blown out.
I put Pink Stuff in the toilet bowl to keep the seal wet.
I also pour some Pink Stuff down all the sink/shower drains.
Come spring time, I do the bleach treatment. Since your rig has set for a long time, I would certainly do it. That would likely remove any remaining Pink Stuff from the system. If you did the air winterizing procedure now, that should clear all the residue and general crud from the system.

Here is a picture of the pump blow out fitting I bought from LD. You could probably make something like this. It attaches to the fresh water line downstream of the pump. That is, the line attached to the pump that does not have the filter bowl.

Any specific questions, let me know.

Ed

Hi Ed, I hope all is well. Thanks for the feedback. I've bought the parts to make a blowout "T" connection. Looks pretty straightforward.

So far we have drained the old antifreeze, and flushed with water and a bleach solution. More flushing will be needed.

Amazingly, to me, the old pump and water heater seem to be working fine. Gotta give LD kudos for the build quality and thank you for your maintenance of this rig.

And Chip, yes, unfortunately last week's forecast showed warm temps and rain, but mother nature changed her mind, and this has now turned into a big snow storm due today. Too much to do to beat it, so we will have to hunker down. I feel confident if Thistle Dew Too gets us through this, we'll get through anything on the road ;-)

Thanks all,

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #6 – February 09, 2017, 04:52:37 am

Quote from: Eric Greenwell - February 09, 2017, 12:06:35 am

Can't you put water in the tank and run the pump until the water comes out clean? That's how I clean the pink stuff out of my plumbing after the winter - easy, quick.

Hi Eric,

Yes, that's what we did. I was just looking for my "next" winterizing approach. ;-)

I'm also learning how much flushing will be needed just to get all the residual antifreeze (which still seems a little "foamy" on the hot water side) out of the water system. So I was inquiring as to whether anyone had any tips for dealing with antifreeze that had been a system for so long.

Barring any other suggestions, once we get to a warmer location with water, we'll just flush and flush the system. Until then, we're trying to keep the RV warm enough to make it through this next storm.

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #7 – February 09, 2017, 06:56:47 am

Hi Steve & Carol,

"I'm also learning how much flushing will be needed just to get all the residual antifreeze (which still seems a little "foamy" on the hot water side) out of the water system. So I was inquiring as to whether anyone had any tips for dealing with antifreeze that had been a system for so long

I winterize with rv antifreeze too but I installed a water heater bypass kit to avoid filling the water heater with the pink juice.
I think it is very difficult to remove all liquid from the water heater; it seems that when I drain the tank, there is always a bit of water in the bottom of the tank (below the drain plug . When I winterize, I try to raise the opposite side with my leveling blocks to try and drain as much as I can out of the tank. Then I take a short drive with the drain plug removed to slosh the rest of it out. What I'm trying to say is despite flushing and rinsing, you probably didn't get all the pink juice out.

My experience with de-winterizing is that even after clearing the lines with water, using the sanitizing solution of water and bleach, it will take a couple showers before the "foamy" sensation disappears.

Good luck,
Steve K. (In Ohio watching the snow fall that is heading your direction)

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #8 – February 09, 2017, 07:10:27 am

Quote from: Steve K. - February 09, 2017, 06:56:47 am

I think it is very difficult to remove all liquid from the water heater; it seems that when I drain the tank, there is always a bit of water in the bottom of the tank (below the drain plug . When I winterize, I try to raise the opposite side with my leveling blocks to try and drain as much as I can out of the tank. Then I take a short drive with the drain plug removed to slosh the rest of it out. What I'm trying to say is despite flushing and rinsing, you probably didn't get all the pink juice out.

My experience with de-winterizing is that even after clearing the lines with water, using the sanitizing solution of water and bleach, it will take a couple showers before the "foamy" sensation disappears.

Hi Steve,

This sounds right to me. I noticed when I started to purge the water heater, at first I only got water and not antifreeze, so it seems clear that the drain plug really isn't at the bottom. An unfortunate design flaw by Atwood, it seems. May make the compressed air approach I plan to use a bit more sporty, though I was given a tip about that (building up air pressure in the HWH for the final push out of a faucet). So we will see how that goes in the future.

And thanks for the explanation of why to expect "foam" for a while. That will save me from wasting too many brain cells worrying about the first week or so. Or while worrying, I might have also been killing them, by trying to drown my sorrow with some vino ;-)

Thanks a lot for the feedback,

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #9 – February 09, 2017, 11:01:49 pm

Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp - February 09, 2017, 07:10:27 am

An unfortunate design flaw by Atwood, it seems.

I don't think it's a flaw. The water has plenty of room to expand as ice without putting any force on the tank, and nobody seems to have problems with Atwoods if they winterize by simply opening the plug and draining. I've had Atwood heaters for 30 years, no problems with freeze damage (or anything actually, except for the hornet that built a nest in one once).

My wife thinks the foamy stuff is icky, but I can't taste, smell, or feel anything, so it doesn't bother me, and it goes away after day or two of usage. Normally, I winterize with air pressure, but if I have to do it while traveling, the RV antifreeze is quick and easy, and doesn't take any equipment. My hot water tank doe have bypass valves.

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #10 – February 10, 2017, 06:10:17 am

Quote from: Eric Greenwell - February 09, 2017, 11:01:49 pm

I don't think it's a flaw. The water has plenty of room to expand as ice without putting any force on the tank, and nobody seems to have problems with Atwoods if they winterize by simply opening the plug and draining. I've had Atwood heaters for 30 years, no problems with freeze damage (or anything actually, except for the hornet that built a nest in one once).

Fair point Eric. And as I said before, I'm amazed the darn thing is still working after sitting with antifreeze for 8 years. Oh, and it fired right up after two or three tries. Amazing.

But thanks for emphasizing this point, as I guess I do not need to worry about this issue. And right now, at 3.2 degrees (F) in NH with over a foot of snow draping ThistleDewToo, I'll take any good news I can. I'm including a quick snapshot halfway through the storm yesterday.

Did I mention that was halfway through the storm? And that it is currently the same temperature as my freezer outside?

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #11 – February 10, 2017, 08:51:29 am

For the first 9 years of owning a Lazy Daze I winterized by using the air compression method. But this past Fall I came across another method shown in a video I'll link to below. Imagine my surprise when I went to look at the water pump in my 2003 MB and realized that a previous owner (probably the original owner who lived in Montana, I believe) had put a valve in the water line going into the water pump with an extra piece of hose coming out from it. It made winterizing with this method incredibly easy and seems to indicate it's how the original owner winterized the rig. Here's the method:

Winterizing Your RV - All

Basically this is the process:

1. Turn off the water pump and make sure the hot water heater is turned off.

2. Drain the water tank and the hot water heater.

3. Open all the faucets, shower, and flush the toilet to drain all the
possible water reservoirs in the RV.

3. Close all the faucets and the valves on the water tank and hot water
heater.

4. Hook up the water pump to a jug of RV antifreeze. (He shows you how
in the video.)

5. As soon as it starts pumping, starting with the closest faucet, turn
it open and watch to see the pink come through and then close the
faucet. Move to the next faucet, valve, etc. and as the pink comes
through, close it.

6. Pour about 1 cup of RV antifreeze down the drains.

7. Drain the gray and black holding tanks, allowing enough time for the
water to drain out of the valve area.

~Fern

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #12 – February 10, 2017, 01:44:30 pm

Thanks for the video link Fern. A couple of questions if I might.

While that does seem easy, I'm wondering why you chose that over the compressed air method which seems even easier (if I understand it correctly).

Also, on the video there was a drain for the plumbing at a designed low point (on the SOB trailer). Do you know if there is such a drain on the LDs?

Thanks again for sharing your experiences.

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #13 – February 10, 2017, 08:24:59 pm

I don't recall that part. Are you sure he wasn't referring to the drain in the fresh water tank?

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #14 – February 11, 2017, 12:07:49 am

Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp - February 10, 2017, 01:44:30 pm

Also, on the video there was a drain for the plumbing at a designed low point (on the SOB trailer). Do you know if there is such a drain on the LDs?

There are no "low point" drains on an LD's pressurized water lines.
This is a feature seen on many Canadian RVs, which are usually better built for winter use and winterizing..

All LDs have fresh water drains.

Larry

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #15 – February 12, 2017, 02:19:37 am

Quote from: Larry Wade - February 11, 2017, 12:07:49 am

There are no "low point" drains on an LD's pressurized water lines.
This is a feature seen on many Canadian RVs, which are usually better built for winter use and winterizing..

All LDs have fresh water drains.

Larry

Thanks Larry. That's what I figured since nothing was mentioned in the manual.

And since you may know, let me ask you about the compressed air method. If I put a "T" with a ball valve in the line coming out of the pump (ala Bumper), what needs to be done to make sure the pump itself is protected? Hoping there may be an easy and reliable method. I like how Bumper's set up can remain in place. Open to any observations/suggestions regarding the pump when using this method.

Thanks,

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #16 – February 12, 2017, 06:40:34 pm

Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp - February 10, 2017, 06:10:17 am

Did I mention that was halfway through the storm? And that it is currently the same temperature as my freezer outside?

So, the picture below shows what it looked like the day after the storm. At least we get sun and blue skies after big storms in NH.

And we have another 12-18" falling as I type. I *really* should have hit the road a week ago

S-

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #17 – February 12, 2017, 09:15:30 pm

Quote from: Steve and Carol Crisp - February 10, 2017, 01:44:30 pm

Thanks for the video link Fern. A couple of questions if I might.

While that does seem easy, I'm wondering why you chose that over the compressed air method which seems even easier (if I understand it correctly).

Somehow I missed seeing/answering this part of your post. My apologies!

I found this method to be much easier and far less time consuming than the compressed air method. It always took quite a bit of time to get all the air out of the lines, while with this method, the pump quickly pulled the antifreeze through to the faucets and that was it. I literally had to dash from one to the next to close them so as to not waste more antifreeze than necessary. I then poured some down each drain and that was it. The most time consuming part was draining the water heater and fresh water tanks first.

I can take a picture of the valve/hose that was installed just in front of the pump, if that would help you out any.

Re: Winterizing with compressed air tips

Reply #18 – February 13, 2017, 07:31:54 am

Quote from: Fern - February 12, 2017, 09:15:30 pm

Somehow I missed seeing/answering this part of your post. My apologies!

I found this method to be much easier and far less time consuming than the compressed air method. It always took quite a bit of time to get all the air out of the lines, while with this method, the pump quickly pulled the antifreeze through to the faucets and that was it. I literally had to dash from one to the next to close them so as to not waste more antifreeze than necessary. I then poured some down each drain and that was it. The most time consuming part was draining the water heater and fresh water tanks first.

I can take a picture of the valve/hose that was installed just in front of the pump, if that would help you out any.

Thanks for taking the time for the additional reply. Having not yet used the compressed air method, I'd didn't realize it would take that much time to push out the water through each faucet.

I think I will try that for my next winterizing attempt. And if that doesn't work, or seems to be too much trouble, will give your recommended method a go. I do worry a bit about getting the water out of the pump using the compressed air method, which of course is not an issue with antifreeze.

Sure, a picture is always worth a 1000 words, so if it is not too much trouble, I'd be interested, as might others.

S-

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February 08, 2017, 12:29:15 pm

Reply #1 – February 08, 2017, 02:43:58 pm

Reply #2 – February 08, 2017, 07:42:41 pm

Reply #3 – February 08, 2017, 09:22:27 pm

Reply #4 – February 09, 2017, 12:06:35 am

Reply #5 – February 09, 2017, 04:46:02 am

Reply #6 – February 09, 2017, 04:52:37 am

Reply #7 – February 09, 2017, 06:56:47 am

Reply #8 – February 09, 2017, 07:10:27 am

Reply #9 – February 09, 2017, 11:01:49 pm

Reply #10 – February 10, 2017, 06:10:17 am

Reply #11 – February 10, 2017, 08:51:29 am

Reply #12 – February 10, 2017, 01:44:30 pm

Reply #13 – February 10, 2017, 08:24:59 pm

Reply #14 – February 11, 2017, 12:07:49 am

Reply #15 – February 12, 2017, 02:19:37 am

Reply #16 – February 12, 2017, 06:40:34 pm

Reply #17 – February 12, 2017, 09:15:30 pm

Reply #18 – February 13, 2017, 07:31:54 am

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